Tony Rodrigues : 自身の 20年間の極秘宇宙計画の生活を語る

前置き

Tony Rodrigues の証言については幾度も過去記事で取り上げた。今回は彼の 2時間のインタビューを AI で整理した。

彼の体験は事実ではありえない（多数の証拠がある）が、どういうわけで彼がこういった体験を主張するに至ったのか、それに興味がある。

概要

AI

暴露された秘密宇宙計画

このソースは、ホストのジミー・チャーチがゲストのトニー・ロドリゲスと、極秘宇宙プログラムに参加したとされる彼の経験について語る‌‌ポッドキャストの文字起こし‌‌です。

トニーは、10歳で地球外生命体によって‌‌意識を借りられ‌‌、20年間秘密のプログラムに従事した後、元の場所に戻されたと主張しています。彼は、月や火星、小惑星帯の準惑星セレスでの‌‌任務、遠隔視‌‌、そして地球外生命体との‌‌貿易ミッション‌‌を詳細に語ります。

この対話は、科学における‌‌国家安全保障の隠蔽工作‌‌、特に‌‌天文データの検閲‌‌に関する考察を深め、宇宙における生命の広大さと‌‌意識技術‌‌の可能性について議論します。

目次

1. 前置き
2. 概要
3. 詳細
   1. 1. トニー・ロドリゲス氏のSSP経験の概要
   2. 2. SSPでの役割と活動
   3. 3. ET文明と宇宙の現状
   4. 4. 記憶と軍事検閲の性質
   5. 5. SSP暴露とディスクロージャーへの見解
   6. 結論
4. 記憶の回復
5. 幼少期の興味
6. 不本意な徴兵（1982年）
7. 秘密宇宙計画での経験
8. 方法開示と ET 生命
   1. 情報開示（ディスクロージャー）について
   2. ET生命について
9. Tony Todrigues の活動
10. FAQ
11. 時系列
12. 主要関係者
13. 情報源
14. 文字起こし

詳細

AI

要約書：「暴露された秘密宇宙計画」と「秘密の宇宙計画と記憶の回復」

主要テーマと重要な事実

本ブリーフィング文書は、ポッドキャスト「Ep. 2194 Tony Rodrigues Project Starmaker」の前半部分「暴露された秘密宇宙計画」および後半部分「秘密の宇宙計画と記憶の回復」の内容を要約したものです。このポッドキャストでは、トニー・ロドリゲス氏が自身の「秘密宇宙計画」（Secret Space Program, SSP）への関与と、それに伴う記憶回復の経験について詳細に語っています。

1. トニー・ロドリゲス氏のSSP経験の概要

• 「意識の借用」と20年間のプログラム: ロドリゲス氏は1982年、10歳の時にグレイ型ETとレプティリアン型ETによって拉致されたと主張しています。彼らはロドリゲス氏の「意識を20年間借りる」ことを求め、その間、元の体は元の場所に戻され、20年後に元の状態に戻されると説明しました。「キャリアリターンプログラム」と称し、彼の同意を得たと述べています。彼はこの経験について、クローン体への意識の移動が行われた可能性を推測しています。
• 「彼は言いました、『我々は君の意識を20年間借りたい』と。（中略）『君は元の体に戻されて、20年長く生きることになる。』」("He said, 'We want to borrow your consciousness for 20 years.' (…)'You're going to come right back the next day. You're going to get the most valuable thing you can get. It's more time on your life. You're going to live 20 years longer than you would have.'")
• 記憶の回復: ロドリゲス氏は、2015年にMRIスキャンを受けた後、記憶が戻り始めたと述べています。それまではフロア研磨工として普通の生活を送っていましたが、ランディ・クレイマーのインタビューを見て、自身の経験がSSPと関連していることに気づきました。
• 「MRIスキャンを受けた。約10日後、偶然にもランディ・クレイマーのインタビューを見て、それが説明された。ずっと持っていた意味不明な記憶の束が、突然、『ああ、神よ、あれが彼らのしたことだったんだ』となった。彼らは私を拘束していたんだ。」("I got an MRI scan on my head. And about 10 days later, coincidentally saw the Randy Kramer interview that explained it. And a bunch of memories that didn't make sense that I had all along. All of a sudden, I went, 'Oh, God, that's what they did. They kept me.'")
• 経験の検証: 記憶回復後、彼はその裏付けとなる証拠を個人的に探し続け、特に遠隔透視（remote viewing）に関する機密解除文書など、彼の記憶を裏付ける多くの証拠を見つけたと主張しています。
• 「時が経つにつれて、私がその時思い出した多くのことが検証されてきた。（中略）私は今でもそれについて話している。」("And time has validated many of the things that I remembered back then. (…) I'm still here talking about it.")

2. SSPでの役割と活動

• 初期の任務（地球上）:
  • イニョカーン、カリフォルニア: プログラムの最初の場所はイニョカーン、カリフォルニアの陸軍INSCOMのプロジェクト「グリルフレイム」の最終段階だったと述べています。
  • シアトル: その後、シアトルで私的に所有される期間があり、薬物を投与されながら遠隔透視を行っていたと主張しています。
  • ペルーでの麻薬密輸: ペルーでは、コカイン密輸業者の「早期警戒システム」として2年間、遠隔透視能力を使って活動しました。彼曰く、中国が子供の遠隔透視能力に有効な結果を出したという1979年の論文の研究に似た内容です。
• 秘密宇宙計画への参加（宇宙）:
  • 月面基地での訓練: 10歳の時に、軍事輸送機で月面基地に連れて行かれ、複数の手術を受け、サポート兵士としての訓練を受けたと述べています。この月面基地は、ペンタゴンの設計を応用して建設されており、人工重力装置「グラビマチン」が使用されていました。
• 火星での戦闘: 火星に派遣され、大型昆虫型生命体と交戦しました。このプログラムは、昆虫型生命体の適応能力が予想よりも速かったため中止されたと語っています。
  • 「私はサポート兵士として訓練され、火星に行った。ハイキング任務を行い、これらの生物と交戦していた。」("I was trained as a support soldier and I went to Mars. And we were doing hiking missions and engaging these things.")
  • セレスでの船の整備: 火星の地下都市で再訓練を受け、「セレスコロニーコーポレーション」の船の整備士として約8年間働きました。セレスは重力が非常に低い惑星ですが、人工重力によって内部は地球と同様の環境でした。
• 星間貿易船の貨物技師: 最後の2～3年間は貨物技師に昇進し、星間貿易船に乗務しました。この船はET種からリースされたもので、地球製の物品（衣類、コーヒー、医薬品、軍用ブーツなど）を積んで他の文明と取引していました。
  • 「我々の任務は、新生命や新文明を大胆に探し求めることではなかった。それが任務ではなかった。」("Our mission was not to boldly go and seek out new life and new civilization. That was not the mission.") ロドリゲス氏は、この貿易は技術獲得を主な目的としており、必要であれば「嘘をつき、騙し、盗む」ことも辞さなかったと述べています。

3. ET文明と宇宙の現状

• ET種の多様性: 宇宙には膨大な数のET種が存在し、地球を訪れているのはメディアで語られるような77種などではなく、数万種以上に及ぶ可能性が高いと推測しています。
• 「地球は20億年間居住可能だった。（中略）この惑星を訪れた知的地球外生命体は、20億年間で、あるいは過去100年間で、どれだけの数になるだろうか？私はその数は膨大だと考える。77種ではない。何万種、あるいはそれ以上でなければならない。」("Earth has been habitable for 2 billion years. (…). How many intelligent species of extraterrestrials have visited this planet in 2 billion years or in the last 100 years? I would say that number is huge. It's not 77 races. It's got to be in the tens of thousands or bigger.")
• 瞬間的な宇宙旅行: ロドリゲス氏は、高度な文明は銀河の3分の1の距離を瞬時に移動し、充電後に再び移動できる技術を持っていると述べています。地球の政府もこのレベルの技術を持っていると主張しています。
• 「これらの種は、あるレベルに達すると、そして人間も同様に、私たちの政府もこのレベルの技術に到達しているが、銀河の3分の1の距離を瞬時に移動し、その後、充電して再び行うことができる。」("But the reality is, is that these species, once they get to a level and even humans have, like our government has got to this level of technology. They can instantly go a third of the distance across the galaxy and then instantly wait a minute, recharge and do it again.")
• 地球外生命体の介入: 地球の宇宙プログラムや地元ET種は、他の高度なET種が太陽系に侵入するのを完全に阻止することはできないと説明しています。そのため、地球は常に様々な文明からの訪問を受けており、彼らは「必要なものを手に入れるため」に訪れることが多いが、必ずしも敵対的ではない場合が多いとのことです。
• 宇宙における貿易システム: 宇宙ステーションには、技術を取引するための「掲示板システム」が存在し、ET種がそこで取引の機会を掲載すると語っています。
• セレスの光点: セレスのオカトル・クレーターで観測された明るい光点について、NASAが当初硫黄と他の物質の混合物と発表したのに対し、ロドリゲス氏はそれが塩であると主張しました。そして、4年後にNASAが塩であることを確認したことは、彼の宇宙での経験を裏付ける重要な証拠であると語っています。
• 「（中略）私はセレスのオカトルクレーターで明るい光点について、NASAが硫黄と他のカクテルだと発表する4年前に、それが塩であることを知っていた。」("When the Dawn Probe was getting there in early 16, I believe... I could be wrong. When it was getting there, I was working with Dr. Sala from exopolitics.org, and he was researching me and pinging against other people. And he said, Tony, NASA says that it's not... You said it's salt, because it's a geyser.")

4. 記憶と軍事検閲の性質

• 記憶の削除技術: SSPでは、記憶の削除技術が用いられており、特に初期の経験では最初の30分間の記憶は消されなかったものの、その後は高度な催眠術と化学物質の注射によって詳細な記憶が消去されたと語っています。この技術は時間とともに進化し、90年代の被験者からは断片的な記憶しか得られないことが多いと指摘しています。
• 「記憶のプロセスは、私が最後に経験したことを思い出すと、まるで産業レベルの催眠術だった。」("And the memory process, when I remember what they were putting me through at the end, it was like industrial-grade hypnosis.")
• 記憶回復のプロセス: 記憶を回復させるためには、感情的な要素に焦点を当てることや、朝一番に記憶を思い出す努力をすることが有効だと述べています。ロドリゲス氏は自身のウェブサイトで記憶回復に関するコースを提供しています。
• 軍事による科学データの検閲: 米空軍が天体望遠鏡のソフトウェアを開発しており、望遠鏡のオペレーターが気付かないうちに、特定の天体のデータを削除できると主張しています。これにより、国家安全保障の名の下に、科学的なデータが改ざんされている可能性を指摘しています。
• 「空軍がすべてのソフトウェアを作成しており、それは望遠鏡が記録するオブジェクトを、オペレーターに知らせずに削除することができる。（中略）したがって、データは信頼できない。」("And it can delete any object it wants. So the operator doesn't even see it. And so data can't be trusted.")
• 一般の懐疑論と証言の信憑性: ロドリゲス氏は、自身の証言が信じがたいものであることを認めつつも、その経験の真実性を強く主張しています。彼は、記憶の削除や断片的な記憶のために、証言が「おかしく」聞こえることがあると説明し、懐疑的な人々には「少しの余地を与えるべきだ」と訴えています。

5. SSP暴露とディスクロージャーへの見解

• デイビッド・グラッシュ証言の重要性: デイビッド・グラッシュ氏が議会でUFOについて証言したことは、機密の壁に「大きな亀裂」を生み出したと評価しています。しかし、その証言は「火星の植民地」や「セレスの植民地」といったより深いSSPの現実を明かす準備ができていないレベルにあると考えています。
• 将来のディスクロージャー: ロドリゲス氏は、人類は近い将来、SSPとET生命に関するディスクロージャーを経験すると信じています。彼の見解では、多くの人々がアマチュアの天体観測によって異常な現象を目撃する可能性があり、政府はそれを完全に隠蔽することができなくなると考えています。
• 「私たちは、宇宙プログラムと地球外生命体の開示のタイムラインに乗っていると考えている。」("And I think that's why we're on a timeline for a disclosure of the space programs and of extraterrestrial life.")

結論

トニー・ロドリゲス氏の証言は、秘密宇宙計画の存在、ET種との交流、高度な技術（人工重力、記憶削除、瞬間的な宇宙旅行）、そして軍事による情報操作といった、UAP/UFO現象と地球外生命体に関する非常に複雑で広範な主張を提示しています。彼の経験は、公に知られている科学的理解や歴史とは大きく異なる代替的な現実を示唆しており、既存の知識体系への挑戦となっています。

彼自身の証言の検証は困難であるものの、記憶の回復プロセスやET文明の多様性に関する彼の詳細な説明は、この分野の研究者や一般の人々にとって重要な考察材料となります。特に、軍事による情報統制の指摘は、公式情報源の信頼性に対する疑問を提起し、より深い調査とオープンな議論の必要性を示唆しています。

記憶の回復

AI

トニー・ロドリゲスの証言における記憶の回復は、彼が極秘宇宙プログラム（SSP）や地球外生命体との交流中に経験した20年間の記憶が消去され、その後それらを取り戻したという彼の中心的な主張を形成しています。

記憶の消去と回復のプロセスは、ソースによると以下の通りです。

• ‌‌強制的な記憶消去と「意識の借用」‌‌

  • ロドリゲスは1982年に10歳で拉致され、秘密プログラムに採用されました。
  • 彼は、地球外生命体（グレイとレプティリアン）に、自分の「意識を20年間借りて」助けてほしいと言われたと記憶しています。彼らは、彼を翌日には元の場所に戻し、20年分の時間を「おまけ」として与えるため、20年長く生きられると説明しました。
  • このプロセスには手術が含まれ、その後にカリフォルニア州イニョカーンで目覚めたときには、ミシガンでの家族との記憶が一切ありませんでした。
  • 彼は、この経験から、彼らが彼をクローン化し、そのクローンに彼の意識を移動させた可能性が高いと推測しています。プログラム中に負傷した際も、意識が別の体に移動した可能性があると感じています。
  • 20年間のプログラムの終了時には、SSPでの記憶が消去され、元の体に戻されたかのように、以前の記憶を取り戻しました。

• ‌‌記憶回復のトリガーと初期段階‌‌

  • ロドリゲスは、2015年にMRIスキャンを受けた約10日後、偶然見たランディ・クレイマーのインタビューによって、一連の記憶が戻ってきたと述べています。MRIが「記憶が展開するためのファイル」のようなものを作ったのかもしれないと彼は推測しています。
  • 当初、彼は「大きな出来事」しか覚えておらず、日々のルーティン（歯磨き、風呂、食事など）の記憶は欠落していました。ジミー・チャーチは、日常生活の「些細なこと」を覚えていないのは普通のことだと指摘し、共感を示しました。
  • ロドリゲスは、自身の記憶回復を裏付けるために何年も研究を行い、自分で証明しようとしました。

• ‌‌記憶回復を促進する要因と課題‌‌

  • ‌‌「眠気」の克服‌‌: 記憶を取り戻そうとすると、眠くなったり、無関心になったり、空腹になったり、落ち込んだりする現象に直面しました。これは、記憶を抑制するための意図的な「対抗措置」だったと彼は見ています。朝一番に記憶について考えることで、この「眠気」を乗り越え、より多くの詳細を思い出すことができました。
  • ‌‌感情的なアンカー‌‌: 21歳の誕生日や氷河の水を飲んだ体験など、強い感情的な文脈を持つ記憶は、より鮮明に思い出すことができます。彼は、感情に焦点を当てることで、他の記憶の扉を開くことができると述べています。
  • ‌‌話すことの効果‌‌: 公の場で自分の経験について頻繁に話すことで、さらに多くの記憶が戻ってくると彼は言います。
  • ‌‌記憶消去技術の進化‌‌: ロドリゲスは、1980年代初頭に拉致された人々は多くの記憶を取り戻しているのに対し、1990年代中頃に拉致された人々は、記憶消去技術が向上したため、ごくわずかな断片しか覚えていないようだと指摘しています。
  • ‌‌記憶消去プロセス‌‌: 彼は、記憶消去が「工業グレードの催眠」であり、特定の脳領域に化学物質を注射し、その後、名前や顔などの特定の種類の記憶を消去するための催眠映像を見せるプロセスであったと詳細に述べています。これは一回の投薬ではなく、段階的なプロセスでした。
  • ‌‌研究者との協力‌‌: 他の「経験者」との交流や研究が、彼の記憶を整理し、彼がさらされた技術を逆行分析するのに役立ちました。

• ‌‌記憶回復の証拠と信頼性‌‌

  • ロドリゲスは、自分の記憶を裏付ける数多くの証拠を発見しており、これらは彼が知り得なかった情報を含んでいます。
  • 特に、セレスの「明るい斑点」が塩であると、NASAが正式に確認する4年前に彼が予言したことは、彼の宇宙での経験を裏付ける最大の証拠の一つだと彼は考えています。
  • 彼は、懐疑的な人々に対して、記憶が消去された経験者の話には「真実の断片」が含まれている可能性があり、彼らは嘘をついているのではなく、記憶の断片をつなぎ合わせようとしているだけだと理解を求めています。
  • 彼は、自分のウェブサイトで「記憶回復コース」を提供しており、同じような経験を持つ人々を助けています。

全体として、トニー・ロドリゲスの記憶回復の物語は、極秘プログラムにおける高度な記憶操作技術の存在を強く示唆するとともに、その影響を経験した人々がどのようにして真実を再構築しようと奮闘しているかを示しています。彼の証言は、個人的な経験と、公にされていない政府や軍の秘密、そして未解明の科学技術との間の複雑なつながりを強調しています。トニー・ロドリゲスの証言における記憶の回復は、彼が極秘宇宙プログラム（SSP）や地球外生命体との交流中に経験した20年間の記憶が消去され、その後それらを取り戻したという彼の中心的な主張を形成しています。

ソースによると、記憶の消去と回復のプロセス、およびその文脈は以下の通りです。

• ‌‌初期の拉致と記憶の消去‌‌:

  • ロドリゲスは1982年に10歳で拉致され、秘密プログラムに採用されました。
  • 彼は、地球外生命体（グレイとレプティリアン）が彼の「意識を20年間借りて」助けてほしいと述べたことを記憶しています。彼らは、彼を翌日には元の場所に戻し、20年分の時間を「おまけ」として与えるため、20年長く生きられると説明しました。
  • このプロセスには手術が含まれ、その後にカリフォルニア州イニョカーンで目覚めたときには、ミシガンでの家族との記憶が一切ありませんでした。彼は、プログラム期間中、鏡に映る自分の姿は変わらず、同じ発言を受けていたことから、彼がクローン化され、そのクローンに彼の意識が移動させられた可能性が高いと推測しています。
  • 20年間のプログラムの終了時には、SSPでの記憶が失われ、元の体に戻されたかのように、以前の記憶を取り戻しました。

• ‌‌記憶回復のトリガーとプロセス‌‌:

  • 彼の記憶は2015年に、MRIスキャンを受けた約10日後に偶然見たランディ・クレイマーのインタビューをきっかけに戻り始めました。MRIが「記憶が展開するためのファイル」のようなものを作ったのかもしれないと彼は示唆しています。
  • 当初、彼は「大きな出来事」しか覚えておらず、日々のルーティン（歯磨き、浴室、食事など）の記憶は欠落していました。ジミー・チャーチは、日常生活の「些細なこと」を覚えていないのは普通のことだと指摘し、共感を示しています。
  • ‌‌「眠気」の克服‌‌: 記憶を取り戻そうとすると、眠くなったり、無関心になったり、空腹になったり、落ち込んだりする現象に直面しました。これは、記憶を抑制するための意図的な「対抗措置」だったと彼は見ています。朝一番に記憶について考えることで、この「眠気」を乗り越え、より多くの詳細を思い出すことができました。
  • ‌‌感情的なアンカー‌‌: 21歳の誕生日や氷河の水を飲んだ体験など、強い感情的な文脈を持つ記憶は、より鮮明に思い出すことができると彼は説明します。彼は、感情に焦点を当てることで、他の記憶の扉を開くことができると述べています。
  • ‌‌話すことの効果‌‌: 公の場で自分の経験について頻繁に話すことが、さらに多くの記憶を取り戻すのに役立つと述べています。

• ‌‌記憶消去の技術と課題‌‌:

  • ロドリゲスは、記憶消去技術が完璧ではないと指摘しています。1980年代初頭に拉致された人々は多くの記憶を取り戻しているのに対し、1990年代中頃に拉致された人々は、記憶消去技術が向上したため、ごくわずかな断片しか覚えていないようだと彼は見ています。
  • 記憶消去プロセスは「工業グレードの催眠」であり、特定の脳領域に化学物質を注射し、その後、特定の種類の記憶を消去するための催眠映像を見せるという段階的なものであったと彼は詳細に説明しています。

• ‌‌証言の信頼性と検証‌‌:

  • ロドリゲスは、自身の記憶を裏付ける数多くの証拠を発見しており、これらは彼が知り得なかった情報を含んでいると主張しています。
  • 特に、セレスの「明るい斑点」が塩であると、NASAが公式に確認する4年前に彼が予言したことは、彼の宇宙での経験を裏付ける強力な証拠だと彼は考えています。
  • 彼は、記憶が消去された経験者の話が「奇妙」に聞こえることがあっても、彼らが嘘をついているのではなく、断片的な記憶から真実を再構築しようと奮闘しているだけであると理解を求めています。

トニー・ロドリゲスの記憶回復の物語は、高度な記憶操作技術の存在、そして秘密プログラムの影響を受けた人々が、いかに自身の経験の真実と向き合い、それを再構築しようとしているかを示すものです。彼の証言は、個人的な記憶と、公にされていない政府や軍の秘密、未解明の科学技術との間の複雑なつながりを強調しています。

幼少期の興味

AI

トニー・ロドリゲスの証言における「幼少期の興味」に関して、提供されたソースは彼が極秘宇宙プログラムに徴兵される以前から、地球外生命体（ET）やSFに強い関心を持っていたことを示しています。

具体的な点は以下の通りです。

• ‌‌家族の影響‌‌: ロドリゲスの‌‌母親は「スタートレック」に非常に熱心‌‌で、またSFや心霊話、超常現象にも深く傾倒していました。この母親の影響が、彼が幼少期からSFに興味を持つ主な理由でした。
• ‌‌SFへの傾倒‌‌: 彼自身も「スター・ウォーズ」が公開された1977年以降の‌‌70年代後半から80年代初頭のSFの黄金期‌‌にSF作品に夢中になっていました。この時期のSF作品は、現代のような特殊効果に頼ることができなかったため、物語の執筆に心血が注がれていたと彼は述べています。
• ‌‌地球外生命体への信念‌‌: ロドリゲスはSFへの興味から、‌‌地球外生命体の存在を信じていました‌‌。彼は、学校で星の数を学んだとき、宇宙にはETが存在することが明らかだと感じた、と語っています。何十億もの星があることを考えれば、どこかに生命が存在するという結論に達することは当然だと考えていました。

この幼少期のSFや地球外生命体に対する強い関心と信念は、彼が10歳の時にグレイとレプティリアンの地球外生命体によって強制的に徴兵された際、‌‌恐怖の中にも「ついにエイリアンが実在した」という興奮‌‌を覚えたという彼の初期の反応に繋がります。この幼少期の関心は、彼のその後の極秘宇宙プログラムでの20年間の経験を受け入れる素地となっていたと言えます。

不本意な徴兵（1982年）

AI

トニー・ロドリゲスの証言における「不本意な徴兵（1982年）」は、彼が極秘宇宙プログラム（SSP）に強制的に引き込まれた経緯を指し、彼の20年間のサービスとそれに伴う記憶の消去・回復の物語の始まりを形成しています。

ソースから得られる詳細な情報は以下の通りです。

• ‌‌徴兵の時期と年齢‌‌:

  • ロドリゲスは‌‌1982年に10歳‌‌の時、小学校の‌‌4年生‌‌の時に徴兵されました。
  • これは、彼がミシガン州の田舎の学校に通っていた時でした。

• ‌‌徴兵のきっかけと接触‌‌:

  • 彼は、‌‌傲慢で頭の良い同級生‌‌に「僕のお父さんはイルミナティだ。君のお父さんは何してる？」と挑発されたことを鮮明に覚えています。
  • その同級生の父親は、4月の水曜日に科学フェアの審査員として学校に来て、ロドリゲスを指して「お父さん、僕が話したあの少年だよ」と言いました。
  • その‌‌木曜日の夜‌‌、ロドリゲスの寝室に‌‌グレイの地球外生命体‌‌が現れ、数体の‌‌背の低いレプティリアンの地球外生命体‌‌と共に彼を連れ去りました。
  • 彼は麻痺させられ、ベッドの端まで運ばれ、‌‌光の閃光‌‌の後に意識を失い、ステンレス製のテーブルの上で裸の状態で目覚めました。

• ‌‌「意識の借用」の提案‌‌:

  • 怖がるロドリゲスに対し、彼らは「大丈夫、君を傷つけるつもりはない」と伝え、彼が地球外生命体の存在を信じていたため、彼は突然興奮しました。
  • グレイはレプティリアンに、ロドリゲスに許可を求めるように指示しました。
  • 彼らは「‌‌20年間、君の意識を借りたい‌‌。君の助けが必要だ」と述べました。
  • ロドリゲスは、家族と会えなくなることを懸念しましたが、彼らは「いやいや、‌‌タイムトラベル‌‌があるから、君は翌日すぐに戻ってくる。君は人生で最も貴重なものを手に入れるだろう。それは‌‌20年分の時間‌‌だ。君は20年長く生きるだろう」と説明しました。
  • そして、「私たちのために働いてほしい」と申し出、彼をテストして最適な仕事を見つけると伝えました。ロドリゲスはこれを「‌‌キャリア・リターン・プログラム‌‌」と称し、魅力的に聞こえたと述べています。

• ‌‌直後の展開と記憶の消去‌‌:

  • 彼らはロドリゲスに‌‌手術‌‌を行い、彼はカリフォルニア州イニョカーンで目覚めました。この時、彼は‌‌ミシガンでの家族との記憶が一切ありませんでした‌‌。
  • 彼は、このプロセス中に自分の意識が‌‌クローン‌‌に移動された可能性が高いと推測しています。なぜなら、プログラムの終わりに20年間の記憶を失い、元の身体に戻されたかのように以前の記憶を取り戻したからです。
  • これは彼の20年間にわたる秘密プログラムでの任務の始まりでした。このプログラムには、ペルーでのリモートビューイング、月での訓練、火星でのサポート兵士としての任務、そして小惑星セレスでの船の整備士および貨物エンジニアとしての勤務が含まれます。

このように、トニー・ロドリゲスの不本意な徴兵は、彼の幼少期に突如として始まり、高度な地球外生命体の技術と秘密の政府プログラムによって彼の人生の20年間が完全に再構築された、という彼の中心的な証言の基盤を築いています。

秘密宇宙計画での経験

AI

トニー・ロドリゲスの証言における「秘密の宇宙計画での経験」は、彼が10歳で強制的に徴兵されてから20年間にわたり、地球内外の様々な場所で行われた極秘ミッションと、その後の記憶回復のプロセスを指します。これは彼の証言の核となる部分です。

以下に、ソースから得られる彼の秘密宇宙計画での経験に関する詳細を説明します。

• ‌‌不本意な徴兵と意識の借用‌‌:

  • ロドリゲスは‌‌1982年に10歳‌‌の時、小学校4年生の時に徴兵されました。
  • 彼の寝室に‌‌グレイと背の低いレプティリアンの地球外生命体‌‌が現れ、彼を麻痺させて連れ去りました。
  • 彼は実験室のステンレス製のテーブルで裸で目覚め、そこで彼らは「‌‌20年間、君の意識を借りたい。君の助けが必要だ‌‌」と告げました。
  • 彼らは「タイムトラベルがあるから、翌日には戻ってくる。君は20年長く生きるだろう」と説明し、ロドリゲスはこれを「‌‌キャリア・リターン・プログラム‌‌」と呼び、魅力的に感じたと言います。
  • 彼は、このプロセスで自分の意識が‌‌クローン‌‌に移動された可能性が高いと推測しています。なぜなら、プログラムの終わりに20年間の記憶を失い、元の身体に戻されたかのように以前の記憶を取り戻したからです。彼は任務中に2度、重傷を負った際にも意識が別の体に移動されたと考えています。

• ‌‌最初の配属と訓練‌‌:

  • 徴兵直後、彼はカリフォルニア州イニョカーンで目覚め、そこで陸軍INSCOMの「‌‌プロジェクト・グリルフレイム‌‌」での最初の任務が始まりました。この時、彼はミシガンでの家族の記憶を一切持っていませんでした。
  • その後、シアトルで私的に所有される期間を経て、ペルーに送られました。ペルーでは約2年間、麻薬密輸業者たちの「‌‌リモートビューアー‌‌（遠隔透視者）」として、彼らの早期警戒システムとして働きました。彼はこの期間、10歳から12、13歳でした。
  • リモートビューイングの能力を失った後、彼は再びシアトルに戻り、その後、軍の輸送機で‌‌月の裏側‌‌へと運ばれました。
  • 月では、彼は多くの‌‌手術‌‌を受け、体内にハードウェアを埋め込まれました。彼自身は肺のインプラントがあったと考えています。
  • 彼は‌‌支援兵士‌‌として訓練され、火星に存在する‌‌昆虫型生命体‌‌に対する「数の上での優位性」を確保するための存在として、戦場に投入されることを目的としていました。

• ‌‌火星での任務と再訓練‌‌:

  • 火星では、彼は昆虫型生命体と交戦する‌‌ハイキングミッション‌‌に参加しました。これらの昆虫型生命体は縄張り意識が強く、人類に対して友好的ではありませんでした。
  • しかし、昆虫型生命体が戦略に速く適応したため、このプログラムは中止されました。
  • その後、彼は火星の‌‌地下都市‌‌に送られ、適性検査を受けて「‌‌船のメンテナンス‌‌」担当として再訓練を受けました。

• ‌‌セレスでの任務‌‌:

  • 彼は小惑星‌‌セレスにあるセレス・コロニー・コーポレーション‌‌に配属され、そこで約8年間、‌‌船のメンテナンス‌‌に従事しました。
  • 彼の最初の船は、‌‌改装された古い潜水艦‌‌で、内部は工業用パイプが走り回る海軍の船のようでした。汚れており、窓もなく、移動しているのかどうかも分からず、非常に退屈な「グラウンドホッグ・デー（繰り返しの日々）」のような生活で、彼を自殺願望にまで追い込みました。
  • この船が退役した後、彼はより近代的な船に乗り換えました。これは地球外生命体の種族からリースされたシャシーに、人間用の設備（給水器、バスルーム、調理室など）が取り付けられたものでした。船の前方は豪華でしたが、後方に行くにつれて工業的な見た目になっていました。
  • 彼の最後の2、3年間は「‌‌貨物エンジニア‌‌」として勤務し、この時が彼が「本当の自由」と給料を得た唯一の時期でした。

• ‌‌星間貿易ミッション‌‌:

  • 貨物エンジニアとして、彼は‌‌星間貿易ミッション‌‌に参加しました。
  • 彼らの任務は、あらゆる手段を使って‌‌テクノロジーを獲得する‌‌ことでした。主に貿易を通じてでしたが、時には「‌‌盗む‌‌」こともありました。
  • 彼らは「‌‌あらゆるもの‌‌」を運びました。兵士、50ガロンのドラム缶、服、植物、コーヒー、ミサイルなどです。
  • 最も利益の高い取引品の一つは‌‌医薬品‌‌でした。地球のコーヒー植物が別の惑星で栽培されると、その環境に適応して化学組成が変化し、ユニークな商品となるように、医薬品も同様に取引されました。
  • ロドリゲスは、セレスのコロニーが地下にあるのは、地球から隠れるためだけでなく、‌‌他の地球外生命体から隠れるため‌‌だと述べています。これは宇宙では「だまし討ち」や「盗み」が横行する広大な場所だからです。
  • 彼は、NASAがセレスの明るい点を硫黄と断定する4年前に、それが「‌‌塩‌‌」であることを知っていました。この事実は、2020年8月10日にNASAによって「塩水質の塩」と最終的に確認され、彼の宇宙での経験の大きな証拠となりました。

• ‌‌記憶の回復と課題‌‌:

  • ロドリゲスは2015年にMRIスキャンを受けた後、記憶が戻り始めました。彼は、ランディ・クレイマーのインタビューを見て、記憶が繋がり始めたと述べています。
  • 記憶の消去は完璧ではなく、彼の最初の誘拐の30分間は消去されませんでした。
  • 彼によると、記憶消去は「‌‌産業規模の催眠術‌‌」であり、特定の脳の領域に化学物質を注入し、ブースで催眠術の映像を見せることで行われました。これにより、名前や顔など特定の種類の記憶を忘れさせることができました。
  • 記憶回復の過程は困難で、最初は眠気や無関心、空腹、抑うつなどの症状を伴いました。彼は、毎朝そのことについて考えることで、歯ブラシのような日常的な詳細な記憶も取り戻せるようになったと説明しています。
  • 彼は、感情的な重要性を持つ記憶はより鮮明に残りやすいと指摘し、他の経験者にも感情的な手がかりを使って記憶を掘り起こすことを助けています。
  • 彼は、多くの証言が支離滅裂に聞こえるのは、彼らがすべての記憶を取り戻していないためであり、点と点をつなげようとしている途中だからだと理解を示しています。

トニー・ロドリゲスの秘密の宇宙計画での経験は、単なるSF的な物語ではなく、彼の人生を根本的に変え、彼が地球外生命体、高度なテクノロジー、そして隠された政府プログラムの実態について語る基盤となっています。

方法開示と ET 生命

AI

トニー・ロドリゲスの証言のより大きな文脈において、提供されたソースは‌‌情報開示（ディスクロージャー）‌‌と‌‌地球外生命体（ET生命）‌‌に関して、以下の点を強く示唆しています。

情報開示（ディスクロージャー）について

ソースは、地球外生命体と秘密宇宙プログラムの存在に関する情報が‌‌意図的に隠蔽されている‌‌ことを強調しており、その情報開示が差し迫っている可能性を示唆しています。

• ‌‌政府と軍による隠蔽‌‌:
  • 軍事部門は、地球上の‌‌あらゆる政府の科学部門に対して権限‌‌を持っており、都合よくそれを認めたがりません。
  • ‌‌国家安全保障がすべてに優先する‌‌ため、私たちは全体像を把握できていません。
  • 地球上の望遠鏡のソフトウェアは、米国空軍によって書かれており、‌‌オペレーターが気づかないうちに、あらゆる物体を削除できる‌‌ように設計されています。これにより、データが改ざんされ、‌‌科学的データは信頼できない‌‌ものとなっています。
  • ジェームズ・ウェッブ宇宙望遠鏡のような国際的なプロジェクトでさえ、‌‌ペンタゴンのソフトウェアに接続されており‌‌、発見された情報は隠蔽される可能性があると示唆されています。
  • アマチュア天文学者は独自の望遠鏡で観測できるため、物理的な物体が太陽系に接近した場合、その存在を隠し通すことは困難になります。これが、宇宙プログラムや地球外生命体に関する‌‌情報開示のタイムラインが存在する理由‌‌だとロドリゲスは考えています。
• ‌‌記憶の消去と回復の課題‌‌:
  • 秘密宇宙プログラムでは、参加者の記憶を消去する技術（「産業規模の催眠術」）が使用されており、特定の脳領域に化学物質を注入し、催眠術的な映像を見せることで記憶を忘れさせていました。
  • この記憶消去は完璧ではなく、特に1980年代初頭に連れ去られた人々は多くの記憶を取り戻している一方、1990年代以降に連れ去られた人々はより断片的な記憶しか持っていない傾向があります。
  • ロドリゲスは、NASAがセレスの明るい点が「硫黄」であると断定する4年前に、それが「塩」であることを知っていたと述べています。この事実は、2020年にNASAによって「塩水質の塩」と最終的に確認され、‌‌彼が宇宙での経験の大きな証拠‌‌となりました。
  • デビッド・グラッシュが議会で証言したように、高速で移動する未確認飛行物体（UAP）に関する情報は‌‌公に開示されつつあり‌‌、これは「秘密のダムが崩壊し始めている」ことを示しています。しかし、火星やセレスの植民地の存在が認められるまでには、まだ時間がかかるとロドリゲスは考えています。
• ‌‌情報開示の展望‌‌:
  • ロドリゲスは、近いうちに‌‌情報開示や接触が起こる可能性‌‌について言及しており、平和的なシナリオも話し合われていると述べています。
  • 彼は、自身の証言を議会で行う準備ができていると語っていますが、議会がまだ彼の証言を受け入れる準備ができていないと考えています。

ET生命について

ソースは、‌‌宇宙には想像を絶するほどの数のET生命が存在‌‌し、地球は彼らにとって既知の場所であることを示しています。

• ‌‌宇宙の広大さと生命の普遍性‌‌:
  • ロドリゲスは、幼少期からSFに傾倒し、‌‌星の数を学んだ時に地球外生命体の存在を確信した‌‌と述べています。
  • 宇宙のすべての星に少なくとも1つの惑星があるという現代の科学的知見は、‌‌生命が無限に存在‌‌するという結論を裏付けています。
  • 彼は、地球を訪れている地球外生命体は「77種」のような少ない数ではなく、‌‌何万種、あるいはそれ以上‌‌の非常に大きな数であると考えています。
  • 地球は‌‌20億年間居住可能‌‌であり、その間に多くの知的地球外生命体が地球を訪れたと彼は主張しています。
• ‌‌ETの技術と移動‌‌:
  • 地球外生命体は、‌‌瞬間的に銀河の3分の1の距離を移動し、充電して再び移動できる‌‌ほどの高度な技術を持っています。これにより、彼らは「何十億ものシステム」に移動し、「夕食の時間までに帰宅」することが可能です。
  • そのため、地球の太陽系に‌‌非常に高度な技術を持つET種族が、私たちの知らないうちに訪れる‌‌ことができます。彼らは「局所的なET」や人間の宇宙プログラムが対処できるレベルを超えた技術を持っているため、‌‌地球の防衛システムでは彼らの存在を把握できない‌‌ことがあります。
• ‌‌宇宙の交流と貿易‌‌:
  • 宇宙には‌‌星間貿易ネットワーク‌‌が存在し、ET種族が技術の交換をリストする「掲示板システム」のようなものがあります。
  • 秘密宇宙プログラムでは、この貿易システムを利用して‌‌技術を獲得する‌‌ことが主な任務でした。
  • 貿易は「あらゆる手段を使って」行われ、時には‌‌「盗む」こともあった‌‌とロドリゲスは語っています。
  • 交易品は多岐にわたり、兵士、医薬品、コーヒー、軍需品など「あらゆるもの」が運ばれました。特に医薬品は、地球の植物が他の惑星で栽培されることで独特の化学組成を持つようになり、貴重な交易品となりました。
  • セレスなどのコロニーが地下にあるのは、地球からだけでなく、‌‌他のET種族から身を隠すため‌‌だとロドリゲスは指摘しています。宇宙は「だまし討ち」や「盗み」が横行する広大な場所だからです。
  • 「銀河連邦」のような大きなグループに属することは、宇宙を航行する上でのセキュリティ上必要であると説明されています。
• ‌‌火星のET生命‌‌:
  • 火星には‌‌先住民の生命体、特に昆虫型生命体が存在‌‌しており、人類と友好的ではありません。
  • ロドリゲスは火星でこれらの昆虫型生命体と交戦する任務に就いていました。

トニー・ロドリゲスの証言は、単なる個人的な体験談に留まらず、私たちの知る現実の裏側に隠された、広大で複雑な宇宙の政治、貿易、そしてET生命の存在に関する情報開示の必要性を訴えかけるものとして提示されています。

Tony Todrigues の活動

AI

トニー・ロドリゲスの証言のより大きな文脈において、提供されたソースは、彼が自身の‌‌秘密宇宙プログラム（SSP）での経験を公にし、調査し、同じような経験を持つ他の人々を支援する‌‌ことに活動の中心を置いていることを明らかにしています。彼は、自身の非凡な体験が、隠蔽された真実を明らかにし、地球外生命体と宇宙における人類の役割に関するより広範な情報開示を促すための鍵となると考えています。

以下に彼の主な活動と、それが彼の証言の文脈において何を意味するのかを説明します。

• ‌‌自身の経験の公開と証言‌‌:

  • トニー・ロドリゲスは、自身の‌‌秘密宇宙プログラムでの20年間の経験‌‌について公に語っています。彼は10歳で拉致され、月、火星、小惑星ケレスでのプログラムに従事し、その後元の生活に戻され、2015年に記憶を取り戻しました。
  • 彼は「Fade to Black」のような番組にゲストとして出演し、自身の詳細な物語を共有しています。この番組への出演は9年越しに実現したもので、彼にとって重要なプラットフォームとなっています。
  • 彼の証言は、当初は激しい攻撃にさらされましたが、時間が経つにつれて彼の記憶を裏付ける多くの証拠が見つかり、彼の主張が「検証された」と彼は述べています。

• ‌‌自身の記憶の調査と裏付けの探求‌‌:

  • 彼は2015年に記憶を取り戻して以来、何が起こったのかを解明するために‌‌徹底的な調査‌‌を行ってきました。
  • 彼は、自身が知り得なかったはずの事柄、特にケレスの明るい点が「塩分を多く含む塩」であるとNASAが確認する4年前に、それが「塩」であると知っていたことを、自身の宇宙での経験を裏付ける最大の証拠の一つとして挙げています。
  • この調査と記憶の検証は、彼が自身の経験の‌‌真実性を自らに証明する‌‌上で不可欠なものでした。

• ‌‌他の経験者への支援とコンタクト‌‌:

  • 彼は、自身の体験を公にして以来、同じような経験をした‌‌数千人（過去10年間で3,000人近く）の人々‌‌から連絡を受けており、彼らと一対一で話し、彼らのタイムラインを整理する手助けをしています。
  • 彼は、経験者を‌‌3つのカテゴリー‌‌に分類しています。地球ベースの秘密宇宙プログラムに関わった人々、グレイ、レプティリアン、ノルディックなどの「ローカルグループ」による拉致の経験者、そして「それ以外の」広範な種類の遭遇を持つ人々です。
  • 彼は、人々が記憶を回復する手助けをするための‌‌記憶回復コース‌‌を自身のウェブサイトで提供しています。彼は、記憶の消去は不完全であり、多くの人が断片的な記憶を再構築しようとしていることを理解し、彼らに寛容な姿勢を示すべきだと訴えています。彼は、感情的なつながりを持つ記憶から始めることで、より詳細な情報を引き出すことができると提案しています。

• ‌‌技術の「リバースエンジニアリング」と意識研究‌‌:

  • 彼の経験は、彼が過去に触れた技術を「解き明かし、リバースエンジニアリングする」という活動に繋がりました。これには、‌‌リモートビューイングや精神エネルギー‌‌が含まれます。
  • 彼は、リモートビューイングに対する「対策」を公に発表した最初の人物だと主張しており、彼の3冊目の本でその詳細が述べられています。
  • 彼は、政府が「意識技術」を秘密裏に利用していると考えており、科学は意識の役割を軽視していると指摘しています。

• ‌‌キャリアとしての活動と情報発信‌‌:

  • 彼は、30年間木製フロアの職人として働いていましたが、記憶を取り戻して以来、これらの活動が彼の‌‌キャリア‌‌となりました。
  • 彼は‌‌3冊の本‌‌を執筆しており、これらは彼のウェブサイトで購入できます。
  • 彼はPatreonを通じて‌‌リモートビューイングの毎週のZoomコール‌‌を主催しており、これが彼の主な活動の場となっています。
  • 彼は「Conscious Life Expo」など、いくつかの大きな‌‌カンファレンスで講演‌‌しています。

• ‌‌情報開示への希望と政府への提言‌‌:

  • ロドリゲスは、物理的な物体が太陽系に接近した場合、アマチュア天文学者によってその存在を隠し通すことが困難になるため、秘密宇宙プログラムと地球外生命体に関する‌‌情報開示のタイムラインが存在する‌‌と考えています。
  • 彼は、デビッド・グラッシュが議会で未確認空中現象（UAP）について証言したことを「秘密のダムが崩壊し始めている」と見ています。
  • 彼は、自身が議会で証言する準備ができていると述べていますが、議会がまだ彼の証言を受け入れる準備ができていないと考えています。

トニー・ロドリゲスの活動は、彼自身の極めて個人的な経験から始まり、それを検証し、他の人々と共有し、より広範な情報開示の動きに貢献しようとする、多岐にわたる取り組みへと発展しています。彼は、情報の隠蔽という現状に対し、自身の証言と研究を通じて挑戦し、人類が宇宙における真の地位を理解することを目指しています。

FAQ

AI

Q1. トニー・ロドリゲスとはどのような人物で、彼の主張の核心は何ですか？

A1. トニー・ロドリゲスは、自身が10歳のときに「秘密宇宙計画（Secret Space Program）」に不本意に徴兵されたと主張する人物です。彼は、意識を「借りられ」、20年間にわたりクローン体で月、火星、そして準惑星ケレスの植民地で過ごしたと述べています。彼は、自分が関与したプログラムの記憶は、MRIスキャンとランディ・クレイマーのインタビューによって2015年に回復したと語っています。ロドリゲスは、木材床の研磨職人という「普通」の人生を送っていたと強調し、当初は自分の主張を証明するために多くの研究を行ったと述べています。彼の主張の核心は、地球外生命体（ET）や未公開の宇宙プログラムの存在、そしてそれらにおける彼の役割にあります。

Q2. トニー・ロドリゲスが記憶を取り戻した経緯と、その記憶の信憑性を裏付けるものは何ですか？

A2. ロドリゲスは、2015年に頭部のMRIスキャンを受けた後、ランディ・クレイマーのインタビューを偶然見たことで、20年間の記憶が蘇ったと述べています。彼は、当初は困惑しましたが、研究を重ねるうちに自分の記憶を裏付ける多くの証拠が見つかったと主張しています。特に注目すべきは、NASAがケレス準惑星のオカトル・クレーターにある「明るい点」を硫黄と他の物質の混合物と発表した4年前に、ロドリゲスがそれが塩であると正確に記憶していたことです。これは、NASAが2020年8月10日にそれが塩水塩であることを確認したことで、彼の主張の強力な裏付けとなりました。彼は、自分の記憶が消去された後も、潜在意識が他の経験者との接触を求める不思議な現象についても言及しています。

Q3. トニー・ロドリゲスが参加したとされる「秘密宇宙計画」とは具体的にどのようなものでしたか？

A3. ロドリゲスは、自分が複数の秘密宇宙計画に関与したと述べています。最初の段階は、陸軍の情報・保安部隊（Army INSCOM）の「プロジェクト・グリルフレーム」というリモート・ビューイング研究プログラムの終盤で、カリフォルニア州イニョカーンから始まりました。その後、彼はペルーで薬物取引のためのリモート・ビューイングを行っていました。その後、彼は軍に売られ、月面にある秘密宇宙プログラムの一つに徴兵されました。そこでは、火星の昆虫型生命体との戦闘に備える支援兵士として訓練を受け、火星での任務にも従事しました。後に、彼はケレス準惑星のコロニーに移され、船のメンテナンス作業員として8年間働き、その後数年間は貨物エンジニアを務めました。これらの計画は、地球外技術の獲得を目的としたものであり、道徳的側面は考慮されなかったと彼は主張しています。

Q4. 秘密宇宙計画で使用されている技術、特に記憶操作と人工重力について教えてください。

A4. ロドリゲスは、秘密宇宙計画が高度な技術、特に記憶操作と人工重力を使用していると説明しています。彼の記憶によると、誘拐後、彼は20年間もの間、自分の家族や生い立ちに関する記憶を失いました。記憶の消去は「産業グレードの催眠術」と化学物質の注入を組み合わせたプロセスであり、脳の特定の領域を標的として行われたと述べています。しかし、この記憶消去技術は完璧ではなく、特に1980年代初頭に誘拐された人々は、断片的な記憶を取り戻しやすい傾向があるようです。また、月、火星、ケレスなどの基地や船では、「グラヴィマッティン」と呼ばれる厚い床によって人工重力が作られていました。これにより、地球上と同じような重力を感じることができ、異なる重力の惑星から来た存在のために重力を調整する機能も備わっていたと説明しています。

Q5. 秘密宇宙計画における地球外生命体（ET）との関係性や、宇宙における文明の広がりについて、トニー・ロドリゲスはどのように説明していますか？

A5. ロドリゲスは、地球外生命体が非常に広範に存在し、私たちの想像をはるかに超える技術と進化を遂げていると主張しています。彼は、私たちが地球上に知る「現地グループ」としてグレイ、レプティリアン、ノルディックなどが存在すると語っています。彼が貨物エンジニアとして関与した異星間貿易ミッションでは、地球外生命体との交流が頻繁に行われていました。これらの種族は、テクノロジーや物資を交換し、宇宙ステーションの掲示板システムを通じて取引の機会をリストアップしていました。また、ロドリゲスは、地球の技術レベルを超えた非常に高度な地球外生命体が存在し、私たちの太陽系を自由に行き来できるため、地球の軍事宇宙プログラムがそれらを完全に監視することはできないと述べています。さらに、火星には昆虫型生命体や植物生命など、土着の生命体が存在し、地下に住む大型の昆虫型生命体と人類との間で「縄張り」を巡る紛争があったことも示唆しています。

Q6. 地球外生命体との接触や、宇宙の情報の開示に関して、ロドリゲスはどのような見解を持っていますか？

A6. ロドリゲスは、地球外生命体との接触が差し迫っており、いくつかの平和的なシナリオが議論されていると考えています。彼は、メディアやポップカルチャーによって、星間飛行は数ヶ月かかるロケットによるものとプログラミングされているが、実際には技術的に進化した種族は銀河の3分の1の距離を瞬時に移動し、充電して再び移動できると主張しています。これにより、地球上の人類も同様に、数十億のシステムへ「夕食までに帰宅できる」ほど迅速に移動できるレベルの技術を持っていると指摘しています。また、彼は、宇宙における情報の開示が不可避なタイムラインにあると信じており、その理由として、アマチュア天文家が分類された情報を入手できることや、物理的な物体の移動を制御できないことを挙げています。彼は、ジェームズ・ウェッブ宇宙望遠鏡のような主要な科学プロジェクトでさえ、軍事の影響下にあり、機密保持のためにデータが編集または検閲される可能性があると示唆しています。

Q7. 宇宙空間での生活やミッションについて、ロドリゲスはどのような具体的な経験を語っていますか？

A7. ロドリゲスの宇宙での経験は多岐にわたります。月面基地での生活は、軍の施設に似ており、ペンタゴンの設計を応用した建物があったと述べています。火星では、昆虫型生命体との戦闘ミッションに従事し、兵士として訓練を受けました。その後、ケレス準惑星の植民地に移り、船のメンテナンス作業員として単調な日々を送りましたが、人工重力装置が稼働している基地や船内で生活していました。貨物エンジニアとして、彼は異星間貿易ミッションに参加し、地球のコーヒー豆、医薬品、軍用ブーツなど、あらゆる種類の物資を取引しました。また、彼は地球外生命体の領土から貴重な資源（地球の石油の500倍の効力を持つ油など）を盗む任務にも関与したと述べています。

Q8. 科学と国家安全保障の関係性について、トニー・ロドリゲスはどのような懸念を表明していますか？

A8. ロドリゲスは、科学と国家安全保障の間に存在する深い隠蔽構造に強い懸念を表明しています。彼は、すべての国の軍事部門が科学部門に対して権威を持っていると主張し、この事実がしばしば「都合よく」認められないと指摘しています。例えば、大規模な望遠鏡のソフトウェアは米空軍によって書かれており、そのソフトウェアはオペレーターに知られることなく、いかなるオブジェクトも「削除」できると彼は述べています。このため、一般に公開されている科学データは完全に信頼できるものではない可能性があります。彼は、デビッド・グラシュの議会証言が「秘密のダムが決壊し始めた」ものと評価しつつも、議会はまだ火星植民地やケレス植民地の存在を認める準備ができていないと考えています。ロドリゲスは、自身の証言を裏付けるために、科学界がこの軍事的な影響を認識する必要があると訴えています。

時系列

AI

• 1947年7月8日: 陸軍航空隊が飛行円盤の発見と所有を発表する（ラジオニュースの冒頭で言及）。

• 1977年: 映画「スター・ウォーズ」が公開され、SFの黄金時代が始まる。

• 1979年: 米国が中国の子供を使った遠隔透視（リモートビューイング）の研究成果を知り、独自の研究を開始する。

• 1981年: トニー・ロドリゲスが月に連れて行かれたとされている（ポッドキャストの導入で言及）。

• 1982年:

  • 4月: トニー・ロドリゲスが10歳の時、彼の通う小学校の科学フェアで、いじめっ子の友人の父親によって目をつけられる。
  • 4月17日 (土曜日): トニーの父親が雨の中遊ぶトニーの写真を撮る。
  • 4月21日 (水曜日): いじめっ子の友人が父親にトニーを指し示す。
  • 4月22日 (木曜日夜): トニー・ロドリゲスがグレイ型ETとレプティリアン型ETによって自宅の寝室から拉致される。彼は意識を借りる形で20年間「キャリア・リターン・プログラム」に参加することに同意する。
  • トニーは肉体に関する手術を受け、イニョカーン、カリフォルニア州の陸軍INSCOMのプロジェクト・グリルフレイムで目覚める。彼にはこれまでの記憶がなかった。
  • トニーはイニョカーンでの滞在後、シアトルで1〜2週間過ごす。
  • トニーはペルーに移され、2年間コカイン密売組織の遠隔透視能力者として働く。
  • 遠隔透視能力を失ったトニーはシアトルに戻り、2夏を過ごす。彼はアレルギー反応を起こす薬を投与される。
  • トニーは軍に売られ、軍用輸送船で月に到着する。彼はそこで一連の手術を受け、火星でのインセクトイドとの戦闘のための支援兵として訓練される。
  • トニーは火星に送られ、インセクトイドとの交戦任務に就く。しかし、インセクトイドが戦略に速く適応したため、このプログラムは中止される。
  • トニーは火星の地下都市に移され、適性テストを受けて船の整備士として再訓練される。
  • トニーはケレス植民地公社に配属され、8年間宇宙船の整備士として働く。
  • その後、彼の船は退役し、彼は貨物技師として再訓練される。彼は最後の2〜3年間を貨物技師として過ごす。
  • トニーは元の肉体に戻され、地球での日常生活に戻るが、20年間の記憶は消去される。

• 2015年: トニー・ロドリゲスが、MRIスキャンを受けた10日後、ランディ・クレイマーのインタビューを見て、宇宙計画での20年間の記憶を取り戻し始める。彼は何が起こったのかを研究し始める。

• 2016年: トニーはNASAがケレスのオカーター・クレーターの明るい点を硫黄と他の物質の混合物と判断している中で、それが塩であると主張する。

• 2020年8月10日: NASAが最終的にドーン探査機のデータを分析し、ケレスのオカーター・クレーターの明るい点が「塩分を多く含む塩」であることを確認する。これはトニーの記憶を裏付ける重要な証拠となる。

• 2023年: トニー・ロドリゲスがイニョカーンを訪れ、記憶に関連する場所を発見する。

• 2025年8月12日: ジミー・チャーチがポッドキャスト「Fade to Black」でトニー・ロドリゲスをゲストに迎える。これは9年間温めてきた企画である。

主要関係者

AI

• トニー・ロドリゲス (Tony Rodrigues): ポッドキャストのゲストで、元は木材床の研磨職人。10歳の時にETに拉致され、20年間秘密宇宙計画（SSP）に従事したと主張している。月の地下基地、火星の地下都市、準惑星ケレスの植民地などで、支援兵、船の整備士、貨物技師として働いた。2015年に記憶を取り戻し、以来その経験を公に語り、研究している。記憶回復のためのコースも提供している。
• ジミー・チャーチ (Jimmy Church): ポッドキャスト「Fade to Black」のホスト。超常現象やUFOに関するテーマを扱っている。トニー・ロドリゲスとは9年来の知り合いで、彼の話を聴き手として進行する。
• いじめっ子の友人の父親: トニーの小学校の科学フェアで審査員を務めた人物。彼が「イルミナティ」の一員であると、彼の息子がトニーに話していた。この人物がトニーの拉致に関与したとされている。
• グレイ型ET (Grey ET): トニーを拉致し、「意識を20年間借りる」ことを許可させた異星人。
• レプティリアン型ET (Reptilian ET): トニーを拉致した異星人の一人で、グレイの指示を受けてトニーに同意を求めた。
• ランディ・クレイマー (Randy Kramer): トニーが2015年に彼のインタビューを見て、自身のSSPでの記憶を思い出すきっかけとなった人物。
• アヴィ・ローブ (Avi Loeb): データ駆動型のアプローチで宇宙現象を研究する、ジミー・チャーチの友人である科学者。i3 Atlasのような地球外起源の物体に関心を持っている。
• ドクター・サラ (Dr. Salla): Exopolitics.orgの人物で、トニーの記憶を他の情報と照合して研究した。ケレスの塩の件でトニーの主張がNASAの公式発表より早かったことを確認する手助けをした。
• デヴィッド・グラッシュ (David Grusch): 米国議会でUFOに関する証言を行った人物。彼の証言は、秘密主義の「ダム」に亀裂を入れるものとして言及される。
• グラハム・ニコルズ (Graham Nichols): ポッドキャスト「Fade to Black」の、トニー・ロドリゲス出演前日のゲスト。体外離脱（OBE）について話した。
• ジョアン・ディマジオ (Joanne DiMaggio): ポッドキャスト「Fade to Black」の、トニー・ロドリゲス出演翌日のゲスト。ソウルメイトとセルメイトについて話す予定。
• ヘレナ・ウェーブ (Helena Wabe): ポッドキャスト「Fade to Black」の、トニー・ロドリゲス出演後日のゲスト。ノエティック・サイエンスとイオンについて話す予定。
• ブライアン・フォレスター (Brian Forrester): ジミー・チャーチが2026年11月にペルーとイースター島を訪れる際の同行者。
• ケイト・チェイス (Kate Chase): ポッドキャストのチャット参加者で、「意識を借りた」トニーがどの肉体にいたのかという質問を投げかけた。
• ミシェル (Michelle): ジミー・チャーチの同僚または知人で、彼が過去に出演したショーについて言及した人物。

情報源

動画(2:02:11)

Ep. 2194 Tony Rodrigues Project Starmaker

文字起こし

展開

(transcript 1of2)

（以下は "Ep. 2194 Tony Rodrigues Project Starmaker" と題されたpodcast の文字起こしの前半部分です。ゲストの語り手は Tony Rodrigues で、聞き手は番組ホストの Jimmy Church です。）

The Smoke Radio for the masses. Headline edition, July 8th, 1947. The Army Air Forces has announced that a flying disc has been found and is now in the possession of the Army. Did the gaming rig change the game? Game changer. I occasionally think how quickly our differences worldwide would vanish if we were facing an alien threat from outside this world. This is Fade to Black with your host Jimmy Church on the Game Changer Radio Network. All right. Good evening. Fade to Black. How you doing? How you doing? (0:01:22)

All right. Today is Tuesday, August 12th, 2025. I'm your host Jimmy Church. You know what to do. Let's do this. Man. Yeah. Here we go. This week on Fade to Black. Last night, Graham Nichols was here talking and informing us how to induce your own OBE. What a great conversation last night. And tonight, Tony Rodriguez is here. Project Star Maker. And a quick comment about tonight's show. (0:01:56)

And Tony just informed me before the... This is nine years in the making. Like for real. For real. And I just had to step back and think about that for a minute. But nine years. But tonight it's happening. Tony Rodriguez is here. Tomorrow night, Joanne DiMaggio. And the show is called Soulmate or Cellmate. I've had a few of both. All right. So that's tomorrow night. Thursday night, Helena Wabe joins us. (0:02:29)

We're going to be talking about noetic sciences and ions. What a great week here on Fade to Black. Now, I do have five major events coming up. All of these are in 2026 because I've cleared the calendar for 2025. Because I am in the middle of production with Beyond Belief. And that happens every single month. So I just need to get my feet on the ground and figure all of this stuff out. (0:02:56)

So I've cleared the calendar for 2025. But in 2026, first up is the Conscious Life Expo. And this is February 20th through the 23rd at the LAX Hilton. Right after that, the Contact Modalities Expo. That is May 1st through the 3rd in Delavan, Wisconsin at the Resort. After that, Contact in the Desert, May 28th through June 1st. Tickets will be available this Thanksgiving day. (0:03:26)

And then right after that, I head to the United Kingdom for the Monty Python Tour of Scotland. Very excited about that. That is August 1st through the 9th, 2026. And then I come back from that and turn around and go to Peru and Easter Island with Brian Forrester. That's taking place in November 2026. I don't have the firm dates for that yet. But the links for everything, including Peru and Easter Island, are below. (0:03:57)

All right. All right. Let's get this going. Tonight, Tony Rodriguez is here. And he's going to go through everything tonight. This is the first time Tony has been on the show. And like I just mentioned, nine years in the making. Nine years in the making. (0:04:14)

---

So we're going to start from the beginning. And we're going to work all through this tonight. And what his life has been like and how it got started. It's a crazy story. So yeah. Including going to the moon, allegedly, in 1981. So we're going to talk about all of that. And before I get into the details of his life here, I'm going to let Tony do that as I bring him in right now. (0:04:49)

There he is. Tony Rodriguez. Tony? Jimmy, how you doing? Can you hear me? How you doing? We got you loud and clear, brother. We got you loud and clear. Oh, before we get started, Tony, you get the first-time guest disclaimer. Also waited nine years to do this. You know the drill, but we'll go through it anyway. Tony, it's just you and I sitting on my couch having a conversation as friends. (0:05:15)

And where the conversation starts, it starts. Where it ends, it ends. But we're going to end as friends. We're already friends. But you have to accept so we can move forward. Very good. Sounds great. Is that I accept? I accept, sir. You accept. I'm not too sure, Tony, where to start tonight. We can go with the linear time scale and start from the beginning. (0:05:49)

But I do want to mention this in the interest of transparency because I just mentioned it. You mentioned it earlier. We've known each other for a long time. We've certainly known of each other for a long time. And we had you scheduled for Fade to Black nine years ago. Now, without going into details, that got stopped. That got stopped. And we had a couple of conversations about it ten years ago. (0:06:23)

But one of the things that I remember us talking about, and again, all of this is in the interest of transparency. Where I said, man, this is a crazy world. This is a crazy community. Are you ready for everything? And my memory says to me that you went, yeah, okay, I got it. And I said, I don't think you do. Right? I don't think you do. (0:06:57)

Going past the last nine years to that conversation, I wasn't wrong, was I? Man, I don't know. You're right. I wasn't ready for what was about to happen to me. For the way that things turned out. Since going public and speaking about what happened. One thing that's fortunate, though, is back then, like you said, it got canceled. There were doubts. It was early on. (0:07:27)

And I was under heavy attack in the early days. I came out with my... I answered what people asked. There were emails that said out there from other shows that if you suspect you've been involved, write us an email, let us know. So I answered. I said, yeah, I think I've been involved. I've been through that. And I got heavily attacked by people that were already talking about it. (0:07:50)

It was a broad spectrum of people that were like, whatever, there's no way. (0:07:55)

---

This dude, screw him. And whatever, I weathered it. But here I am. It's 10 years since I got my memories back and started researching what happened. And time has validated many of the things that I remembered back then. And so I'm still here talking about it. And a lot of people aren't still standing from it. And there's a lot of new people that have come out with this. (0:08:17)

I'm not the only one saying that I've experienced what I have. And being taken for 20 years and being immediately put back, back in 1982. And working in these programs and on places on Earth and in space. And I got the memories back in 2015 of the whole incident and started researching it and trying to figure out what in the heck happened to me. (0:08:40)

You know what I mean? I was just as shocked as anybody. And I researched it. And I'm still, to this day, even recently, still turning up evidence. So there have been many points of evidence that have supported my memories, the things that I remember that I couldn't have known. There's just no way I could have known it. And so I'm talking about it. (0:08:59)

And I've been busy. And meeting people like you, Jimmy, and talking on shows and rubbing elbows with other experiencers has opened up a lot of doors for me to unpack and reverse engineer the technologies that I was exposed to. And just it's became a career for me. I moved. I was a wood floor refinisher for like 30 years. I'm a normal, standard dude from the Midwest. Got my memories back and started looking to prove it. (0:09:27)

And in the journey down the road of trying to research and... Because I would never come on your show or any other show and say these things that are very unbelievable if I didn't have proof to myself, first and foremost, you know? So... Well, I don't know how... Here we are. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know how good your chops are with flooring. (0:09:56)

But I have a big house, and I'm thinking about refinishing the floors. Are you down? I'm down, man. Hey, well, I'm in... A couple weekends, some beer? That sounds great, honestly. And, you know, I've done that whole dance before. It's like not my... That definitely won't be my first rodeo in that deal. Totally down, man. I keep looking at my floor. I don't mind doing stuff. (0:10:22)

I like putting on a tool belt and things. I keep looking at these floors going, Oh, man. And it just seems like it's too big to tackle. But... It's a big job. It is. It's a big job. Technically, I just have my living room and my dining room that need to be done. Everything... No, and now the family room, too. So three rooms. (0:10:48)

Three rooms. Very cool. All right. Okay. All right. We'll talk about that later. I'm serious, though. (0:10:55)

---

I walk through there going, You know what? Ah, this needs to get done. I don't... They're wood floors. They're beautiful. That's what I did. Yeah. I don't want to replace them. I just want to refinish them. I mean, they're too nice. That's the way to go. They're too nice. That's what I did. I had a nice... I raised my daughters. I was married for 23 years. (0:11:17)

I raised three daughters. I was a flooring guy. I lived a normal life. And then I got an MRI scan on my head. And about 10 days later, coincidentally saw the Randy Kramer interview that explained it. And a bunch of memories that didn't make sense that I had all along. All of a sudden, I went, Oh, God, that's what they did. They kept me. (0:11:37)

And the rest of the memories came. Once there was a file created where the memories could unfold, they did. And I remember 20 years later. And I was like, Oh, my God. I remember being taken when I was 10 years old and being in black programs and the space program. Being in the space to the moon, to Mars, and living about 12 years, better than a decade, on a planetoid series that's in between Mars and a little dwarf planet. (0:12:01)

And they put me back. We'll get into all of that. Maybe after tonight's show, somebody is going to suggest another MRI. But I will say this. Although we've known each other and of each other for a long time, we finally got a chance to hang out. And we did for like three or four days, if I remember correctly. And we had a great time. (0:12:33)

And I remember walking away from the first day where you and I had hung out all day. And I went, man, Tony's pretty grounded. I don't know what I was expecting, right? But we just had a great time. And I just walked away from that. And we've stayed in touch since then and have talked a lot. But yeah, yeah. So I just wanted to share that not only with you, because I told you, but also with the audience as well. (0:13:10)

All right. So the memories come flooding back. Let's go back to the beginning. Let's go before the beginning, actually. In your early childhood, and I ask this of every guest that I have on the show. And it doesn't really matter what the subject is about. I do want to know, and I compare it to my own life. Growing up, did you have an interest in E.T. or the UFOs? (0:13:43)

Did you have any family members that were crazy or a crazy uncle or anything like that? Any experiences before things started to kick off? My mom was like heavy into Star Trek. And she was a Christian woman, but she was heavily into sci-fi and Star Trek and ghosts story paranormal. And so I was into sci-fi for that reason before it happened. (0:14:06)

---

Before the abduction happened, yeah, I was totally into it. It was like Star Wars was in 77. And that was like a golden era at the late 70s, early 80s in sci-fi. They really put their heart and soul into writing the stories because they didn't have a lot of special effects to fall back on like they do now. And so, yeah, I was into sci-fi and all that stuff. (0:14:33)

I believed in aliens. It only makes sense. I think as soon as I knew, as soon as they taught me in school how many stars there were, it was pretty obvious that there were ETs up there. Anybody that can't draw that conclusion, I mean, you really have to run far to get away from that conclusion as soon as you realize there are billions and billions and billions of stars. (0:14:53)

So that means there's life somewhere. Okay. Do you remember my presentation that I did at the conference? And that was one of the things that I mentioned, which is this. We can look up and see stars, right? But we always wondered, I wonder if there is, you know, somebody looking back at me right now. That's not an original thought. Everybody has had that thought, right? (0:15:23)

I'm not planting a flag here like this is, you know, some original thing. But, you know, looking up, just wondering if ET was, you know, looking up at the stars at the same time that we are here. But what we didn't know then, which we know today, is every star in the universe, which includes every star in the sky in your backyard, has at least one planet. (0:15:54)

Every single... now we get into crazy town, don't we? I don't know how much life is out there, but every star has a planet. And there's a trillion in our Milky Way. And there are trillions of Milky Ways, right? It's beyond our comprehension and ability to understand, isn't it? So, look, I want to skip to the Space Service when I was an engineer on a ship doing interstellar trade missions. (0:16:29)

I want to tell you, I had a conversation. We had the schedule altered one day. An officer came down and told me, we're not going to this pickup. We're staying at this one. And I said, but the pickup's the first time. We'd never been there before, so we treated those with a little bit more decorum. We got ready, you know what I mean? (0:16:48)

There was like a sample package that we would offload when we went to new systems to trade with, like a sampler. And so the guys in the cargo bay, we had to have our act together when we did that. And I said, well, what about, it's our first one, what if they get mad and they don't have us back? And the officer said to me, he said, if there were a million ships like ours, or I forget the number, a thousand, 10,000 ships like ours, more, and they each did missions every day for the next 10,000 years, we wouldn't make a scratch in the list that's available to trade with. (0:17:26)

So it's no big deal if we burn a bridge because there's a trillion bridges of different species that are willing. (0:17:32)

---

There's like a bulletin board system in space stations that are, you know, out in the solar system, and in a lot of systems. And so ETs can list that they're available to trade for technology. It's a bullet, like a trade system. And so they would go to that bulletin board and put out messages across space and get invited to go trade with them. That's how it works. (0:17:55)

And that's exact, and that would be, in my mind's eye, that would have to be the way it is. The amount of life out there, I often use the word infinite, like infinite amounts of life. Well, infinite is a pretty damn big number. But that, we don't have another way to look at it. The universe is that expansive. When somebody mentions, and we need to go back to the beginning, but I love the conversation. (0:18:28)

I know, I know. Yeah, yeah. Which is this. We see, I see, we all see different researchers and no slide on anybody because we're all trying to figure this out. But we see this list of, you know, 77 races visiting Earth or 60 races visiting Earth. There's five visiting. And I go, no, it's got to be a crazy big number. Earth has been habitable for 2 billion years. (0:19:01)

All right, 2 billion. I mean, how many intelligent species of extraterrestrials have visited this planet in 2 billion years or in the last 100 years? I would say that number is huge. It's not 77 races. It's got to be in the tens of thousands or bigger. That's my take. So we've been programmed by media, by pop culture and by sci-fi to think that to fly to the star in the galaxy takes months and months and months and six months. (0:19:35)

And you got to live on the ship and have, you know what I mean? Like everything, and it's rockets. It's always rockets. But the reality is, is that these species, once they get to a level and even humans have, like our government has got to this level of technology. They can instantly go a third of the distance across the galaxy and then instantly wait a minute, recharge and do it again. (0:19:58)

And then come home. So we can go to any of billions of systems and be home for dinner. So it's instant. And they can come here. So any of those billions of systems can come here. And they have different technologies. So the local ETs, the local group, and the human military group, the human space programs, police it as best they can, but they've only got a level of technology. (0:20:26)

And so there are species that come into our solar system that we don't even know that they're here because they're very advanced technologically. They can pop in. So after I went public, you know, when I do a show like this, I see my name's my website. Whenever I do a YouTube show, big or small, people contact me and they go, man, I never heard of that before. (0:20:48)

And I think it happened to me. (0:20:50)

---

And can I talk to you? I'll get emails. And at first I'd just help people out. You know, I was doing my 9 to 5. Because I knew what it was like to not have somebody to talk to. And it really blows my mind. Others like me that don't work with people. It's really a red flag. Because so many people seek me out. (0:21:10)

But I've categorized. I mean, it's been a few thousand people. Coming up on 3,000 people in 10 years that I've done one-on-ones and worked out a timeline and, you know, tell me what happened kind of thing. Just been a year for them to listen, for them to speak to. That's not going to call them crazy. That understands it. And I found that I put everybody in three categories. (0:21:29)

The first category is human, Earth-bound space programs. Those people get abducted and work in one of those. And then the local group. Our local actors, the greys, the reptiles, the Nordics, the locals. You know what I mean? The local area. And they abduct people. It's the same kind of series of events. Keeps happening. And then there's a third category that is radically all over the map. (0:21:54)

Where they get abducted and they're kind. They get abducted and they're invisible. And they can walk through their house. They can see the space. And they trade. They fix them. They have all these different strange things. And that's the everybody else category that's not doing business with the local group. Not doing business with. They're just popping in for whatever they need. And they come down. (0:22:14)

It's usually a positive interaction. But it is real. And then you see when everybody gets abducted by the military, it's a military experience. They have those memories and it lines up with a lot of other things in their life. And so that's got to be the case out there. Any of billions or trillions of species can just breeze through our solar system and go, Hey, check this out. (0:22:37)

This planet's got people. Let's go have a peek. And there's nothing the locals can do about it. Because there's different levels of technology and consciousness that are all over the place. We're not the top of the food chain. The intelligence chain, if that is a chain, is much, much taller than we've been led to believe. It has to be. If I look at you and I look at me, we are as trailer park as trailer park can be. (0:23:06)

Right? You know what, I'll run with that. I don't have any problem with that. I mean, so, geez. You know, and we can have an imagination from looking at science and physics and what all of this can presuppose and suppose and have ideas about this and look at that. But no matter how far we let our imagination go when it comes to physics and what is possible, it ain't even close to the reality of something that is a thousand or a million years ahead of us in technology and evolution. (0:23:47)

We just don't have a clue, do we? (0:23:51)

---

No, we don't. And you know what, the effect of consciousness is, I believe, in my opinion, deleted from science. I think that our consciousness, that things are conscious, you know, the bugs, animals, plants, people, and so on, are conscious. And I think that that consciousness makes up a huge part of reality that our science doesn't give any credit to. And that's why they don't... it doesn't make... a lot of real technology is consciousness. (0:24:25)

And the thing, in my work, what led me to finding evidence of my abduction was the Inyokern. The first stop was in remote viewing research. And when I started peeling back the onion of that and getting the budget inquiries and the declassified documents, it seems like a lot of the government is really running with consciousness technology. Consciousness-enhancing peripherals. We've had the Gateway document, really was like... I would call it like wildfire in the internet a few years ago. (0:24:59)

And it really kind of showed what they were doing. But when you look into the remote viewing, some kind of dream warfare they do. Government remote viewing, corporations are doing remote viewing on a high level every day. Today, remote viewers came home from their eight-hour shift for some corporation, and they will go to work tomorrow. And it's all over the place, the military, everything. (0:25:23)

And the level of technology based on consciousness or the understanding of consciousness is very high, and it's very hidden from us. What do you make of i3 Atlas? You know, and we have... I want your full thought on this. But just one quick comment. When you have Avi Loeb, who I know, who's a friend, and we've done a lot of things together over the years. (0:25:52)

Avi's a very smart guy. And his comment is repeated a lot, which is, I only open my mouth after I analyze the data. I'm a data-driven guy. I'm not here to fantasize or consider. You can't sit down and talk to Avi Loeb about reptilians. I would imagine. Yeah, he doesn't care. Now, if there's data that comes at him about reptilians, that's a different conversation. (0:26:25)

But everything that he says is data-driven. And right now, he's making some pretty out-there comments about i3 Atlas. And October 29th, October 30th, when it pops out from behind the sun and everything, we will know a lot more. And his answer to that is, October 30th, I get to collect more data. I'll have more stuff to say at that time. What do you make of i3 Atlas? (0:26:54)

I don't have a lot of data on it myself, other than what I hear. It's one of the very few objects from outside our solar system, the third object that we've discovered. Confirmed, yeah, confirmed. Or that the public knows about. I'm going to go that far. Well, I understand they've been looking for them for a long time. And they've only seen these that have been fairly recent. (0:27:26)

So that's also something that is a trend here. (0:27:30)

---

So that's a piece of data. But I don't have a... it could be a rock. It could be a derelict craft. It could be somebody with their cloaking shield turned off so we can see them finally. Who knows? The astronomy guys, like you said, when it comes from around the sun, they'll have some good info. And then you and I both know that if it's real info, the apparatus to hide it from guys like Avi exists. (0:27:58)

So I was part of the amateur astronomy in Hawaii when I lived there for a while. And we would tour the Pan-STARRS and the AOS telescopes, these high-tech telescopes. And somebody raised his hand and said, what about this telescope can see the whole sky all at once all night long? What about a classified satellite? And the guy started laughing. He said, I wish you wouldn't have asked that. (0:28:24)

So the room was like silent, right? And he said, you guys might not know this, but all these... it's a gigapixel camera on the telescope, but it goes through the Air Force software. It's the United States Air Force that writes all the software for these telescopes that are granted off military money and college money that built them. And it can delete any object it wants. (0:28:54)

So the operator doesn't even see it. And so data can't be trusted. Science is flawed in that regard. Science doesn't want to acknowledge national security deleting or tampering with science's data. And so we have to always have that in our mind that national security trumps everything. And we don't have the whole picture. And it's ran amok. Well, that's pretty interesting about the software. (0:29:26)

But with a land-based, a terrestrial-based telescope of that size, going through Pentagon software, that makes sense. But here's the problem that the Pentagon or anybody else... you have to mute your phone and you're going to be doing that now... is you can't stop amateur astronomers. When you have a physical object that's coming in... I have a nice telescope. I do. I've got a nice setup. (0:29:59)

And there are plenty of astronomers out there, amateur, that have the ability to look into deep space. Yeah, this is a beautiful point. Yeah, and you can't control that. So if something comes in that is physical, like I-3 Atlas, you can't get into the points of deception because you're going to get caught. That's exactly right. And I think that's why we're on a timeline for a disclosure of the space programs and of extraterrestrial life. (0:30:32)

Everybody is on the same page because... So you have a nice setup. I had a 12-inch, I had an 8-inch scope. I was heavy into astronomy when I was on Maui because it's a really good observing point. And obviously I have memories of space. So I always had a great interest in it. But some of these... the telescopes that I'm talking about are 4 meters. (0:30:55)

Yeah, for real. (0:30:56)

---

I have a 10-inch bucket. And it's pretty solid. If you keep it stable, right? Because of the way it sucks in starlight. And a bucket for everybody... I don't want to get into details. Light bucket, yeah. Yeah, yeah, it's a light bucket. Dude, it's pretty amazing. It's pretty amazing. And I really enjoy... But here's the part with it. I want to see some crazy shit, Tony, with my telescope. (0:31:30)

I haven't yet. I've stared at the moon. I have stared at the moon. Well, maybe, Jimmy, maybe we want to come over and help you with your floor. We have some good viewing. Sure. Well, I'm out here in the desert, man. And I've got no light pollution. I've got the Milky Way just stretched across. And now I see stuff all the time. But I haven't seen anything crazy with my telescope yet. (0:31:55)

So I was in line to help out with a... I don't want to say a military scope, like a civilianly funded, like a funded scope in Hawaii. I want to tell the story of the PLANETS telescope. It's an acronym, the PLANETS, P.L.A. Right. It was going to be, I think, three meters. And it was something called... Because all my years of refinishing and fine sanding stuff, I was going to help sand, polish the mirror. (0:32:26)

They were going to ship it to Hawaii, and we were going to build a machine that would sand it. And I'd sit there for hourly wage and throw dust in the thing so it could grind it. I was so stoked about that. So this was an off-axis paraboloid. So the secondary mirror wasn't directly in front of it. It was off to the side, so there'd be no... Abstraction. Absolutely no diffraction, so they could hook something up. (0:32:49)

Oh, man. They could hook something up called a polarized spectrometer to it. And they could, when they had... Because now they have exoplanets, and they could watch a planet go in front of the star and get a read on the makeup of its atmosphere. Right. With an off-axis paraboloid. So this is a scope... I forget, $8 or $10 million project. $10 million. And they were going to turn this on and within six weeks discover life or not. (0:33:18)

They said, we'll get an answer, yes or no, if there's life out there within six weeks. We have enough targets. We have the math, the probability. We can turn this thing on. The spectrometer only works without the spider in the light beam. So it needs to be an off-axis paraboloid. So somebody came and bought the mirror out. And the whole project got shut down, got shelved. (0:33:40)

They said, no, we'll do it on the James Webb. And they put it on the shelf. So $10 million could have answered the question once and for all within six weeks of turning it on. Life out there. And somebody came and bought it and shut it down. (0:33:54)

---

And said, we'll replace it with a better telescope, the James Webb, which also was hooked into the Pentagon software. Yeah. Yeah. I know a few, more than a handful of researchers, astronomers from different countries that are part of James Webb. I ask them all the same question. Okay, man. So what's going on, man? What's going on? You know, what's going on? And do you fear a contact type of situation where you guys find something and James Woods shows up with his buddies, right? (0:34:36)

And shut the things down. And they told me, everybody's had the same answer. Maybe they're reading from the same page of the playbook. But all of them said, we're international. There's no way this isn't controlled by the United States. And if anything like that happened, our funding would go through the roof. We want that to happen. And we will share it with the world without running interference. (0:35:04)

But they all said the exact same thing. So it almost feels like they were briefed on how to approach that. Or maybe they're telling the truth. Look, I also want to backpedal a little bit. Like, I'm not trying to cast any shadow on the James Webb telescope. It's an amazing thing. It's amazing. And there are other better telescopes that are in the pipe, you know, that are going to be built. (0:35:30)

Even Earthbound ones. They're talking about a giga-telescope. It's some ridiculous size. The technology has gotten so much better. So the James Webb is a great project. But we have to concede. All science has to concede that they are beholden to the military influence of every nation. That the military branch of every government has authority over the scientific branch of every single government on Earth. And they just conveniently never want to admit that. (0:36:06)

But it's so true. Once you allow for that, then all of a sudden the things that I'm telling you, and the things that so many other people are telling us about UFOs, about working in space, start to make sense. It's a data point. You know what I mean? It sounds crazy, the reptilians, but I've got data points I could give Avi. You know what I mean? (0:36:25)

I've been at this for a long time. And a significant amount of my life has been just researching my own memories that have panned out. There's all kinds of my own data points supporting this. And when you look at the military influence, national security, what's happening in science, then all of a sudden I don't sound so crazy. I had... I'm going to share this with you. (0:36:50)

I've said it maybe once or twice before, but Avi and I talked on the phone one day for a length of time about something. It doesn't matter. But it was that night or the next night. I went out after the show and I'm on my top deck in the back. I've got my night vision. (0:37:13)

---

It's my favorite thing to do after the show is go sit on the top deck, look at the sky, have a smoke, you know, and just kind of relax and unwind after the show. So I'm there. And I look to the... I'm just looking, right? But I turn and I'm looking to the north and I happen to be at the right spot at the right time when this happened. (0:37:38)

All right. From the horizon, from the north, this light came up over the horizon, went over my head and back over the horizon behind me. In about a second, maybe a second and a half. It wasn't two seconds. Now, went past planet Earth, right? Okay. It wasn't in our atmosphere. It just, just like this, this fast. And I follow it. Holy crap. What was that? (0:38:16)

Right? All right. And it was just a white ball. And as I'm standing there, contemplating what I just saw, it happened again. Just 20 seconds later. Holy crap. So now I'm on my phone. I'm texting Avi. I, I, the time I'm looking at the, you know, from the north, this, this, and then I run in the house and I shoot him this long email. (0:38:52)

Now that was a text. And then I shoot him along. It has to be, it has to have been observed. There was not one. There was two. And, and once, please get back to me. So he wrote me the next day. He said, I contacted every observatory. Nobody saw anything. And I pick up the phone and go, Avi, bullshit. There was no way that we did not see that. (0:39:18)

It happened twice. He said, Jimmy, nobody, I had everybody checked. I gave him the time, uh, and, and everything that you said to me, nobody saw anything. I, I, and I'm, I believe what Avi's saying. I believe that that's what he was told. Okay. All right. Fair enough. But there's no way that that wasn't seen. And the observatory, and it's fair to say that all of the night sky is being observed 24 seven. (0:39:50)

You know what I mean? Like right now there's a telescope on somewhere where it's dark looking at the entire night sky on that part of the world. And there are satellites in space that are looking at the sky on the light side of the world. Like all of the sky is being monitored, but they are all being monitored through software. And not eyeballs. (0:40:08)

Like you were saying, how you said amateur astronomers can put their eyeballs on, look at the telescope physically. There's no digital interference. It's a raw image with a, with looking through glass and a mirror. And, uh, but most of this, most of the sky is unseen in that regard. The rest of it is seen with software and the people that designed the software can delete at will. (0:40:31)

Yeah, it makes sense. And the guys in the observatories know it and they don't want to talk about it. (0:40:41)

---

It's a funding environment, man. That's right. It's a funding environment. One of the most treacherous waters out there is the astronomy funding game. To set up a telescope in Chile, right? These monstrosities, right? These, uh, technically when you see the videos and the documentaries of them assembling these things, I can't, I can't wrap my head around the engineering team that designs that. The wiring of these are as complex, it's as complex as CERN. It's like that. (0:41:31)

I mean, it's crazy. And so the funding that goes, that goes into that to building a telescope on the top of a mountain in Chile or Argentina or anywhere. You need that funding and you're not going to say stupid shit. You're not, you're not. Amen to that. Very serious. Yeah. I'm being very, very, very serious. You don't want to be the astronomer on that team that got funding disrupted because you started talking about mantids. (0:42:05)

This whole conversation is an excellent point to drive home. That, you know, we, when we ask, when science asks the question, if there was all these UFOs and all these extraterrestrials going on moon bases, we'd see it. We would know. And the thing is this kind of a dirty little secret that most of the things we're looking with can be edited or censored unbeknownst to even the operator or to the scientists that, you know, they don't have to tell these guys that their software is doing it. (0:42:37)

But like I said, the Air Force writes the software for, you know, I don't want to name names on telescopes and get other. It's been years since I was there hanging out with those guys. I did it as an amateur astronomer. And the other thing is I always recommend to people. I get into discussions. Some people get heated when they talk about properties of the world that are not true, that you can easily discover with astronomy. (0:43:01)

I tell people, I'm like, dude, go to a local telescope. Most towns have one, a school or university or somewhere, you know, that has a scope nearby. And take, go on the public night, take a date. It's one of the, it's a great, great date to take a girl to, or you're somebody else if you're a girl. Because it's quiet, it's cerebral, it's beautiful and peaceful. (0:43:26)

And it's like, you'll learn a lot. Just look, more people would benefit if they knew about astronomy. So, and I always, I say it quite a bit because it would solve a lot. We may all get a big astronomy lesson here in the near future, the way things are shaping up. Yeah, yeah, I know, I know. I feel that it seems very tangible at the moment that there's something. (0:43:50)

I, when I first read Arthur C. Clarke's Rama series, right? Rama, the Garden, Gardens of Rama and so forth. And I read that series of books, especially the first one. (0:44:10)

---

Which set the stage, which was very eerily similar to I3 Atlas and what we are experiencing right now. And how it started and how it was tracked and what it turned out to be. Very strange, but when I read the books, I was like, man, you know, it feels like this is how it could go down. And that was me getting my feet wet. (0:44:39)

And I think that the rest of the world is starting to get their feet wet too. I really do. I feel that way. There's a lot of shows that starts out that way. They track an object coming in and then it turns out to be the mothership and makes contact. It's always a boogeyman, you know, ET. It would be nice if it just happened that easily. (0:44:59)

You know, many people, many people from many different families of ufology and from the research have theorized or put their eggs in the basket that contact can happen many different ways and most of them disastrously. And so I think that there's great ways, peaceful ways for contact to happen. And I think, I personally know of people that are talking about contact or disclosure in the near future. (0:45:26)

And there are some very peaceful scenarios that are being talked about. So I'm going to leave it at that. You know, we have the movie Arrival, which is one of my favorite films. And I like the way that contact was handled there. And then we have Three-Body Problem, right? And it's Three-Body Problem, the TV series. And compare the two of those. I can't wait for the next season of Three-Body Problem to come out. (0:45:56)

Talk about ending on a cliffhanger. All right, let's back up. Let's back up. We can stay right where we are. Or, I want to touch upon a few things. And so, my first question to start off the night was, did you have any crazy family members? Like I did. To help you along in your journey, to kind of prep you. But your first... let's go to what you've termed an involuntary recruitment. (0:46:30)

How old were you? What happened? I was 10 years old. I was in 3rd grade? 4th grade. 4th grade. It was 3rd grade when I took... Anyhow, I was 10 years old. It was 1982. And I was going to school with a kid who got... I was going to a school in rural Michigan, like out in the cornfields. And a kid was getting... drove in from the next town on a limousine. (0:46:58)

And said, my dad's an Illuminati. What's your dad do? I was in the Talented and Gifted program with him. And he was very arrogant and he was very smart. And so, I was intimidated by him and I picked on him. And so, he hated me. And he's, my dad's an Illuminati. What's your dad do? I remember that very... it stuck out. That's a memory. (0:47:16)

And his dad came in and judged the science fair in April, right after Easter. And it was a Wednesday. We set up our exhibits. (0:47:25)

---

And he said, dad, that's that boy I told you about. And that was on a Wednesday. I went back to the school records. I cross-examined them with the weather report. Because I remember in my book, there's a picture of me out in the rain puddles playing. And that was Saturday, April 17th, 1982. My dad took the picture. And I went back and reconstructed the whole series of events back then. (0:47:48)

It took me years of poking around, you know. And it all matched up the way I remembered it. And Wednesday, he said, dad, that's that boy I told you about. And on Thursday night, I had a gray ET in my bedroom. With a couple short reptilian ETs that picked me up. Paralyzed me and picked me up and carried me to the end of my bed. (0:48:07)

There was a flash of light and I was all of a sudden in a laboratory. Naked on a stainless steel table with them poking me and taking tests. And his exact words after a conversation, I was scared. At first, they did something to my life. You were conscious? Yeah, well, I woke up. When they took me out, there was a flash at the end of the bed. (0:48:31)

They carried me and I was paralyzed. I could move my eyes, but I couldn't move the rest of me. And there was a flash of light and I lost consciousness. And I woke up, like I said, without my clothes. On a stainless steel table. Sitting there. In a round gray room. With a couple grays and a reptilian standing there. And it was dark and I was terrified. (0:48:57)

And they said, you're fine, we're not going to do anything to hurt you. We're not going to kill you or nothing. They said they weren't going to hurt me. And I said, I knew you guys were real. I was like stoked all of a sudden. I thought that the world, that the next day. I thought the next day that I went and looked on the TV. They said, we're going to put you back. (0:49:16)

I thought when I looked on the TV that the aliens would be real. That it would be a disclosure. I thought it was like they landed and they got me. I thought it was brand new. At the time, that's what was going through my mind. And he said, we want to borrow your consciousness for 20 years. We need your help. They had to get my permission. (0:49:36)

The Grey told the reptile, ask him for his permission. He said, we want you to help us. You want to help us? And I was like, do what? He said, we want to borrow. Those are the exact words. We want to borrow your consciousness for 20 years. And I said, I can't do that. My mom will grow up. You know what? My mom and my sister will grow up. (0:49:55)

I won't know my family. (0:49:56)

---

He's like, no, no. We have time travel where you're going to come right back the next day. We're going to put you back. You're going to get the most valuable thing you can get. It's more time on your life. You're going to live 20 years longer than you would have. And we'll find, we want you to help us. You'll work for us. And I was like, well, what am I going to do? (0:50:12)

What job? And he said, we'll test you and find what job you're best at. And that's what you'll do. And so I concur with one of the whistleblowers. I'm not going to name names on your show. I concur that it was called the Career Return Program. So they made it sound appealing. The Career Return Program. And I said, I'll get a career. And that was it. (0:50:33)

They did a surgery on me. They laid me back on the table and did a surgery. And I woke up in Iñokurn, California, on the tail end of Project Grillflame for the Army INSCOM. And that was my first stop. And 20 years began. I had no memory of who I was. And I went from that program to a short week or two in Seattle for somebody that privately owned me and then off to Peru. And I lived in Peru. I did remote viewing. (0:51:01)

They would give me drugs and I could do remote viewing for they were running drugs. They were literally cocaine runners from a town in Peru to Colombia. And I was like their early warning system. I was like a psychic, a remote viewer. And that went on for two years. I lost the ability. They sent me back to Seattle. And I was there for two summers. (0:51:22)

And they were giving me like a cocktail of pills to take every day. And they changed the formula. And I was allergic to it. And they said, well, if you can't be here anymore, then we'll sell you to the military. And by military, I mean... Hold on for a second. I'm preaching on, Jimmy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's pump the brakes for a second. (0:51:47)

Just a quick question. So this started 11, 12 years old. Ten years. Ten. But that has nothing to do with the question. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. What I'm saying is, were you a 10-year-old doing this stuff? You go to Peru. You're there for two years. You're 12, 13 years old. So that's my question, right? That's exactly right. I lived those years doing that service. (0:52:19)

I was 10 years old in the program. And so were the other kids. There were about a dozen other kids in the program as well, about the same age. Okay. What happens next? I just want to insert this, that in my research, I found a paper from 1979, I believe. 1979, saying that they had discovered the Chinese had had effective results with remote viewers using children. (0:52:47)

And the United States was researching this, and they thought we were clones. (0:52:50)

---

They said we were clones. And who knows? Probably that's part of the tech. Long story, but they were trying to match the research of other countries in remote viewing and psycho-energetics. But yeah, fast forward. They sold me to the military, and I woke up on a train. He took me to like a box store, you know, back then. So I was in Seattle at the time, one of the islands near Seattle. He took me down the ferry. (0:53:17)

We went to a box store to the back where the garbage dumpsters were. There were two guys in a van. They gave me a shot in the arm. I lost consciousness. And I woke up on a military transport to the back of the moon. So I woke up. I gained consciousness. There was a guy. He said, I'm your chaperone. There's a guy in a military uniform. (0:53:35)

He said, if you're going to puke, there's a bag right there in the sea. You're going to be good for me, right? And I was like, of course. And that was my recruitment into the secret space program, into one of them. Okay. Kate Chase is in the chat. She's amazing. She asked a pretty good question here. What body was he in if they just took his consciousness? (0:54:03)

And that's a great question because you said earlier that they said, we're going to borrow your consciousness. It was me. So it had to be a clone. So I can't say it definitely that they cloned me and moved my consciousness over. I'm putting together looking back on it with my details. But if you go in and get a surgery, get heart surgery, and they ask you what happened, you don't know. (0:54:27)

You can put it together. Well, they put me under, and I feel like sore. So I'm trying to deduce the process from having it happen. So my main theory is that they cloned me because when I woke up in Inukert, I had no memory of mom or dad or growing up in Michigan. And at the end of it, when they put me back, I lost the memories of the 20 years and I got my memories back as if they put me back in the original body. (0:54:50)

And in my time and space, when I looked in the mirror, it was me. So I have black hair and green eyes. And so once in a while, somebody will say, wow, look at your eyes are green. That's great. That's so rare. And it was the same thing in my time and space. I was getting the same remarks from everybody about my eyes. (0:55:07)

I looked exactly the same. So it was a clone body. Also, I was badly injured in space on two occasions. And they were able to fix it. And I wonder if they just moved my consciousness into another body. Because in Inukert, I had had my shoulder dislocated on one occasion. (0:55:29)

---

And later on, when I was in Seattle, when I'd sleep wrong, it would pop, it would dislocate. I got in a combat situation on Mars and was injured. And when they fixed me, it never dislocated again. So it was like they gave me a whole new body. Again, I was put under. So I didn't witness it. I wasn't briefed about it. I didn't have rank. (0:55:50)

They would do things to me and not tell me anything about it. But when I look back on it, it seems like that was part of the technology. So the ability to take you out of your body and put you in a cloned body. And that's where you're awake, your awareness. So you're awake in this one. And the other one's just there sleeping. (0:56:08)

And they can pull you out of that, and that one wakes up, and this one goes to sleep. It's something like that. Have you... we're going to take a break here. Oh, that was quick. In just a minute. Yeah, I know, right? Have you bumped into anybody that you were actually with? Or another way to ask this question is, do you remember anybody that you were with and have you tried to seek them out? (0:56:38)

Yes, and I've had people seek me out. There's probably been five or six people throughout the years of me talking publicly that have contacted me and that I have found. There's a weird phenomenon around it. I've even talked to people that have all their memories back to me. So people that fully are conscious, and they talk to me like, you know, Tony, you're real, I know you're real, and I was here and I did this, you know, but they don't want to speak publicly about it. (0:57:04)

They got a paycheck. They'll have to pay it back if they go public. But I've spoken to people like that, and they said that there's a real phenomenon where people up there that go into the space program as clones, or in these other bodies, and go up and meet each other and fall in love with, you know, people that end up as couples up there, or people that work together for many years up there. (0:57:25)

They come back here, and even if they don't have memory, they bump into each other, even though they're on different parts of the world. They somehow subconsciously seek each other out, that that's a phenomenon they haven't explained. And I've had people that were in the program that are conscious, that have all their memories, explain that to me. And it's happened to me. Like I said, about five or six people. (0:57:44)

One guy emailed me, and he said, I remember you, and that was messed up what you did. I said, I'm still mad. And I was like, what are you talking about? And then he proceeded to describe an incident that only somebody that was there could know. (0:57:58)

---

There was no, I had never spoken about it, and I had very clear memory, and he had the exact same memories, and described it exactly how it was. And so we became friends, and he flirted with talking publicly about his experiences, but he was immediately attacked by his friends and family, so he walked away from it. It's not easy. Is it possible, we're going to head to a break. (0:58:22)

Is it possible, this is not a leading question. Is it possible that these experiences and memories were just implanted? Anything's possible, man. And so I always preface it with, look, I'm telling you, like I said, I don't know if I was cloned. Or age regressed, like some people postulate is possible. I don't know, but I'm telling you what it's like for me to experience it, because I was unconscious for many procedures. (0:58:57)

And so I, yeah, I'm the first to admit, like, I'm open to another version of events that makes more sense. But giving me fake memories doesn't make any sense, because I was a little kid from a small town in Michigan. I grew up to be a wood floor refinisher, so why wouldn't you do this to a politician? Or somebody in Hollywood. Why would you do this to a 10-year-old kid? (0:59:20)

And then me carry the PTSD, and then me figure out all this stuff after the fact, and go searching in 2023, you know, years later I go to Inyo Kern and then find the building. You know what I mean? Like, I question the motive of that theory. That's the thing. I'm not saying it's not possible. I don't think it's likely in my perspective. I don't think that's what happened. (0:59:42)

And I sure would think that, you know, it's kind of like how they say space is fake, or the moon landing was fake. It's easier to just go to the moon than to fake it. It was easier to just fly to the moon than pull off the faking it. So, you know, a lot of people deduce that. And I feel the same way. It'd be easier for it all to just be true rather than put these memories in my brain. (1:00:06)

Because I'm still living my normal life. And the other thing is, the technology that I remember works. Still. So I've been pulling stuff apart. I've been reverse engineering stuff. The remote viewing, the psychoenergetics. There's declassified... there's stuff that's still classified in the remote viewing realm that works and that I know still. So why would they give me classified information and then let me run loose in southern Michigan? (1:00:35)

You know what I'm saying? There's a why that needs to be answered with that. But I don't... it's not a rock I'll die on, man. Because I experienced something and I'm trying to sort it out the same as anybody. Let's take our break right here. Our guest tonight, Tony Rodriguez, is here. (1:00:54)

---

It's going to be a continued amazing conversation tonight.

(skip advertisement)

(transcript 2of2)

（以下は "Ep. 2194 Tony Rodrigues Project Starmaker" と題されたpodcast の文字起こしの後半部分です。ゲストの語り手は Tony Rodrigues で、聞き手は番組ホストの Jimmy Church です。）

Fade to Black. I am your host, Jimmy Church tonight. Tony Rodriguez is with us. A show that is nine years in the making. But we're doing it tonight. Tony, you called me... Oh, you're muted. Unmute yourself. Okay. You called me nine years ago, ten years ago, nine years ago. And you gave me a word. Like a codeine. A word that only... You had told me that only somebody that has gone through your experiences would know. (1:05:37)

I'm not going to say the word or if I even remember. But I'm not going to do that. But have you used that with somebody that has reached out to you? (1:05:50)

---

And then you called bullshit. So, I don't like to call bullshit. The thing is, I realize that it's a big enough thing out there. Like, I was a cargo engineer. I didn't really have a lot of knowledge of what was really going on everywhere. I wasn't even allowed to go in as much as half of the ship I was on. I was on a big ship that did cargo mission trade. (1:06:16)

And I wasn't even allowed to see half of it. And so, there's a lot I don't know. And there's a lot of people that have come forward. There's a lot of info. In my mind, I'm thinking, this is bullshit. This is a person that just wants attention. Or they stole this. They hypnotized somebody that was real and they stole their info. Or they're a hacker and they're hacking people that are real and they want to get attention and put a cobble together, a career doing this, which ain't worth it. (1:06:40)

And so, there's people like, man, that's bullshit. And you can tell when someone's lying. Like, there's people that are very truthful about what happened to them, but they're liars just naturally. And so, that kind of calls into question the motivation, right? But it's not up to... Because I know that if I go around and start saying that publicly, this guy's crap, this guy, this one, I don't believe this, then it's all going to just come right back at me. (1:07:07)

They're all going to be ego-driven and just attack. And I've sustained some very heavy personal attacks in the years by talking like this. So, I try to remain neutral and not call BS. But yeah, man, there's common denominators that after you experience it, it's kind of like people that were in Vietnam, guys that were in Vietnam together, and then you try to fake it and say you were in Vietnam too, they're going to smell it on you. (1:07:33)

And it's the same way with going through something like this, that you can see, you can feel it, that someone's being genuine. But I just am not the authority on it, and I don't want to paint myself as that, like I'm going to tell you guys who's right and who's wrong. I like to offer my info, and hopefully it helps you in your search for the truth about other things that are hidden from us. (1:07:57)

And that's kind of all I got. But yeah, you can tell when some people are full of it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And the BS meter in this community just has to be up. But you know what the problem with that is for me? Just like you said, I've seen crazy stuff. And when I talk about my experiences, which now I haven't experienced crazy, but I've seen some stuff that is completely outrageous. (1:08:40)

And to have that come out of my mouth, I realize how insane it sounds. All right, but that doesn't change the experience. (1:08:49)

---

It just doesn't. So when I speak about these things, all I ask is to give me the same respect that I give others. That's all. That's all. Just give me that. Just hear me out. The blessing that I have in most cases, I've had people around me to experience this too as well. It keeps me a little more grounded. When you experience something by yourself, it's just a story. (1:09:30)

That's all it is. It's your crazy uncle that caught the fish. He's by himself and he threw it or whatever. Well, it becomes one of those stories. And that's one thing. But when you have people that are around you and I'm able to repeat it, all I ask for is just give me the same respect that I give others. Why would I disbelieve somebody? (1:09:58)

At least hear them out. And see if they can get to the end of the story without messing it up. Absolutely. You've got to almost live and die by that in this field. The other thing is you've got to also take into account that there's industrial-grade, advanced space-age technology from ETs, memory wiping going on. So people are defeating it, getting their memories back, or getting bits and pieces, and they're trying to connect the dots. (1:10:35)

So it might sound, you go, that doesn't make any sense. They're connecting the dots, but the dots they're connecting are truthful. You get what I'm saying? They just don't have it all yet. It's a lifetime sentence to start remembering and actually internalize that you were abducted by extraterrestrials or by the government and put in a program and then put back with your memories deleted. (1:11:01)

Once you start to get those fringed, those residual memories, it's a life sentence. You're always going to be remembering, struggling to remember more. And so I think a lot of testimonies sound really kooky because they've connected the dots. They don't have all the memories. They're trying to make it make sense. And they go, well, maybe that's exactly what happened to her over here. (1:11:22)

And they're not dishonest. They're mistaken. They're just not accurate. And that's what I see out of people that I think that, like you said, that you would call BS on. I would call BS, but that's like some of the stuff they're saying is true. And they're just trying to make sense of it. Without experiencing having a chunk of your life erased and then fighting to get those memories back daily. (1:11:47)

You know what I mean? I give people that are experiencing that genuinely a wide berth. And so I'm just aware of that. And I think most people are so skeptical. If you hear this, a skeptical person, they want to just fight you tooth and nail about every little detail. And it's like you have to give them a witness that had their memory erased a little bit of leeway. (1:12:10)

Now, David Grush got up in Congress on the Hill and said some pretty amazing things. (1:12:19)

---

And I think a lot of us in the community were jumping up and down with joy. I was. That this stuff was being said in public in a setting like that. Where, you know, you're raising your right hand and going through this. And Congress took it pretty well. And they asked, I think, the best questions that they could, given what they were being told. (1:12:48)

It was pretty crazy stuff. Do you see a time when somebody like yourself would get up and raise the right hand and swear that everything is the truth? And get up in front of Congress and testify? I would. You know, I was asked by a show if I would take a lie detector test. And I said, well, first, I don't believe in lie detectors. (1:13:14)

And everybody ever told me never take one. Every lawyer ever. They said never take a lie detector test. But I would. I would take it. Yeah, I mean, I'm not afraid of it. And I'm not deceptive, you know. But I would give my testimony. I don't think Congress, where they left off in that conversation, is ready for my testimony yet. I'll tell you this... Lie detectors... let me say this. (1:13:36)

I took one official lie detector test in my life for employment, right? And I lied through the entire thing. I did. I did. Questions were coming up about, you know, drugs or this or that. And I was just like, man, you know, no, no, no, no. So anyway, I just thought, well... That's exactly it. So I got the job, right? Not only did I get the job, but I asked my boss. (1:14:17)

I said, so that lie detector test, man, you know. And this guy that... anyway, I don't want to get into detail. He goes, yeah, man, you passed with flying colors. He loved you. You said you were 100% honest. And I'm thinking, well, I'm not scared of that shit anymore. I'm telling you, man. It was probably 15 minutes, maybe a half hour long. I can't remember exactly. (1:14:40)

But it got to a point in the middle section of this where I lied on every single question, man, for probably 10 minutes. Every single one. Every single... and I passed. Didn't work. That's kind of my point with that. But I was asked by a show and they were like... And I tried to say that and they looked at me like, oh, you're lying. (1:15:02)

That's why. And I said, look, I'll take the test. I'll do it. I don't care. I'm not afraid of it. You know, I'm too stupid to be a good liar. I really am. I'm too scatterbrained. So, you know, I try to be truthful as I can about everything. Right, right, right. I had to get old before I got my couth and started to keep my mouth shut about things that were hurting me. (1:15:21)

Right, right. Couth is a good word. (1:15:23)

---

Couth is a good word. I just felt that, and this is probably why I passed, my mind had said loudly to myself during this, they don't have any right to this information. And that's it. So, no, no, no, no, no. That's personal and it has nothing to do with anything. And that's it. And so that's probably why I was so relaxed and truthful because I was being truthful. (1:15:58)

You don't have a right to this. But it was crazy to me. It was crazy how, oh, yeah, man. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You are 100% truthful. Okay. All right. Whatever. The David Grush testimony and where Congress is at now and the actual, they've disclosed the technology that can go to space. So they've watched these craft and they've told us openly that these craft can go from the ocean into space in a minute and right back again. (1:16:29)

So most people kind of, the heaviness of that or the reality of that, I think a lot of people haven't realized because it renders science inert. Like our science, the scientists have been telling us it's impossible to go to another star. Suddenly doesn't have an answer for these things that are on these videos for the energy output. And so it's a very profound statement that Congress and these people have swore it on under oath to say that. (1:16:58)

It's a big deal. So it's the dam breaking, literally the dam of secrecy beginning to crack. It's a major crack. But it's going to be a ways before they can admit that there's a Mars Colony Corporation or a Ceres Colony Corporation or a Luna Colony Corporation, which there are, and there have been for a long time. And there are literally a few million people living in our solar system and colonies that have been up there for 50, 60 years or more. (1:17:24)

What is... and I want to get back to your first trip to the moon. But what if we continue with our privatization of space, certainly within our star system, and Elon does make it to Mars on a private trip to Mars. What are they going to find? What are they going to see? And we're talking about, you know, potential 4K live streaming, you know, on Twitter. On Mars, it depends on where they land. (1:18:01)

They might land in a hotbed of local indigenous life forms. You know, they could discover life right on the spot or they could land somewhere that's barren. And for miles in each direction, there's literally nothing but sandy rocks. Nothing of importance. So my guess is that they'll land in one of those spots, which they're already well aware where those are. And that'll be the place that they set up camp and it'll look like they're all alone for a while. (1:18:27)

Unless they plan on... I think we're going to have a disclosure before that. I really do. Does... is there... would we be the only life on Mars? (1:18:39)

---

Or is there extraterrestrial life on Mars? There's indigenous life on Mars. There's insectoids. There's plant life. There's things that live on Mars under the surface that survived since the planet became dormant. I guess the... what's the term for it? For it losing its volcanism and being dormant and the atmosphere being blown away. But there's... yeah, there's life there. They're going to... There are large insectoids that live inside Mars. That they were... we were dealing with when I was there. (1:19:17)

And this is something that you saw yourself? Yes. And you had said earlier... I feel like I'm an attorney. You had said earlier, Mr. Rodriguez. You said earlier that you were just a cargo dude. So, were you a cargo dude on Mars? No, that... so that was the first program when they took... So, like you said, let's go back to the moon. Okay. They took me there and they gave me a bunch of surgeries. (1:19:46)

Back to back to back. Like, it was like they were putting stuff in me. I... you know, the question of the air on Mars comes up. I think there was a lung implant. Like a device that they put... a little device they put in your lung. But they gave me a bunch of surgeries. They were putting hardware in me. And they were training us to be support soldiers. (1:20:05)

To put numbers on the battlefield against these insectoids. Versus they had... you know, what's the word? Space marines. They had marines that were heavily armed. Very well equipped with armor that could turn color. Like, they were very advanced. Very expensive soldiers. They couldn't just crank these guys out. They were well trained and they were expensive. So, they were trying to make a soldier that was a minimum that could support these guys. (1:20:34)

And have numbers on the ground to match the insectoids. That was the program that I went into first. I was trained as a support soldier and I went to Mars. And we were doing hiking missions and engaging these things. And they canceled it. They found... they determined that the insectoids adapted to the strategy faster than they were supposed to. Like, they had a... So, the insectoids weren't our friends. (1:20:58)

They weren't happy to see us. Yeah, right. Well, they're territorial. So, they were fine with us being there. But not in their territory. They're very territorial. And there were things that they wanted to study within their territory. So, they wanted to take territory from them to study, I don't know, ancient artifacts. For whatever reason. And so, they were trying to figure out a way to do it cheaper. (1:21:21)

They were trying to get soldiers... guys like me that were clones or just minimal trained, minimally equipped. For bait, if you will. You know, to put bodies on the battlefield. So, to have some value. And they pulled the program. And then they took me from there to an underground city. (1:21:42)

---

A city that's underground in Mars. And they retrained me. They gave me aptitude tests to see what I was good at. And they retrained me. And I was ship maintenance. And then they shipped me off to the Ceres Colony Corporation on the Ceres planetoid. And I worked in ship maintenance on a craft for about 8 years after that. It was Groundhog Day. It was boring. (1:22:04)

And then that craft got decommissioned. And they retrained me to be cargo engineer. My last 2 or 3 years up there, I was cargo engineer. And had a life, I guess. That was the only time that I had any real freedom up there when I got a paycheck. Sorry, I must sound crazy to you guys. But it's true. No, no, no. I'm absorbing it to the best of my ability. (1:22:29)

When you arrived on the moon, did you know that you were on the moon? Yeah, oh yeah. So when we flew up, they had... You know, remember, they don't do it so much anymore. But when you take a flight from Detroit to Honolulu, the pilot used to call out, like, hey, we're over Death Valley and the temperature is there. The pilot used to tell you when you were flying over landmarks back in the day, back in the 80s and 90s when you were flying. (1:22:53)

They might still do it. Yeah, look out your left window and you will see the Grand Canyon. Yes. It still happens from time to time. It's very rare. I fly every single week, and it's getting less and less personal. That's right. Yeah, for sure. Well, that's what they did when we pulled up to the moon. So he said, on your right, there's a base here, and it's military. (1:23:17)

We're not going to that one. We're going to this next one. And it was built in so-and-so. He gave the spiel on the base. And so we were fully aware, and we went inside under it and came out, and it looked pretty run-of-the-mill. It was a building with court hallways and doors, like an office building. That's what it looked like. And then it got kind of tight in some spots. (1:23:41)

But they said it was based on the design of the Pentagon, that they saved money. They used the Pentagon schematics and then adapted them for that building because the Pentagon was made to resist nuclear war. So that architectural design was easy to convert to a building that would be in a vacuum. So they saved money. What about the obvious question? And I'm trying not to be cavalier. I'm not cracking a joke. (1:24:13)

But what about gravity? What about gravity? Because we've seen the videos, the alleged videos, of the Apollo missions and the effect of gravity or the lack of gravity strength that we have here on Earth because of the mass of the Moon. What was gravity like? Normal. Normal. So they have artificial gravity. (1:24:41)

---

They called it gravimattin. So the Germans up there, gravimattin. It was a thick flooring that they pieced together that was artificial gravity. There were beings that came... I'm talking about Ceres now. The Moon had it. Everywhere had it. Mars. When we walked out on our missions, I would walk in the base. They'd open the doors and the airlock. We'd walk out and then it would be light. (1:25:04)

Mars is like half the gravity of the Earth. The Moon is like one-sixth. But Ceres was even less. Ceres is a small planetoid, so it was microgravity. And they had artwork. Imagine going into a restaurant and there's a big glass case where there's things floating in there. They had the gravity turned off. They had artwork that was based like that. And there were beings that came from heavy gravity or low gravity areas and they would wear a bracelet or a jewelry and the floor would adjust to their gravity for them walking by. (1:25:42)

So you would feel it sometimes if a being... They tended to be tall and skinny. And the beings that came from heavy-gravity planets tended to be short and stocky. But when a being walked by you from a lighter gravity, you could feel like a little residual. They're a bubble of low gravity around them. And they would pass you on the street and you could feel it. (1:26:03)

Because the floor would adjust around them. The interior... Okay, so when we look at Ridley Scott's version of these deep space interstellar ships, these were ships that... Now it's artistic license, but that have been out there for a very long time. And so they were leaking. You saw stuff dripping. It was used. And because it was so massive, it wasn't spotlessly clean. Actually, it was the opposite of that. (1:26:47)

It was always in disrepair. And a lot of effort was constant every single day for the crew to keep the ship running. But like I said, things were leaking. You would see stuff dripping. What was the interior of the ships that you were on? What were they like? The first one was a converted submarine. It was an old submarine that was converted into a spaceship. (1:27:14)

When I did ship maintenance, that's where I worked in the bottom decks. It looked like a naval ship. It was industrial pipes running everywhere. And we had to top off levels of fluids. We cut valves that were faulty and re-welded new valves in it. We did a lot of that kind of work. It was like I'm a naval vessel. And it was filthy where we were. (1:27:37)

And then I couldn't tell. There was no window. And I couldn't tell if we were moving or not. We would get in the ship from the hangar and go. And that's what I said. It was Groundhog Day. It was hyper boring. I was suicidal. I was so bored. It was such a terrible job. (1:27:51)

---

But later on, when that ship got decommissioned, it broke down more often. And they finally decommissioned it. Then I got onto a modern ship. And they had leased the chassis. The Ceres Colony Corporation leased the chassis of the ship from an ET species. And they had it docked in the hangar bay. And they fitted it with human things like water fountains and bathrooms and little galleys. (1:28:17)

They fitted it with human stuff. So they put plastic wall up, like plastic little wall coverings in the rear of the ship. The front of the ship was fancy. It was plush. It was good looking. It had thick glass in some walls. It looked like a really high-tech office building in the front of the ship. And when you got halfway to the midsection and the hallway going to the back, then it started to get more and more industrial looking. (1:28:48)

When you talk about Ridley Scott and all the ships, so they were mostly smooth on the outside. Hollywood has always got these jagged edges and the ships, all these squares, they're really super complicated. They were smooth. The ships were all smooth and stealthy. So if we're flying by other planets that they don't want to be discovered, there's rules about making contact out there. (1:29:11)

So they stealthed their ships. They're stealthy. They're designed. And the inside of them was not as complicated as Hollywood made. Hollywood's got lights everywhere and all the, you know what I mean, like the glowy stuff. Ours was a pretty Spartan ship. The description that you said of the first ship being a naval and possibly a submarine, what was its propulsion system? There were like, so I, later on, early on, so this is something that I've deduced recently in the last couple years, is that I think it was a catamaran. (1:29:50)

I think that there were two of them that they put together. They put tunnel, they put them together, and they had tanks. There was a radioactive, they were nuclear powered, and there was a radioactive material. We had to deal with, we had to constantly deal with a highly corrosive, acidic, like a radioactive, acidic fluid that would eat the pipes up. And this stuff would circle around it, and they had to purge it. (1:30:17)

So when they were about to fly, we heard them purge, we heard the fluids kick on in the pipes. It was like, we were aware of that. And so it was, and it was radioactive. And so we had areas, they were like, okay, now get out of this area. The computer would say, you had to wait here while this purged, by those tank purges. (1:30:36)

And then we could go in that area and work again, because they were juggling radioactive material. But that's all I know. Like I said, we were working on just individual systems, and it was mindless. It was like a software program. In the morning, it would say, I had a number, I didn't have a name. (1:30:56)

---

It said, you know, number 576, you go to the tool crib and pull this tool and this tool in return. And I would go do it and say, you, number 581, you do take this tool. There was three of us. And we would split up, and then it would say, when I returned, it was like, now go to this section. It would show me on the map, go to this section, take this cover off and open this up and check this level. (1:31:17)

And then return. And I would come back and say, now input the data. I'd put it in, and it gave me step-by-step instructions all day long. That was what we did. And surprisingly, the training was mostly about fire hazard, what to do if there was a fire or a spill or something. That was the real training I got was emergency stuff. And using the tools and everything. (1:31:42)

The computer told you how to do everything. What was the purpose of that? I'm going to call it the catamaran sub, right? What was the purpose of that? You mentioned interstellar trade. Was that the mission of this particular craft? Like I said, they put us in the lower decks. The crew would call down on a microphone and say, check this out. There was an intercom system. (1:32:10)

There was only a few occasions that even somebody else came in the room with us. And so I had really not much... We flew around in the solar system. I know we went to the moon. It dropped us at the moon sometimes. And we went around the solar system. So I don't really know what that ship did. It wasn't until I went on the bigger ship that I got promoted. (1:32:33)

And I sat in on the mission briefings and I knew our stops. And those last few years on that bigger ship was when I really had an idea of what was going on. Well, that's typical of the military, isn't it? An example, you want a classic example of this? When Napoleon went to Egypt, he took 50,000 troops with him, right? Multiple ships, transport ships, logistics ships, stuff with cannon on it and everything else. (1:33:07)

Support vessels, troop transport, all of that. 50,000 troops, okay? Nobody, and that includes the scientists that he had. He had 150 scientists and archaeologists and artists and so forth. Nobody, except for the captains of the ships, knew where they were going. Nobody, nobody. So there was 49,950 people on that ship going to Egypt that didn't know they were going to Egypt. That's just what you do in the military. (1:33:47)

Happens all the time. Happens all the time. You don't know what the mission is. You don't know where you're going. You'll find out when you get there. And that's what happened. You need to know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, you need to know. Very typical. What were, if you knew, if you know, what was traded? (1:34:08)

---

Man, we traded everything. We took people. We took soldiers. They were dudes in like an armor. They were big armored units and they would sit still. They were probably, they didn't need to sleep. We filled up the cargo bay with them. We took massive 50-gallon drums, barrels. We took clothes, plants, coffee, missiles. We took everything. It didn't matter. We had a package. Like I said, we had a sample package that we kept in the lower bay that we would give and it would show all the things. (1:34:49)

One of the profitable things that we traded most of the time that they were very excited when we got a deal was pharmaceuticals. Believe it or not. Planting, so if you take a coffee plant, and here's how I had it explained to me and how I remember it. If you take a coffee plant from Earth and you take it to another planet that's got a very similar gravity and climate and everything, the same as Earth, somewhere else, and you plant the coffee plant and it lives, in a few generations it will be a completely different coffee. (1:35:25)

It will be a completely different chemical makeup because it will adapt to the environment. So coffee from Earth was valuable because it was unique. So coffee from a different, you know, we took pharmaceuticals from plant life in our local area or from other areas that we would import and make it into stuff, and that was a big part of the trade that we did. (1:35:49)

But they took everything. I remember we loaded army boots one time, like 10,000 pairs of army boots we got at Diego Garcia and took it to Ceres and we had a place out past the Kuiper Belt, a chunk of ice, a big ice world that they used as a warehouse. So we'd go out there and drop off stuff just to keep it in storage. (1:36:10)

Couldn't they 3D print their own army boots? Yeah, but it was easy. What was so unique about something like that here? You know why? Because it didn't cost them nothing. It didn't even have to take the time to print it. So they did have the ability to molecularly build things, but it takes time. And so it was easier just to tell, because the Earth Colony Corporation does business and they have an account, so they could give the Earth Colony Corporation a math formula and have all the goods they want. (1:36:48)

So it was easier for them to just go pick them up that are made here, where there's factories and gravity. Okay, okay. And what were we trading for? What were we getting back? So the mission was... It kind of gives me a kick. I get a kick out of saying this. Our mission was not to boldly go and seek out new life and new civilization. (1:37:09)

That was not the mission. When I got to sit in on the mission briefings on the ship, when I was promoted to cargo engineer, they explained to me that in no uncertain terms, that we could lie, cheat, and steal, and our mission was to get technology, period. (1:37:29)

---

Under any means necessary. Primarily with trade, but they would trade and get in. We stole, we lifted stuff from worlds, from ETs, from reptiles. One time we did a mission and we lifted... There was like an oil from this heavy gravity planet. It was an oil that was like 500 times more potent than Earth oil. And they wanted to get an idea of the chemical makeup, see if they could reproduce it, and the reptiles wouldn't give it to us. (1:37:59)

They didn't know them. It was like a secret sauce. And so we landed and acted like we were buying other stuff, and we pinched a couple of barrels of it and got out of there. And that's why the colonies are not on the surface. So they're not only hiding from us finding them. If you look at the Dawn Probe Circled series, it didn't see any buildings. (1:38:23)

It didn't see anything. They're not hiding from Earth. They're hiding from the other ETs that they might piss off. And this is the way it is in space. So nature extends beyond the sky, and you're talking about trillions of worlds. If you piss off a thousand of them by robbing them, they're not even going to find you. It's a big place. Especially if they're lesser technology. (1:38:46)

And that's why security and that's why belonging... we hear about the Galactic Federation of Worlds or the Orion, these big groups. That's why belonging to a group is necessary to go through space. It's kind of like they gang up. So for security reasons. Didn't we photograph City Lights on Ceres? We photographed a pile of salt. And thanks for leading... thanks for teeing this up for me, Jimmy. This is one of my highlights of my career. (1:39:17)

Well, those were amazing friggin' photographs, man. So the bright spots in the Ocado Crater, when the Dawn Probe was getting there in early 16, I believe... I could be wrong. When it was getting there, I was working with Dr. Sala from exopolitics.org, and he was researching me and pinging against other people. And he said, Tony, NASA says that it's not... You said it's salt, because it's a geyser. (1:39:44)

I remember that there's a geyser that goes off in that crater every six to nine years or so. And the water goes up and then evaporates into space, and it snows salt back down. And that's the white spots. Big meters deep of salt, like tons and tons of salt. And he said the original NASA determination was that it was sulfur and a cocktail of other things. (1:40:11)

And he said, do you want to retract your statement? And I said, no, absolutely not. If there's one thing I remember from my time up there, it was watching that geyser. It was one of the most beautiful things I saw. And I know it was salt. We had a conversation. We joked about it for weeks afterwards. We talked about the salt. (1:40:27)

---

And I said, no, absolutely not. I will not retract mine. I don't care what NASA says. They're wrong. This was in 2016. August 10th, 2020, NASA finally released the finding, because Dawn Probe was high orbit. And when it went to a lower orbit, it got a proper analysis. And sure enough, they confirmed it was briny salt. So that was one... I don't have a lot of evidence of the time and space. (1:40:51)

I have a ton of evidence in Earth. I got a ton of evidence from Inukern and Seattle and Peru. I found a lot of the things that I remembered that I shouldn't have known about. And even the remote viewing, the projects, I don't have a ton of evidence from time and space. I can't go to Mars and be like, that's where that spot was. (1:41:10)

But knowing the salt, four years ahead of NASA, is my biggest piece of evidence for my supporting that I was in space working as well. Now, the ability to wipe memories doesn't seem to be perfect to me. It doesn't seem to be perfect science. Because if it was, you wouldn't remember anything. And most people have... What's funny, to cover that, the first 30 minutes they never erased. (1:41:44)

The initial seeing an ET in my room, that first memory didn't get erased. I woke up wondering what the hell just happened, kind of thing. But what do you go with that? What do you go with that as a 10-year-old boy? Are you going to tell somebody? So there's pitfalls. What I've found is that people that were taken in the same time frame as me, in the early 80s, get a lot of their memories back. (1:42:12)

And people that were taken in the 90s, or the mid-90s, they got better at erasing your memory. They only get little bits and pieces. So, that seems to be the case. That they got better at it. And the memory process, when I remember what they were putting me through at the end, it was like industrial-grade hypnosis. So they were injecting me, like regions of the brain, they'd inject me with some chemical, and then I would watch a hypnosis thing, like in a booth. (1:42:43)

They put you in a booth, and it was like a hypnosis movie, and it would target that region of the brain, whatever that was, you know, like names. They'd make you forget the names only. And then they'd do it again. You'd go to a different form of hypnosis, a different chemical, and they would make you forget faces, or three-dimensional things. And it was a process. (1:43:04)

It wasn't just one pill that they gave you, a pill you forgot. So, there was a process over there. They were hypnotizing me to voluntarily not remember. And a lot of people have problems in the beginning, when they begin to get memories, and I certainly did, of you get sleepy, or you get disinterested, or hungry, or depressed. (1:43:25)

---

You start to brush in, the memories start to come, and you go, whoa, man, I sure got sleepy all of a sudden. And so, I started thinking about it in the morning, right when I woke up. There was a certain memory that I could remember the beginning of it, and I was like, what happened next? And I'd always get sleepy. And so, I started thinking about it in the morning, and sure enough, I would get sleepy. (1:43:47)

I'd get out of bed, get a coffee, and try to remember what happened next, and get sleepy again. It was the weirdest, damnedest thing. But people were asking me legitimate questions, like, who cut your hair? What was the bathroom like? What did you brush your teeth with? And I didn't remember those things at first, in the early years. You only remember the big events. (1:44:10)

And I was like, damn, if it's real, I should remember it. And it took me a while, and sure enough, that was the trick, was thinking about it in the morning. I remember the buzzer going off in the day, in the barracks. The buzzer would go off, I'd wake up, go shower. And I was like, when did I brush my teeth? And I would just start thinking about it. (1:44:29)

And it would make me sleepy. I would have all these weird things. But after a couple, about a month of it, thinking about putting my head to it every day, I went, oh, God, they were disposable. We had little disposable toothbrushes that were clear plastic. You'd rip it, and you'd brush your teeth and throw it away. And the memory came. And so, I'd give that advice. (1:44:48)

I have a memory course that I have on my website for people. There were so many people that I dealt with in the beginning, I just made a video about it. I think it's like 40 bucks or something. I don't even remember. Here is where I ask anybody to think about what I'm about to say. All right? Every day. Brushing teeth is a very interesting thing to look at. (1:45:17)

Every day, when I cook dinner after the show, because I eat dinner after the show is done, right? That's my 5 p.m. to everybody else. And I go, and I start cooking, and I say to myself, okay, what did I have to eat today? I don't remember. What did I have to eat? Right? And I would stop, and I have to stop and think. (1:45:41)

So don't sit here and tell me you remember everything of every day of your mundane ass life. Because I don't. Do I remember brushing my teeth today? I don't care. I did. It was the same as yesterday. Did anything stand out about me putting on my facial scrub today when I shaved? I did it yesterday. That's right. The mundane doesn't. Right, right. Is there anything that stands out? (1:46:14)

I'm going to tell you right now. (1:46:15)

---

I don't remember what I had to eat today. I don't. What did I have to... Oh! Okay. All right. I had a salad. I didn't. I just remember. I had to think about it. Right? And so I ask that of anybody. I'm not saying that that legitimizes your story, Tony. I'm not at all. Right? I'm listening. And I love it. What I am saying is when somebody else comes at you or comes at me and says, Okay, man, what did you have for breakfast when you were on that cruise to Alaska on Tuesday? (1:46:57)

On the ship. I... What? Right. Are you kidding me right now? Did you take a shower on that cruise? Dude, I don't remember anything about that cruise. But... I'm not saying it backs up anything. What I'm saying is before somebody wants to get critical on the mundane details of things, stop and think about what you're asking. What did the ship smell like? Well, it sounds legit at first, but I can't tell you the interior smells of everything that I've ever done. (1:47:33)

The things I say, you legitimately people... I always tell people, look, if you're not skeptical about what I'm saying, it'd be weird. So if everybody just believed me... If everybody believed everything I said and wasn't skeptical at all, that'd be weird. So I... My problem is most skeptics just want to go straight to fighting and calling me names. They don't even want to talk about it. (1:47:56)

You know what I mean? They don't want to be friendly at all. I'm going to beat you up. I've had that. But conversely, about the memory thing... One thing that I always try to help with people that are in the middle of recovering legitimate memories that are going through the... Because that's a scary process. Once it begins, it doesn't stop. Conversely, you do remember the things that mattered. (1:48:19)

So what did you have for dinner on your 21st birthday? Right? So when you think about that, you were going out... Most people were going out having a drink. And so you can kind of remember that day. Or your 16th. Or your 18th. When you got your driver's license. What was the first place you went when you had your car the first time? (1:48:39)

That was a long time ago. But it has a big emotional context. A big emotional anchor. A tag. It's got an emotional tag on it. And when you start to assign and look at the emotional feelings... So okay, so you were in space. There was ETs there. What was your emotion? I was scared shitless. Okay, well then, could you see the floor? What did the floor look like? (1:49:04)

I don't remember. Well, try to tell me. Was there a switch on the wall? Was there a doorknob? Was there some... And they go, I don't know. And then you give them time. And they go, you know what? The floor had this checker pattern. (1:49:18)

---

You know what I mean? Because the emotion... I said, well, key on the emotion. You were scared. What were you scared of? You know what I'm saying? Think about being scared and then tell me what the floor looked like. And so when you look at emotional tags in these memories, you want to pry your way into them. And people do. People do make progress when they really do the homework. (1:49:41)

Yeah, memory is a funny thing. Just today, I had a very strange experience. It has nothing to do with ET. But it has everything to do with an incredible memory and experience that I had. But I see a headline. And the headline today says that Juneau, Alaska is about to get flooded from glacier runoff. Now, I was at that glacier. Okay? I went there six months ago, eight months ago. (1:50:19)

Not long. I was there. I couldn't remember the name of the glacier. Now, let me be clear. I'm talking about a giant, breathtaking, huge, ginormous glacier coming off the mountains and descending into the water. Okay? I couldn't remember the name of it. And I was there. So, I started reading the article. And there it is. The Mendenhall Glacier. I was like, oh, that's right. (1:50:56)

Now, I was there. And I talked about it for a long time. The Mendenhall Glacier. But in the moment today, when I'm reading the headline, I could not remember the name of the glacier. A freaking glacier! You know what I mean? Like, how could you forget that? And I did. And I just stopped. And I'm thinking, this is my old age. You know, what's going on here? (1:51:20)

Well, this stuff happened. Do I remember what I was wearing that day at the Mendenhall Glacier? That's my question. What's the first thing you remember about the visit? Drinking the water. So, there was an emotional... Yeah, yeah. I remember drinking the water. I got down in the glacier water. And it was freaking ice cold, by the way, as you can imagine. Right? And I scooped it up and drank it right out of... Dude, just right... And then I just splashed my... Right? (1:51:58)

And the taste of the glacier water and the feeling and the ice coldness of it was extraordinary. It was extraordinary. Yeah. And that's... I don't remember really getting there. I kind of do. I don't remember leaving. I kind of do. You worked at it. But, yeah, yeah. But the drinking of it... Yeah, you can't forget that because it was a highlight. You know, it was an emotional high. (1:52:27)

And so, that's what we see when people get their memories back of an abduction. The emotional high... The big spikes in emotional... Those are the memories that come. And the rest, they go, well, what happened? And when they get into the mundane parts of it, it doesn't make sense. Or, we see people kind of stretch. Stretch it as best they can. (1:52:48)

---

And so, that's why, to a really skeptical, discernible researcher, they look like a lot of things are gibberish. There's a lot of real truths in there that people are trying to share. But, again, such a foggy, distant memory, it's very difficult. What happened for me was, researching it, all the memories came back at once. And then, I had the unique situation of talking about it all the time. (1:53:22)

So, after I went... It was about a year that I researched and worked with researchers. And then, I started doing interviews on YouTube and talking about it all the time. You go, oh, yeah, that's right. Me and you run into each other. Next time we see each other, I'm going to ask you about the glacier. And so, the more you talk about it, the more the memories will come back. (1:53:45)

We should do that. We should do that. I have... Okay. I had somebody come up to me this past weekend. I was in Virginia, hosting a conference. And I had somebody come up, a major person, researcher, right? Come up to me and say, Jimmy, that show that we did was my favorite. It was the best thing ever. And I went, oh, cool, cool. (1:54:24)

And I'm thinking to myself, she was on the show? I was like, oh, crap. But, you know, I had to do the dance. You know, I had to do the dance. And I go up to Michelle. I go, we did a show? She goes, yeah, man, it was great. It's just like, oh, man. I'm going to tell you right now, if I bump into you, and it's a year or two from now... I won't remember shit. (1:54:56)

I won't remember it. I won't hold it against you, man. You can just tell me, I don't remember, Tony. What's your name again? I'll be like, it's me, Tony. I know, I know. It's really bad. I won't be insulted. And I'll tell you why. And I'm not, again, I'm not being facetious, okay? Every show kicks ass. All right? Right. So, how much better does the show have to be to outshine what I did yesterday, or the day before, or the day before, or the day before, or the day before, or the day before? (1:55:32)

Right? So, that's one of the reasons why. They're all fantastic for their own. And I get that question, so what was your favorite show? Wow, man, what? The last one? You know, that's really the way to look at it. They're all great. So, what would have to happen on a show? I remember a couple of bad shows. Those stand out. Yeah, those stand out. (1:56:06)

Negative emotional memory. Yes, exactly right, man. Exactly right. But the rest of it, all the shows are great. And yeah, when you get to this amount of storage space in my brain, yeah, it's difficult for me to... Now, but I can sit and think about it and go, oh, that's right. (1:56:32)

---

Yeah, okay. I do remember that show. But in the moment, no. No. And trust me, this was somebody that, if I said their name out loud right now, everybody would go, what? You don't remember that? I don't. Man, it was, I swear. But I've gotten really good at doing the dance, though. Yeah, man, that was a great show. I loved it. And then, by the way, what a great conference, huh? (1:57:02)

It's immediately what you do. Tony, where can everybody reach out to you, man? So, these days, I'm working on, I got a lot of onions in the fire. And everything, I try to keep it on TonyRodRiggs.com, so you can find me there. You can email me. I have a Patreon. I teach remote viewing weekly in Zoom calls. We do remote viewing. It's amazing. (1:57:24)

It's based on the evidence that I dug up. And I was the first one, I think in my third book, Beyond Sight, to introduce remote viewing countermeasures publicly. The government had researched it, and there are declassified documents. But we actually did experiments and pulled off countermeasures to remote viewing. And that's in my third book. You can find all three of my books on my website. (1:57:47)

My Patreon is called Talks with Tony. I'm on Facebook and social media. You know, I'm not big on making a post every five minutes of my life of me having eaten a bag of Cheetos or something. Like, a lot of social media is saturated because the algorithm needs you. So, I'm not super active. But on my Patreon is where I do most of my stuff. (1:58:10)

And then this year, I've got a few more conferences. I want to start dialing them back. I did too many. I was so bewildered and honored that people would ask me to come speak that I said yes to all of them for the last few years. It was a lot of travel, and it really ate up my personal life quite a bit. So, I'm dialing it back. (1:58:29)

But I've got a few big ones coming up. Galactic Spiritual Informers in Charlotte, North Carolina. It's got a huge, great lineup. I'm going to Dubai. I'm doing one in Sedona at the end of the month. Cosmic Awakening. So, you can reach me there. I don't have those really updated on my website. I put those on my Facebook. But TonyRedRiggs.com if anybody wants to get a hold of me and tell me that you hated me, you hated my show, or you relate to what I talked about. (1:59:03)

I don't mind talking to skeptical people, man. I really don't. I mind it when they're just instantly violent. There's not really a discussion going on. They just want to yell at you. And there's more like that. Yeah, I get that. I get that. I totally understand it. But happy that this finally happened again. And it's no exaggeration. This is nine years in the making, man. (1:59:31)

It's a great show. (1:59:32)

---

I've been a fan the whole time, Jimmy. You're a master at this, man. You were born for this. You're a master. I've been on a bunch of shows. You're up. You're high caliber, buddy. I appreciate that, Tony. But right back at you. And I look forward to our next conversation, too, as well. And we'll break bread out there once again. Let's do it. (1:59:51)

Tony Rodriguez, everybody. Thank you so much, Tony. Thank you. Absolutely. Great conversation tonight. And again, I look forward to our next one. Be safe out there, Tony. I'll talk to you soon. Tony's links are below.

(2025-08-18)