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1994, ジンバブエ : UFO 事件のドキュメンタリー : "Ariel Phenomenon", 2022

· 98 min read

前置き​

この事件については幾度も取り上げてきた。今回、Dailymotion に、まとまったドキュメンタリー動画を見かけたので整理しておく。

この事件での、UFO や ET に関する挙動は

  • 事件発生当時に証言したもの
  • 当時の小学生が大人となってから、当時を想起して証言したもの

が、以下の AI 整理では区別されていないことに注意。AI はまだ文字起こしされたテキストしか扱っておらず、証言者の映像を受け付けていないため。AI 整理には証言の該当時刻が付与されているので、人間が直接動画を観れば区別が可能。

情報源 : 動画(1:39:33)​

Ariel Phenomenon (2022) Watch HD - 動画 Dailymotion

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x8gusr4

AI

アリエル校UFO事件: 子どもたちの証言

これらの文章は、1994年にジンバブエのアリエル小学校で起きたUFO目撃事件に関するもので、主に目撃した子どもたちの証言に焦点を当てています。事件では、生徒たちが遊び時間中に銀色の円盤型物体が着陸し、中から人型生物が現れるのを目撃したと証言しています。

BBCのジャーナリストやUFO研究家、ハーバード大学の精神科医が子どもたちを調査し、彼らの証言の信憑性や体験が与えた影響について考察しています。この出来事は、目撃者だけでなく、その後の彼らの人生にも深い影響を与えたことが語られています。

AI

音声対話​

https://notebooklm.google.com/notebook/0104c23b-03e3-49ea-99a6-470c000ea273/audio

AI

アリエル・スクールUFO事件に関する詳細ブリーフィング資料

このブリーフィング資料は、Ariel School UFO事件に関する2つのドキュメンタリー動画の文字起こしに基づいています。主要なテーマ、重要な情報、そして必要に応じて原文からの引用を含めています。

  1. 事件の概要と目撃情報

1994年9月19日、ジンバブエのハラレから車で約30分のルワにあるアリエル・スクールで、約60人の児童がUFOの着陸と異星人との遭遇を目撃したとされています。

UFOの目撃情報:​

  • 多くの住民が夜間に「神秘的な明るい物体」を目撃し、ジンバブエ放送協会（ZBC）やBBCに報告が殺到しました。

  • 目撃された物体は「明るく輝く光」を持ち、音はしなかったとされています（0:01:19）。

  • 物体は「丸い円盤のよう」で（0:04:47）、「銀色の物体が空にあった」（0:10:27）と表現されています。

  • 国際線パイロットもこの物体を目撃し、ヨハネスブルグの航空管制に報告しています（0:02:00）。

  • 目撃された物体は「スポット的に現れ、見えたり見えなかったりした」（0:49:48）と述べられています。

異星人の目撃情報:​

  • 子供たちは、UFOから降りてきた「おかしな、全身真っ黒なスーツを着た男たち」（0:03:19）を見た、と証言しています。

  • 彼らの顔は「とても白く」（0:12:35）、目は「大きく、丸く、光沢があり、突き出ていた」（0:13:28）、「ラグビーボールのよう」（0:13:28）で、「真っ黒」（0:33:05）だったと表現されています。

  • 異星人の動きは「スローモーション」のようであり（0:51:15, 0:17:43）、「非常に滑らかで、流れるよう」（0:50:40）で、「まるで人間が月にいるように弾むような」動きをしていたと描写されています（0:35:59）。

  • 子供たちは異星人の姿を絵に描き、その詳細な描写は共通性を持っていました（0:04:59, 0:18:13）。

  1. メッセージの伝達と内容

異星人は言葉を発しなかったものの、子供たちにはテレパシーのような形でメッセージが伝達されたとされています。

コミュニケーションの形態:​

  • 「彼は何も言わなかった。ただ顔に目があっただけ」（1:00:41）と証言されています。
  • メッセージは「目を通して伝えられた」（1:03:36）。
  • 子供たちの「意識」や「良心」を通じて、頭の中に直接入ってきた（1:01:36）。
  • 「彼の目の中には静けさの湖のようなものがあり、私は彼を見つめることを余儀なくされた。彼から目をそらしたいとは思わなかった」（1:01:57）。

メッセージの内容:​

  • 主なメッセージは、地球の「汚染」と「技術」に関する警告でした（1:01:08）。

  • 「彼らは人々がこの世界に害を及ぼしていること、そして我々があまりにテクノロジーに依存すべきではないことを知ってほしいと思っている」（1:01:29）。

  • 「テクノロジーは悪い、汚い言葉のように感じられた。彼は私に、テクノロジーに注意しろ、深く関わるな、なぜならそれはあなたにとって良くないだろう、と言っていたと思う」（1:02:18）。

  • このメッセージは「生態学的、政治的なプログラムのようなものではなかった」ため、信憑性があったとジョン・マック博士は述べています（1:04:06）。

  1. 目撃者の反応と心理的影響

子供たちは強い感情的な反応を示し、事件は彼らの人生に長期的な影響を与えました。

目撃直後の反応:​

  • 恐怖と興奮が入り混じった感情を抱いた（0:33:49）。
  • 心臓が速くなったり遅くなったりする経験をした（0:33:32）。
  • 異星人の目に吸い寄せられる感覚を覚えた（0:44:13）。
  • 教師に話したが、「忘れなさい」と言われた（0:34:39）。
  • 親にも話したが、「作り話をしているに違いない」と信じてもらえなかったケースもあった（0:52:41）。

長期的な心理的影響:​

  • 多くの子供たちは、事件について話すことに「非常に抵抗」を感じ、周囲から「頭がおかしい」と思われることを恐れたため、その経験を「地下に潜る」（0:53:07）ように内に秘めました（0:53:38）。

  • 「誰にも話したことがない」「夫も知らない」（0:54:26）。

  • トラウマとなり、「不眠症」に悩まされた教師もいました（0:37:40）。

  • 事件から20年、あるいは21年経っても、当時の記憶や絵の描写は一貫していました（1:12:26, 1:29:43）。

  • 一部の子供たちは、大人になってからこの経験をアートで表現するようになりました（0:54:26）。

  • この経験は彼らの視野を広げ、「人生、宇宙、そしてすべてのものに対する新しい視点を与えた」と述べる者もいます（1:35:14）。

  1. ジョン・マック博士の調査と学術的論争

ハーバード大学の著名な精神科医であるジョン・マック博士は、この事件の調査に深く関わり、その結果、自身のキャリアと評判に大きな影響を受けました。

マック博士の介入:​

  • BBCのティム・リーチが、この前代未聞の事件を調査するため、UFO現象を研究していたシンシア・ハインドを通じてジョン・マック博士に連絡を取りました（0:29:43）。

  • マック博士は、子供たちの証言が「物理的な現実で起こった現象」を明確に語っていると結論付けました（0:47:38）。

  • 彼は、子供たちの話は「妄想や夢、精神病」ではなく、「本物の経験のすべての特徴」を持っていると述べました（1:05:17）。

  • マック博士は、事件の感情的な側面、つまり子供たちがUFOとの遭遇で感じた「より深い感情的な影響」を掘り下げました（0:45:02）。

ハーバード大学からの圧力:​

  • マック博士がUFOや異星人に関する研究を公表し始めたことで、ハーバード大学の医学部から批判を受けました。

  • 彼の同僚たちは「非常に恥ずかしい」と感じ、「ジョンは少し道を外れた」と懸念を表明しました（1:13:56）。

  • 大学は、マック博士の調査が「ハーバード医学部の基準を維持しているか」を調査する委員会を設置しました（1:14:59）。

  • 批判は「異星人による訪問が不可能であるという前提」に基づいており、「知識を純粋に物理的な世界に還元する」という視点から来ていました（1:19:09）。

  • マック博士は、「世界観とは、文化が何を現実と判断するか」であり、西洋文化では異星人の存在が受け入れられにくいと主張しました（1:20:44）。

  • 彼は、自身の研究がコペルニクス、ダーウィン、フロイトの発見に続く、人間のエゴイズムに対する「第四の大きな打撃」であると示唆しました（1:21:18）。

結果と影響:​

  • マック博士は「職業上の自殺を犯す機会」だったと自ら述べるほど、多くの困難に直面しました（1:25:05）。

  • しかし、最終的にハーバード大学は彼の調査を支持し、彼に対する調査を「全面的に中止」しました（1:26:24）。

  • 彼は「主要な機関の内部から、自分が信じることのためにリスクを冒し、その結果を払うことをいとわない象徴的な人物」となりました（1:27:32）。

  1. 文化・哲学的な考察

この事件は、科学的知識の限界、文化的な世界観の違い、そして人間の宇宙における位置付けについて、深い問いを投げかけました。

文化と受け入れ:​

  • 多くの文化、特に西洋文化では、技術の進歩により「それがすべてだ」と考える傾向があるため、異星人の存在のような現象は受け入れられにくい（1:19:09）。

  • アフリカの伝統文化では、子供たちは「まだ世界に触れておらず」、「精霊や自然とより良くコミュニケーションをとる」ことができると考えられています（0:59:15）。

  • アリエル・スクールは、部族長の埋葬地である「神聖な聖地」に隣接しており、この場所に着陸したことは「非常に重要」だと地元住民は考えています（0:59:56）。

宇宙における人間の位置付け:​

  • 事件は、人類が「自分たちの運命を完全にコントロールしている」わけではないという感覚を抱かせ、一部の人にとっては「非常に恐ろしい」ものでした（1:34:15）。

  • 人類は「地球上の支配的な種」かもしれないが、「この宇宙の隅では支配的な種ではないかもしれない」（1:34:15）。

  • 「宇宙は広大で、地球外に生命が存在しないとは言い切れない」（1:24:13）。

  • この経験は、参加者たちに「オープンマインド」を与え、「銀河の宇宙で唯一の生命であると言うのは少し傲慢だ」と感じさせました（1:34:15）。

信じることと疑うこと:​

  • 親の中には、「百聞は一見に如かず」として、自分が見ていないため信じられないと述べる者もいました（0:28:06）。

  • 子供たちは「大人よりもはるかにオープン」（0:28:48）であり、「見たものを知っていた」（0:28:48）。

  • 「あなたが実際にそれを見たときにのみ、それを信じることができます」（1:12:49）。

  • 60人もの子供たちが一貫した証言をしたことが、多くの人々の心を動かしました（1:13:04）。

このブリーフィング資料は、Ariel School UFO事件が単なるUFO目撃事件に留まらず、目撃者の心理、学術界の反応、そして人間が宇宙における自身の存在をどのように認識するかという、より広範な哲学的・文化的な問いを提起したことを示しています。

AI

詳細タイムライン

1983年10月:​

  • ティム・リーチがジンバブエを訪れ、アフリカ全土で戦争取材を行う。「バンバン」と呼ばれる戦争地帯での取材を多く経験し、多くの友人を失う中で生き残る。

1994年8月27日:​

  • ロシアの人工衛星が打ち上げられる。この後のUFO目撃との関連が後に言及される。

1994年9月:​

  • 上旬 (正確な日付不明): ジンバブエ全土で数百人がUFOを目撃したとZBC（ジンバブエ放送協会）やBBCに連絡が殺到する。物体は音を立てずに飛行し、形は光り輝く楕円形や、赤みがかったオレンジ色の二つの球体のようだったという証言がある。国際線のパイロット2名もヨハネスブルグ空港の航空管制に報告している。

9月19日、現地時間12時12分:​

  • ルワにあるアリエル小学校で、約60人の児童がUFOの着陸と、それに伴って現れた奇妙な存在を目撃する。

  • 子供たちは、木々の間に銀色の円盤状の物体が着陸し、そこから黒い服を着た人物が現れたと証言。

  • その人物はゆっくりとした動きで走り、子供たちの目には「月の上を走る人間のよう」に見えた。

  • 目撃された人物は目が非常に大きく、顔の他の部分（鼻や口）は不明瞭だったという。

  • 子供たちは恐怖を感じた一方で、その存在の目に見つめられると引きつけられるような感覚を覚えたと語る。特に目から「汚染」に関するメッセージを受け取ったと証言する子供もいる。

  • 子供たちは「フルートのような音」や「ブーンという音」「機械の蜂の音」を聞いたと証言する。

9月19日以降数日間:​

BBCのティム・リーチがアリエル小学校での目撃について電話を受ける。当初は懐疑的だったものの、話が大きくなるにつれて真剣に調査を開始。彼はBBCの取材方針に基づき、複数の情報源を確保しようとする。

同時期:​

ティム・リーチはUFO研究家シンシア・ハインドと連絡を取り、シンシアは技術者のガンターと共にアリエル校を訪問し、ガイガーカウンターで放射能を測定するが、異常は検出されない。シンシアは子供たちの証言と絵から、彼らが何かを本当に見たと信じる。

UFO事件後 (正確な日付不明):​

  • アリエル校のUFO事件は、ロイター通信が報道したことで世界中に広まり、大きな話題となる。

  • ジョン・マック博士がアリエル校を訪れ、子供たちへの聞き取り調査を開始。彼は子供たちの証言が真実であると確信する。

  • ジョン・マック博士は、この現象が「計り知れない複雑さ、意味、そして自己理解のための価値」を持つと考える。

  • 事件を目撃した子供たちは、親や周囲に話しても信じてもらえず、「地下に潜る」ように体験を心の中にしまい込むようになる。

  • BBCのティム・リーチはUFOの話を報じたことで、BBCでの信頼性を失い、キャリアが終わる。

ジョン・マック博士の活動とハーバード大学からの調査:​

  • ジョン・マック博士の活動は、ハーバード大学内で物議を醸す。彼の同僚や大学幹部は彼の理論に「困惑」し、彼が「常軌を逸した」と懸念する。

  • アーノルド・レルマン教授がジョン・マックの活動を調査する委員会を組織する。これは、ジョンがハーバードの名前を自由に使い、大学がUFO研究を支援しているかのような印象を与えたため。

  • 調査委員会は、ジョンが医療基準に違反していないか、被験者の心理的福祉が保護されているかなどを懸念する。

  • 最終的に、医学部長はジョン・マックに謝罪の手紙を書き、調査を中止する。ジョンは大学での通常の研究活動に戻ることを許される。

2004年:​

  • ジョン・マックの事務所が大学構内から移転。これは彼が「追い出された」ことの比喩として捉えられる。

UFO事件から20年以上経過後:​

  • 事件を目撃した子供たちが成長し、一部は未だにその経験について話すことに抵抗を感じている。

  • エミリー・トリムは、25周年を迎えるアリエル校からの招待を受け、旧友や先生と再会するため学校を訪れる。彼女は事件以降、学校に戻ることを避けていた。

  • エミリーやカイリーなど、元児童たちは、当時の自分たちの描いた絵を見つけ出し、記憶が鮮明に蘇ることに驚く。

  • 彼らは、長年信じてもらえなかったり、からかわれたりした経験から、この話を公にすることに躊躇している。しかし、約60人全員が同じ話を共有することで、人々の世界観を変えられるかもしれないと考える。

  • 彼らは、人間が宇宙で唯一の支配的な種ではないという可能性に心を広げられたと感じている。

現在 (ドキュメンタリー制作時):​

事件の目撃者たちは、依然としてその体験の真実性を強く信じている。 彼らはこの体験が、自身の人生観や世界観に大きな影響を与えたと語る。 一部の元児童は、UFOの存在に疑問を持つ人々にその体験を伝えることの重要性を感じている。

AI

主要関係者

ティム・リーチ : BBCテレビジョンニュースの記者。もともと戦争地帯を専門とする現実主義的なジャーナリストだったが、アリエル校UFO事件の調査を通してその信憑性を確信し、BBCでのキャリアを失うことになる。

シンシア・ハインド : ジンバブエのUFO研究家。MUFONのアフリカ大陸コーディネーターを務める。アリエル校の子供たちの証言と絵から、彼らが実際に何かを見たことを強く信じる。

ガンター : シンシア・ハインドの技術パートナー。ガイガーカウンターを自作し、アリエル校の現場で放射能を測定する。シンシアのUFO調査において、現象を科学的に説明しようと試みるが、アリエル校のケースでは説明できなかった。

ジョン・マック博士 : ハーバード大学医学部の精神医学教授。ピューリッツァー賞受賞者。当初は懐疑的だったが、アリエル校の子供たちへの綿密な聞き取り調査を通じて、彼らのUFO遭遇体験が本物であると確信する。彼の研究はアカデミック界で大きな物議を醸し、ハーバード大学から調査を受けるが、最終的には彼の研究の権利が認められる。UFO現象を「人類の自己理解にとって非常に重要」なものと捉える。

エミリー・トリム : アリエル小学校の元生徒で、UFO事件の主要な目撃者の一人。事件以来、その体験を心に秘めてきたが、ドキュメンタリーの中で21年ぶりに学校を訪れ、当時の記憶と感情と向き合う。彼女は、絵を描くことで自身の体験と向き合ってきた。

カイリー (Kaylee) : アリエル小学校の元生徒で、UFO事件の目撃者の一人。母親に体験を話しても信じてもらえなかったことに心を痛める。ドキュメンタリーの中で当時の絵を見つけ、記憶が蘇る。

ダニエル・マンディ : アリエル小学校の元生徒で、UFO事件の目撃者の一人。銀色の物体と黒い服を着た人物を見たことを証言。

レイチェル (Rachel) : アリエル小学校の元生徒で、UFO事件の目撃者の一人。

ポール (Paul) : レイチェルの弟で、アリエル小学校の元生徒。彼も事件を目撃した。

ワチャ先生 (Mrs. Wacha) : アリエル小学校の教師。エミリーの3年生の時の担任。当初は子供たちの話を信じなかったが、後に子供たちの証言の一貫性から真実を確信するようになる。子供たちの描いた絵を保管していたが、紛失したことを残念がる。

ミス・ベイツ (Miss Bates) : アリエル小学校の教師。ドキュメンタリーで、子供たちが描いた絵を一部見つけ出す手助けをする。子供たちが長年学校を避けていたことに心を痛めている。

アーノルド・レルマン : ハーバード大学医学部長の要請で、ジョン・マック博士の活動を調査する委員会を組織した医師。ジョン・マックのUFO研究に対して、ハーバード大学の学術的基準が保たれているか、被験者の心理的福祉が保護されているかなどを懸念する。

ライゼル・ファンギ・グラハム (Liesl Fungi Graham) : ドキュメンタリーの中で言及される元生徒の一人。

ジュディ (Judy) : エミリー・トリムにアリエル校25周年記念イベントへの招待状を送った人物。

AI

場所の重要性…について、敷衍して。


アリエル学校は、その目撃の余波と反応というより大きな文脈において、多岐にわたる重要な意味を持っています。この場所は単に出来事の現場であっただけでなく、目撃者の経験、世間の認識、そして文化・精神的な解釈に深く影響を与えました。

  • 出来事の具体的な現場としての重要性

    • アリエル学校は、1994年9月16日にUFOが着陸し、異星人が目撃された具体的な場所として特定されています。この出来事は、「首都ハラレから車で約30分のアリエル学校」の「ジンバブエの遊び場」で起こった「珍しい集団遭遇」と報じられました。
    • この出来事が学校の敷地内、特に「チーフたちの埋葬地」であり「神聖な聖地」の中心に着陸したことは、場所が元々持っていた文化的な、あるいは精神的な重要性を強調しています。これにより、この出来事は単なるランダムな現象ではなく、ジンバブエの「壮大な祖先たち」と結びついた深い意味を持つものとして捉えられました。文化が「これの大きな部分」であると認識され、神聖な場所を訪れることが提案されています。

  • 目撃者への心理的影響と場所との関係

    • 目撃した子供たちにとって、アリエル学校はトラウマの場所となりました。多くの子供たちは、両親が信じてくれないことへの恐れや、周りの人々からの偏見を避けるために、出来事について話すことをためらいました。ある証言者は、学校から離れた後に出来事について話す機会がなく、友人と話す機会も失われたと述べています。
    • 出来事が起こった場所であるアリエル学校に戻ることは、目撃者にとって「痛み」や「何かを内に秘めていた」ことの「思い出し」となり、再びその感情を抱きたくないという複雑な感情を呼び起こしました。しかし同時に、この場所は彼らにとって「家」のような感覚であり、「繋がり」、そして出来事と向き合うための「踏み石」となっています。学校の居住者の中には、この出来事が「眠れない夜」の原因となり、出来事を心から「遮断」しようとしている人もいます。

  • 世間の認識と学術的な反応への影響

    • アリエル学校での出来事は、多数の子供たちが同時に目撃したという事実により、その信憑性が高まりました。BBCが「1つの情報源」だけでなく「20、30、40」もの目撃者を得られたことは、この出来事の「信憑性」を高めました。
    • ジョン・マック博士のような当初懐疑的であった専門家も、子供たちの証言の「一貫性」や「信憑性」に「確信」を抱きました。ハーバード大学の精神科医であるマック博士は、子供たちの話が「ファンタジー、夢、精神病」ではなく「本物の経験の全ての兆候」を持っていると結論付けました。子供たちは、大人が見ていなかったにもかかわらず、「パニックに陥って駆け寄ってきた」ため、話をでっち上げることができなかったと教師が述べています。
    • 子供たちが「まだ世間に触れていない」ため、「精霊や自然とより良くコミュニケーションをとる」ことができるという文化的な信念は、なぜメッセージが「子供たちに伝えられなければならない」のかという追加の層を提供しました。これは、アリエル学校での出来事を、単なるUFO目撃以上の、文化的に深く根ざした出来事として位置づけました。

アリエル学校という具体的な場所と、そこで多数の子供たちが集団で目撃したという事実は、このUFO事件が単なる逸話にとどまらず、目撃者の個人的なトラウマ、学術界の検証、そして深い文化・精神的な意味合いを持つ、非常に複雑で重要な出来事となる上で不可欠な役割を果たしました。

文字起こし

(transcript 1of2)

（以下は、Ariel school UFO 事件に関するドキュメンタリー動画の文字起こしです。長いので 2分割し、これはその前半部分です。）

You're tuned to the Zimbabwe Broadcasting Corporation, Radio 1, and here is a special announcement. If anyone has video footage of the meteorite showers, or whatever they were, please get in touch with Tim Leach of BBC Television very urgently. PHONE RINGS BBC Television News. I was not so frightened in the war zones of Angola or Rwanda as I was when this story hit. Hundreds of people today phoned the ZBC and BBC correspondent in Harare saying they sighted an unidentifying flying object last night. (0:00:59)

These things were flying in a pattern and there was no sound. No wind, no nothing. Shiny, oval thing. PHONE RINGS Hello? Hello, my name is Tim Leach from BBC Television News. I understand that you had some strange experience. Yes, that's right. It was a bright, radiant light. I've never seen anything like it in my life. It was the absence of noise I didn't like. (0:01:23)

There has been much excitement after hundreds of people reported seeing a mysterious bright object. We suddenly looked up and we saw this thing coming over the top of the hill. As it sort of came abreast of us, it suddenly changed from this glow to, let's say, two big red-orange balls. No sound. Look. Is that what it means to you out there? No way. (0:01:50)

No way. That's incredible. Eyewitnesses say it had a bright light at the front and flew at great speed. The object was also seen by two international airline pilots who reported it to air traffic control at Johannesburg airport. There were three of us that saw it. Myself, the co-pilot and the pilot in the other aircraft. South Africa's top meteorologist says there's no rational explanation for the bright light and it could be one of the most widely reported unidentified flying objects in recent times. (0:02:19)

None of it made sense. So I phoned the BBC in London and I said, what is this meteorite showing? They said, no, no, no, it's got nothing to do with Africa or Zimbabwe. Meteorites come down in an arc. They don't fly parallel to the Earth. What about this Russian debris that's coming down? No, that doesn't work either. Sorry. Well, what is this? Viewers with more information can either contact the ZBC or BBC in Harare. For at least three or four days, people from all over Zimbabwe were phoning us at the BBC to say, we've seen something weird. (0:02:59)

It was a helicopter or what? No, no, it was just a big round wall. The bottom was flat, but it was round like on top of my wall on my house. And then I got this call from an aerial school rower that the children had seen a UFO landing and these funny men in body-cleaning suits, black suits, weird. I went roaring out there in the car with my sound man. (0:03:28)

I don't know. Aerial school, 19th September, 94, 12, 12, local time. Could you tell me what you saw on Friday? (0:04:04)

Well, it was just glinting in the trees. And there was a man and he walked towards us and he walked back again. And what did he look like? His face was like this and his eyes were down here. Like, what, further down his face? Yeah, much further down than us, because our eyes are here and his are down. You don't think it was somebody in fancy dress doing a prank or something? (0:04:27)

And how tall about? About, say, there, sitting on the spaceship. How do you know it was a spaceship? Wasn't it a helicopter or something like that? Well, it looked like it was like a disc, like a round... And whereabouts was it? Well, in the trees over there, between the third pole. And did you girls see that as well? Yes. We asked them to draw pictures of what they saw on Friday. And after looking at those, I definitely feel that they did see something. (0:04:59)

What do you think it was? I agree that it could be something that we are not common with. But to actually say that it was a UFO, I would be reluctant to make a decision like that. All the other journalists in Harare were not taking this seriously. But I took it seriously because this story got bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger. And I needed to know what was going on. Who do I talk to? (0:05:28)

And then I spoke to some contacts and they put me in touch with Cynthia Hind, a person for UFOs in Zimbabwe. Cynthia Hind is coming up and I believe she is being a Geiger counter. She did mention it on the telephone. Well, I think we will wait and see what happens then. Did you all see something? Yes. What's your name? I am Daniel Mandy and I saw this silver thing in amongst this clump of trees with this one thing sitting on the side and another thing sort of like running up and down the top. (0:06:15)

It had a round top and then it was flat around the sides. What was around the side? Just like a platform coming around the side. Platform. Did you see anything else? Yes, we saw a black man running around. A little man or what? From where we looked it was about this small but we were quite way away so it was about our size. (0:06:40)

What did you see? I saw something silver on the ground amongst the trees and a person in black and that's all I saw. You saw a person alongside this silver thing? Yes. Have you heard about UFOs before this? No. You didn't know anything about it so it was something quite new to you. Yes. Were you afraid? Yes. Nobody should panic, we don't know what it is and it could be just some... There was a Russian satellite that went up on the 27th of August and it's a possibility something came down but it would not account for the figure you saw. (0:07:20)

But I think for the moment you should keep everybody away until we've had some analysis, you know, of what's going on. (0:07:32)

It was in between the gap, behind the pile of wood. Yes, I can see that. Where do they think it was? They told us it was in between these two poles here. In between these two poles? Yes. Gunther, can you try the Geiger counter? Yes. What equipment have you brought with you? Well, Gunther is a highly technical chap. Because it's difficult and very expensive in this country, he's made his own Geiger counter. (0:08:05)

We're going to check it out and see if there's any radioactivity there. If there's really some changes, the Geiger would be going faster. So this is just normal background radiation? Yeah, this is about normal. I was helping Cynthia out more in technical terms. So Cynthia found me quite useful in maybe explaining away certain phenomena. Maybe it was a certain time of the year where certain meteorological events occurred like the Leonid meteor shower or the Perseid meteor shower. (0:08:41)

So we used to try and eliminate all the natural events that might be happening in the sky before we thought maybe there might be something more to it. But how skeptical are you? Well, I would like to see some evidence. But you don't think you've got the equipment at the moment, do you? No, I haven't. But from what I see from some of the children, I do believe there's something happening. (0:09:06)

I'm not all that gullible, but this to me is a very typical case and I've handled several hundreds in Southern Africa. I certainly believe the children have some extremely interesting pictures. And there's certainly some of the things they've told me they couldn't have known about. Impossible. I can remember it like it was yesterday. It was easy to put down because that's exactly what I'd seen. (0:09:38)

So, you know, something that I'll never ever forget. In 94, I was in grade two at the time at Ariel. My teacher was Mrs. Cheeple. What I can remember was we were playing around in the playground area. It was one of those rare occasions where the teachers were having a staff meeting, so it was quite a long break. We were happy to have those because it was more playtime. (0:10:05)

And there was like a flash of light and it was bright silver and everything shot past. At the time, I mean, I remember it well. We were on the field playing our football and a friend of mine from Dubai said, Luke, Luke, do you see that in the sky? What is that? What is that? So I was looking up tonight. I saw it. (0:10:27)

And it was, for want of a better word, you know, a UFO. I wasn't sure what it was, but it was a silver object that was in the sky. And we're both like looking at it. And I only saw it for possibly a few seconds. And it seemed to move off a bit and then suddenly vanished. And we were both sort of standing there looking up saying, you know, geez, what was that? (0:10:51)

But didn't put too much thought to it. (0:10:54)

And obviously went straight back to playing our football match. A few minutes later, there's a whole sort of commotion going on. And there was a whole bunch of kids down at the bottom of the playground. We were sitting on one of the logs that we always sat on eating our lunch. And I noticed that people were pointing at this one thing or something in the bush. (0:11:18)

And I got up to see what was going on because one person actually started crying. And, you know, like I said, because we were the older group on the playground. We all, people in my year, just were kind of concerned about what was going on with everyone else. There was a big group of kids all sort of gathered right at the bottom of the playing field, pointing and making a noise and shouting and screaming. (0:11:44)

And I went up to them to sort of see what was going on and try to, you know, calm everybody down. You know, my initial thoughts was somebody had hurt themselves or something. OK, so if I was there, sort of say a couple of hundred meters up, it was right there. So it seemed to be right on the cross-country course. I remember seeing two flashing lights and I saw like a big silver, like a saucer kind of thing that was hovering. (0:12:14)

And then it landed or hovered on a stone. And I saw two figures come out, really black, but their face, you could actually see not much of their face, but it was really, really white in color. The skin pigmentation was very, I don't, I don't know how you can, pale doesn't even, it looked plastic. You know, it looked like someone who had had too much, too much Botox. Now, when I think about it, I'm like, that's, that's exactly what, at the time I didn't have a color or a word for it, but that's exactly what it looked like. (0:12:53)

It was very smooth and soft looking. It looked like it, you'd slide right off. If you tried to touch him, he'd just, yeah. I suddenly realized that that's not, he's not quite normal. I didn't actually know about UFOs and aliens at the time, so I just thought he was a strange person. But it was the eyes that, that made him. So that kind of shape, I think the eyes were obviously a lot more fluid, round, shiny, protruded. (0:13:28)

Almost like rugby balls or America, you know, American footballs, huge eyes on the side of his face. And so I looked over and sort of thought I could see something unusual going on in the bushes as well. And I was like, yeah, there is, there's got to be something, it looks like there's something there. And the realization that there was something moving and it appeared to be coming towards us as well, that, I felt scared at that point. (0:13:50)

The panic spread. I was looking for my brother and sister to make sure that they were okay. (0:13:57)

And when I did have them, then we continued to look onward. They just seemed confused, like what is going on? One moment we're playing, next moment, everybody's looking, pointing and everybody's in a panic. That was a little bit scary. I just turned 28. I ended a relationship. I was engaged for six years. You know, this whole topic definitely weighed on our relationship. So I moved in with my folks. (0:14:34)

I'm thankful that I'm here right now and with my family who supports me. As for future goals, plans, work, I have no idea. But I feel alone. Alone. Dear Emily, I hope this finds you well. As you may have seen on our Facebook page, next month we will be celebrating our 25th year as a school. I know it's short notice coming from Canada, but we'd love to have you join us. (0:15:32)

If you can't make it, know that you are always welcome to visit your old home. Love, Judy. It brings up a lot for me. It's a reminder of pain. Of holding something inside. I don't want to hold on to those feelings anymore. Can I quickly please? I haven't got all day. This lady and the gentleman are from South African Broadcasting Corporation. They've come to talk to some of you. (0:16:54)

Hi everybody. My name's Nikki, okay, and that's Ivan with the camera. And we're going to actually speak to a few of you who did see something that day. And ask you what happened, what you felt when you saw it, that sort of thing, you know. So very, very casual. You must just say exactly what you want to say, okay? What were you doing on the day? (0:17:14)

Well, I was walking and I saw this maroon colour in the sky. And me and my friends were following it. And then we saw this light in the sassatree. Then I saw something shining and somebody sitting on it. And they were wearing pure black. We saw this black figure running in slow motion. The strange thing was it seemed to be in very slow motion. (0:17:43)

Which to us seemed very interesting. Because Cynthia had come across this kind of event in some of our other cases around the world. Where she had reports of, you know, alien encounters. Cynthia, how long have you been investigating UFO phenomenon? Well, about 17 years. I'm the continental coordinator in Africa for MUFON. MUFON has over 5,000 members, most of whom are scientists. You interviewed the children. What was your conclusion? (0:18:13)

I believe them. I believe they saw what they said they saw. I think that perhaps some have been influenced by others. And they've added a little bit here and a little bit there. But basically they put, drew in their drawings many things that I don't think that they could know about. And how big was the figure? It was about as big as a grade 6. How tall would you have said? (0:18:40)

Maybe about three and a half feet. (0:18:43)

There's another one, he was a bit short. As an investigator, I've learned that if they tell exactly the same story, then there's corroboration. They've got together and they're doing it. But if they tell a similar story, but from different viewpoints, to me, that's the truth. He saw two of them. One was standing in front of the ship. And then the other one had long hair. (0:19:13)

But the one was standing in front, he didn't have any hair at all. Show me with your hand how big the eyes were. They were shaped like something like that. Big head and big black eyes. And he was dressed in a black bodysuit. What did you think it was? I don't know. I just thought it was some kind of alien from a different planet. (0:19:34)

What are they talking about? I had no experience of UFOs or anything like that, apart from seeing Steven Spielberg's film, Close Encounters of the Third Kind or whatever. I just thought, you're all bonkers. I was just a hard-ass journalist, sceptical as everybody would be. What is this? I want to know. I mean, the BBC want to know. What is going on here? There's a truth behind your environment shaping who you are. (0:20:13)

For me, growing up in Africa was normal. It was just home. You're growing up in an area where you need to be aware of your environment. This is not living in America. You're in Africa. You're in Zimbabwe. We didn't grow up around TV. People like to joke about, oh, do you have running water? Yes, that was luxury, actually. That's something you were lucky to have. (0:20:46)

Or electricity. Because the places that we went to a lot, I mean, they had nothing. You live in mud hut, thatched roof. You live every single day to live. And hope you can. Yeah, so it's completely different. Okay, mom, dad, do you remember this place? We used to stop here all the time. This is really, I feel at home. To go back to Ariel means I get to go back to the spot where it happened. (0:21:51)

I don't know how I'm going to feel. I don't know what it's going to bring up. But I feel really blessed to be able to do that in my life. My family's religious and they came to Africa for mission work. My brother and sister also attended Ariel. They were very traumatized about the event. Talking about it in a religious environment wasn't something that was allowed to be done. (0:22:24)

I was very quickly removed out of the situation. So it was pack up everything and we flew into Canada. I didn't get to have the opportunity of growing up with the friends in that environment who had had that occur to them. I'm looking forward to reconnect again. I haven't been back to Ariel for just over 20 years. Oh my God. Good afternoon. Hi. How are you doing? (0:23:54)

Good, how are you? (0:23:55)

Good. Emily. How are you? How are you? I'm good, yeah. And you? Good. I'm really glad to be back. Back. Now? Yeah. Come home. What is that? Home. It's home. It is. It is. Home. Yes. It's good to see you. Thank you. Oh my goodness. That's Rachel. This is Paul, my brother who also attends this school. So we're a family of three here. (0:24:25)

So will someone be able to show me around the school? Hi. Emily. It's nice to meet you too. I'm walking where I used to step. Yeah. It feels incredible. Okay, we've got a special visitor in our midst. It's Emily Trim and she was here at Ariel's school 21 years ago. Was Mr. Mackey here when you guys were here? Yes. Do you remember Mrs. Wacha? (0:25:04)

Yes. Yes. She was, I think, my grade three teacher. Was she? Yes. And then she came and was sort of like stalking me in the supermarket at the spa when you were phoning me. And I told you it was Paul. You having a good day? Yes. Is it lunch time right now for you? Yes. Yes, wonderful. There were the boundary logs here. Okay. And that field wasn't there. (0:26:30)

Yes. It was all brush, you know. And you guys went down to the log? Well, I was right on the log when it actually happened. You were there? Yes, I was here. And you saw them? You were the ones who drew those funny pictures? Yes. Oh, okay. Nice to meet you. And where are you staying now? With Miss Bates. Okay. Yeah. You have the shower down there. (0:27:00)

And this is your room as well. Okay. And everyone's got a fan. I don't have much on me, so I'm afraid... You don't have what? A mosquito net. It's okay. And what did your other friends say? They were scared. We wanted to tell the teachers, but some of us were too shy to. We ran down to the teachers and we went into the office and we started telling the teachers. (0:27:44)

And then they said maybe there's nothing. And how did that make you feel when they said maybe there's nothing? Well, we felt very sad because we did see something. Cheryl, what was your reaction when Candace and Teagan told you about the UFOs and the aliens that they saw on Friday? I don't know, really. I find it very hard to believe. I've always taught my children seeing is believing. (0:28:06)

Unfortunately, I didn't see, so I don't know if I believe. We always joke with the children, we say, all these little green men come out. And they say, no, mommy, but we did see. So, I don't know, I do believe Candace to a certain extent. What did the man look like? Why would they make up such a story? And kids of that age, you know, six to nine, ten, they wouldn't be able to sustain such a story for such a long time. (0:28:30)

One of them is going to crack, and then it would be like unrolling a ball of string. (0:28:34)

And all the rest of them would crack as well. So, would you want to talk about it to friends or other people you meet in the future when you get older? Or would you want to just forget about it? No, I don't want to forget about it. I want to keep it in because I know that it was true. And I want to talk to other people about it. (0:28:48)

They were fascinated. They accepted it in their full stride. They knew what they'd seen. They weren't stupid. Children are so much more open than adults. I've always kept an open mind about the life of the universe and everything. God, Buddha, whatever you want to call it. But this story was something I hadn't encountered before. In October 1983, I went to Zimbabwe, which was just going through massacres. (0:29:16)

And I went all over Africa, being a cameraman, doing what's called Bang Bang, which is serious war zone. I'd done a lot. I'd done Angola, Rwanda, Liberia, Nigeria. I'd done lots of war zones. A lot of my friends and my crew were killed. And I survived. That was my job. But this was a bolt out of the blue, and I wasn't expecting it because I was a realist. (0:29:43)

It was totally out of my remit. I could handle war zones, but I could not handle this UFO thing. It just didn't make sense. And that's when I had to call in extra help. Cynthia Hine put me in touch with Dr. John Mack. And I got his number at Harvard University. Jim Leach from BBC Television News in Harare, Zimbabwe. Message for Dr. John Mack. This concerns a UFO sighting over a school where it hovered, landed, a black man got out. (0:30:19)

But of course, we're having difficulty being taken seriously in spite of being the BBC. Please call me as soon as you can. Thank you. He said, listen, I don't know what's going on, but this is way outside my normal ball game. What do I do? And John Mack said, as soon as I can break away, I'm coming over. And he did. With his credentials as head of the Department of Psychiatry at Harvard, I sat up and took notice. (0:30:50)

That took it to another depth. Do you think it's possible that one imaginative child had a story and kind of stirred the rest of them? No, I don't believe. I don't believe. I honestly believe they saw something. But for me to actually draw a conclusion as to what it is, I don't think I could do that at this point in time. How many of them reported seeing the craft? (0:31:21)

Something in the region of about 60. More of them could have seen it. They're just too embarrassed to talk about it. We actually haven't had the grade ones and twos involved, which are the six and seven-year-olds. How long would you estimate that the scene actually lasted? It took over about 10 to 15 minutes. (0:31:42)

Really? That long? Did they describe any other sensory experiences like smell or sound or anything of that kind? Nothing at all. Honestly, I don't think anybody's actually asked them that question. You've talked with the BBC people and with Nicky Carter here before, right? Yes. Okay. But the experience is still fresh in your mind, is that right? Yes. Okay. What were you doing at the time? (0:32:13)

I was playing in the playground and then we saw something silver and then we quickly ran to the logs and we saw a silver thing and we saw a man standing next to it. And what did he look like? Well, he had big eyes that like pointed. Pointed big eyes. Maybe you could just draw the head. Do you like to draw? Yes. Okay. Put the chair up a little bit. (0:32:45)

These are what? What are you drawing here? The eyes. The eyes. Okay. And I couldn't see his nose and his mouth, but his nose was pretty smooth. So the eyes were large, is that right? Yes. Did you look into the eyes? Did you have a sense that you were... No, all we saw was his eyes, they were black. Black, but like were they looking at you or were you at him? (0:33:10)

It seemed that he was looking at all of us. Have you ever seen a UFO? I never have. No. And I didn't see anything over there. No nose? You didn't see a nose? No. And I just, my heart kind of went faster and then slower and then faster and then slower. All at the same time. Now was that, that was excitement? Yes, excitement and scariness. (0:33:49)

And scary. And you said happy too? Happy because? Because I saw something strange and something peculiar and something nobody had ever seen. Hayley, something scared you, is that right? Yes. What scared you? The noise. What noise? The noise that we heard in the air. You heard a noise in the air? Yes. What was it like? Like a roar or a buzz or a hum or what kind of a noise? (0:34:24)

It was like someone was playing a flute. And that scared you? Yes. And what did you do when you were afraid? I ran away from it. We told the teacher but she said just forget about it. So people who have these experiences are very serious about them. I think that generally speaking when something powerful, important, exciting, scary has happened, that it's useful to talk about it. (0:34:59)

To have open discussion. And it doesn't mean you have to impose a point of view. But it's not about what we believe. It's what their experience is and how they find the adults around them being receptive to that experience. And you said that you saw two... what would you call them? Aliens. Aliens, you call them. And where were the aliens in relation to the craft? (0:35:28)

I saw one over here. And I saw one of these men by the spaceship. (0:35:35)

Looks like it was gardening by the big spaceship. And there was another one running. Running in the grass. And how did he run compared to say where a kid would run? He ran normally like us but bouncy as if a human would run on the moon. You mean as if there was less gravity. Seemed light. Yes, but not as much as a human on the moon. (0:35:59)

Not that extreme. When he ran his distance he stopped and he looked at us for a while and then he ran back again. The one thing I've told everybody is we are dealing with children here. Sometimes the imagination can get carried away with them. Right, okay. How many of you still think they're just making it up? The thing that got me was that there were no adults outside. None of us saw it. We just happened to be in a staff meeting. (0:36:28)

I totally believe the children. They came running up here in such a panic. And I mean even if we had staged it they could not have run all together like that. We just heard them screaming, screaming and then they were here, you know. And a child can't make that up. And I mean children know when other children are conning them. And there were like about a hundred of them that just came here. (0:36:49)

They didn't see anything. I think they say make-believe story that they actually created. That's my feeling. What do you think started the story? Since during that time they talk about meteorites and all that. I suppose somebody created the story and they sort of thought maybe he had seen something. You think that the children's imaginations are getting carried away with them. But I became convinced when I saw the drawings because so many of the drawings were similar. (0:37:20)

And also when they wrote their stories in their storybooks. They definitely seem genuine because I mean they all wrote completely different stories but they had seen the same thing. And I think that's what convinced me because I think I was as sceptical as everybody else. It wasn't just Ariel's school. There were a lot of different occurrences that happened over probably that whole week. (0:37:40)

I live here at the school. So I try not to think about it at all. Because if I do I have sleepless nights. Then you have sleepless nights. I do. I've had a lot of sleepless nights since it happened. So I try to put it out of my mind. What do you think about the reality aspect of it? Seeing is believing. I don't know. But then I'm also scared of the unknown. (0:38:02)

So it's something that I block off because I'd rather get on with school. Do you think the kids are telling the truth or do you think they're kind of... I think they are. ...embellished in their imagination. Yeah, I think that I'd rather not think about it. Again, because now if I think about it tonight I'll have another sleepless night. (0:38:17)

Because I'm waiting for an alien to come through the walls. Some of the kids in my class are so frightened. I actually can see that. It must have affected them so much that they sort of imagine something will happen to them. They're still young and you don't know how to act and how to speak to them. If we're going to keep discussing this, the parent is going to be knocking on my door every single day. (0:38:44)

Yeah. I don't think you can generalise when it comes to something like this. You've got to be extremely careful which way the parent is going to jump. Right. If he's going to jump the wrong way, you've caused a problem. Right. You've caused a problem. I think you're all probably... You're not solving it. You're probably all aware of this caution that Colin is talking about. (0:39:07)

We had one child who was very upset by the whole thing. Unfortunately, he's not at the school anymore. He's actually gone back to Canada. He was having sleepless nights and this was a 12, 13-year-old child. Basically, the cause of that was his parents refused to discuss the situation with him. His parents were very religious and according to them, this sort of thing doesn't happen. (0:39:29)

Just down that road, yes. Oh my gosh, I can't believe I'm going to see Mrs. Wacha. And her name suits her too. Yes, it does. Mrs. Wacha. Exactly. I remember she was very strict, wasn't she? Very, very strict. Everything was done by her. Yeah. There we go. Judge Wacha. Yes. Oh, Mrs. Wacha's coming. She's coming up now. Yeah. Hey, shrimp! Yes! Mrs. Wacha! (0:40:23)

Wow. I'm now old, I know. You don't see me to be old? No. Hello. I missed you. You did? I missed you. You missed me? I was a little bit difficult, wasn't I? No. You? Oh, you were strict. You were strict. That is exactly what I wanted to hear. Yes! You were strict, but you were fair, you know? You were fair. I was very fair. (0:41:07)

Yes! But... Strict. And it was beautiful. Oh! Beautiful. There's this business of asking about the aliens. Yeah. Up to this end. Yeah, because you saw those things, you saw those people. Mm-hmm. We asked the schoolchildren then to draw. Yes. Remember? Mm-hmm. You also drew. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So Mr. Markey asked us, we put all the papers according to the classes, finish this class, do the other, do the other, do the other, and all the same. (0:41:55)

Same. We ended up concluding that certainly we saw people. They're going! Where to? Yeah. How did they come there? Mm-hmm. Who are they? Are they people? We couldn't tell. That's what the story is. Mm-hmm. That's what you saw also. Mm-hmm. Yes. I had kept those papers myself. You did? I don't know what happened to them. I'm looking for mine. You can't find it? (0:42:37)

I can't find mine. Same with me. Because I thought it was something I must also hold onto. (0:42:45)

Mm-hmm. I didn't know what that meant. These eyes, did you look at them? Yes. What feeling did that give you when you looked in the eyes? It made me shake a little. It made you shake? It was a terrifying feeling. A what? A terrifying feeling. A terrifying feeling. And what made it terrifying? The way he was looking at me. How did he look at you? (0:43:11)

Strangely, like an old woman who hasn't seen a kid before. Like an old what? An old woman who hasn't seen a kid before. An old woman who hasn't seen a kid before? She stares like this. Okay, I'm going to ask you to do something. Try to just be in that feeling for a moment. Try to remember that terrifying feeling, okay? Can you do that? (0:43:31)

I know it's unpleasant, but nothing bad will happen, okay? Okay. And just try to tell me what's in the terror. See what you find in the terror. What it might be about. It was making me all scared. My heart was now starting to pump faster. And it was making me all woozy now. Like woozy, losing... Yes. Like you were going to faint, you mean? (0:43:56)

Yeah. Did you faint? No. So then I was looking at him, right? Yeah. And then he was looking at me back. I couldn't just keep on looking at him. So I had to stop and I looked sideways. So he kept on making me feel faint. But you kept looking? Yes. Why did you keep looking? I don't know, something just attracted me to look at him. (0:44:13)

Something attracted you? Yes. The other man, his eyes looked at me as if... Oh, I want to... Things like that. I want to what? I want you. I want you. Yeah. I want you in what? Like I want you to come with me? No, I want you to come with me. I want you to come. Did you go with him, do you think? (0:44:34)

No, only my eyes went with him. Your eyes went with him. And my feeling. And your feeling went with him. So was there a part of you that wanted to go with him? Yeah. That felt like drawn to go with him? Yeah. Can you say what that felt like? Again, scary and a little excited. Yeah. And a little, I shouldn't go. Yeah. And yet, I want to go. (0:45:02)

Yeah. Yeah. John Mack seemed to have brought out that information. Because we just took it in a very analytical way. We just said, what did you see? And what did the aliens look like? What did they do? But we never thought there might be some kind of emotional, deeper effect. You know, really gave you goosebumps, if I may put it that way. You know, there's something more going on here than what met the eye. (0:45:29)

What made you scream? I was just getting very scared. What were you scared would happen? (0:45:39)

Don't be afraid to make, even if you think it's not sensible. Just tell me what you were afraid might happen. I thought the aliens would attack me. Would attack you and do what? Hurt you? Yes. How would they do that? I don't know. It looked evil because it was just staring at me. With what? Staring at you as if what? As if to do what? (0:46:08)

As if they wanted to come and take us. I know this is hard. I know it's hard. Try to... It's hard to put into words what you felt, I'm sure. John did this public meeting in Harare. He did an incredible service to the community who were worried. And just wanted answers. Dr. John Mack is a true academic. He's a professor of psychiatry at Harvard University. I think we're very, very lucky in this country to have somebody of his caliber. (0:47:02)

So can we have a big hand for Dr. Mack? Thrilled to be here tonight and have a chance to talk with you about this phenomenon. I'm trained in adult and child psychiatry and adult and child psychoanalysis. And I'm a relative newcomer to the UFO field. And the reason for this trip is the incident that took place in Rua at the Ariel School. A number of you, I'm sure, know something about what took place there. (0:47:38)

The children we talked with clearly were talking about a phenomenon that occurred in physical reality. The stories were consistent and the way they talked about it left virtually no question in our minds that what happened was just about what they said happened. I know it was strange. It's very weird. It's got so scared. So, yeah, if I had to describe that day, the first thing that I remember is the light and the sound is the main thing that just strikes me. (0:48:16)

And then the two shadows, but especially the sound and the light, the light because it was so bright, the sound because it scared me. Yeah, we heard a sound in that direction. It was sort of like a buzzing noise. It was a very, you know, it was like a buzzing, the buzzing of what you would hear at an electric station or anywhere close to that, like something's being zapped almost. (0:48:43)

It kind of sounded like bees, but more like a, yeah, like a machine bee sound, just very strange. At first I thought maybe it was just me that heard it, but if the other kids around me had heard it, it sounded like it was coming from everywhere. It went louder and louder and then it stopped and we ignored it like, okay, I don't know what that is. (0:49:01)

And then a couple of minutes later it started again. It was much, much louder, like really, really loud, like a swarm of bees. And that's when I started getting scared and everybody started getting scared. And then we started running away from there. (0:49:13)

I noticed that there was a large shape amongst the trees, which we couldn't really figure out what it was. It looked like a big rock. It looked like water was trickling over it and the sun was reflecting in that water. That's the best way I can describe it. It didn't look like a smooth metallic object as you would think when you were looking at a UFO on TV as we depict them. (0:49:48)

It looked natural. It didn't look like anything man-made. You saw it, again, appearing in kind of like in spots. You saw it and you didn't see it, you know, and then you saw it again. The same general area, but it was, that kind of was, you know, like I said, what made you think twice, like, okay, did I, did I see it? Didn't I see it? (0:50:09)

But whenever, you know, then everyone else started saying, yes, I see it. And it was the same thing when we saw whatever beings were there. You know, it wasn't like they were just standing and looking at you. You would see them in various places at various times. So you didn't know if it was one, if it was more than one. He moved kind of strangely, I'd say, almost like a very graceful sort of moment, you know, not like you're stumbling around or anything. (0:50:40)

(transcript 2of2)

（以下は、Ariel school UFO 事件に関するドキュメンタリー動画の文字起こしです。長いので 2分割し、これはその後半部分です。）

You don't look sort of like glided from while he was walking. There wasn't any gravitational pull. It was a very fluid. So when he was moving, it was very fluid and flowy and it wasn't kind of jerky or... Yeah. The strange thing was it was running in slow motion as if you would watch a replay in a football match. It was running in slow motion diagonally down the field. And then suddenly it would reappear in the corner where it started and do the same thing. (0:51:15)

And then it would reappear and do the same thing. And that was frightening, more frightening than seeing what these things actually were, was not being able to see them long enough, I guess. It really ripped my socks off. It was unbelievable. I've got to justify myself to the BBC. And how am I going to explain to a serious BBC editor in London that this is not an April Fool's joke in September? (0:51:52)

The BBC always have this policy that you don't run with one source. You've got to get two or three, preferably three. And I had 20, 30, 40. Now, I put a lot of stake on the physical evidence. But I don't primarily emphasize that, not because I don't think it's critically important. I think the physical evidence is very valuable. But for me, my strongest suit is my clinical investigative approach to create trust, to bring forth whatever it is, and the memories and experiences come flooding back. (0:52:32)

Now, the fact is that people are threatened when they come forward about this. Children, very reluctant to tell their parents. (0:52:41)

And a mother or father may say to a child, oh, you must have been making it up. Your imagination is too lively. And then the child sort of rumbles and they go inside and they do what I call going underground. They know what happened to them, but they don't tell anybody. I mean, you just felt nobody really cared. Who do you talk to? How do you understand it? (0:53:10)

The people in my life that were supposed to be the closest and the support system, it didn't feel like it was there. There was nobody there to say, no, it's okay to talk about it. So we never did. And as children, you have a huge imagination. So you see those sort of things and not know what they are. And you're left with this. Well, where am I? Limbo state of am I safe or am I not safe? (0:53:38)

So it was, I think, as a protective mechanism, block it out, turn it off. Don't don't go back to it. I haven't really talked to anyone about it. I usually kept it quiet, you know, because most people probably think I'm a bit nuts. You're not exactly going to bring up this kind of conversation at a bar or a restaurant or, you know, people think you're crazy. (0:54:05)

It's very hard. It's kind of strange, I guess, because they don't believe you. Some of my close friends know about it, but it's more like not a joke, but they're like, oh, you crazy type of thing, like laughter type. Like it's something funny to, something to laugh about. If this had been 10 years ago, I wasn't in a place where I really wanted to talk about it. (0:54:26)

I just didn't want to be associated with that. It's very self-conscious. So, yeah, it's kind of hard to talk about it. It is. Because it's not something that I bring up to anybody, ever. My husband doesn't even know about it. True expression of how it felt at times. It's really, really difficult to face yourself. That's a scary time. Very, very scary time. A lot of this was done in black at first, because I think that's how I was really feeling. (0:55:12)

This is me, with my hands over my eyes, trying to hide away from everything that's been going on. It got really, really dark. I love this piece. That's when I started using color. It's still a stern face, but I think it's more confident. Yeah, this one. So, here. This is the mouth being zipped up. This was like, when all you want to do is just talk. (0:55:52)

And you feel like you have no one to talk to. I didn't realize that it affected children that much. But it obviously has. Yeah. It was quite difficult, wasn't it? Because your mom and dad would not have believed. They believed that something had occurred, but it was very difficult to integrate. It's very difficult to put your religion, and to see the Christian side of it, with that happening. (0:56:19)

Sorry, Mr. Sertoli. Yes, come in. (0:56:22)

Hi. How are we doing? How are you? Yes. Hello. Hi, how are you? Good to see you. Good to see you, too. Back to your roots, are you? Absolutely. Oh, I don't know. That's beautiful. Yeah, connecting and seeing the school again, and, you know, the events that occurred here in 1994. Yes, the aliens and all that. Yes. So that's what I'm here for. (0:56:43)

That's wonderful. Yeah. Maybe, if you want more, if you don't mind, we can do the tradition thing. Do you mind? I would love to do that. Oh, you'd love to. Okay. Yeah, because culture is a huge part of this. We'll introduce you to a few people. I'll walk you up, and then you can visit all the sacred places, and you can talk to them. (0:56:59)

So when you come back, you're like, wow. Yes. Beautiful. Thank you. Good to see you, isn't it? Good to see you, too. Later. Ms. Pence. Thanks, Mr. Sikle. You're welcome. I saw these beings, and they have black eyes. We got those ones, and we experienced them. Quite a lot. A lot? Yeah. And is it the same description as how I describe it? Yes. That? (0:57:52)

Yeah, but they come in different versions. Yeah. They come in different versions. I don't know what you've heard. We just heard that the aliens came, and they landed at Ariel. What you are seeing and what you are experiencing, I can conclude that they are spiritual messages that you have to deliver. I'm supposed to talk about this with... You don't have to keep it for yourself. (0:58:43)

Yes. You have to share it. And by sharing, then you can be able to change people's hearts and minds. So you have to speak up. If they don't hear you speaking, maybe you have to shout. You have to shout. Yeah, the significance of children is that they are not yet exposed to the world. And they communicate better with the spirits and the nature. (0:59:15)

So it's always good to have children. If you want a message to be delivered, it has to be delivered to children. Because the child grows with the message. We are now going to the burial sites of the chiefs. This is the grave of the royal chief. The Ariels landed on the center of the grave. The sacred shrine. Sacred shrine. Yes. So it's very important. (0:59:56)

It's very important. The Ariels landed on the center of the sacred shrine. Which means they were entangled by the chiefs' graves. The grand-ancestors of Zimbabwe. The minister has been here for decades. Did you hear about it? Sure. Yes, I was quite informed. Can you point to us where the Ariel school is from here? This is the Ariel school. This is where it happened. (1:00:22)

This is where they landed. Oh my gosh. Had you had those thoughts before this experience? No. No. And how did those thoughts come to you? Did they come to you from the craft or from... From the man. (1:00:41)

The man. And the man, did the man say those things to you? How did he get that across to you? Well, he never said anything. It's just that the face has the eyes. Phuong Ngai, what do you imagine is his reason for visiting Earth? I think it's about something that's going to happen. Something that's going to happen? Yes. Like what? Pollution or something. (1:01:08)

Pollution? Yes. And how did he get that idea of pollution across to you? The way he was staring. The way he was staring? Yes. Somehow there was a message about pollution from the way he was staring? Yes. I think they want people to know that we're actually making harm on this world and we mustn't get too technologed. How did that get communicated to you? (1:01:36)

I don't know. But somehow it did? Yes, it came through my head. Through your head? Like through words or...? My conscience, I think. Your what? My conscience. Your conscience told you? Yes. While you were in contact with the being, you mean? While the thing was looking at me. While it was looking at you. It was like this lake of calmness in his eyes. I was compelled to look at him. It wasn't like I wanted to look away from him. (1:02:06)

Time became very still and very bizarre. In my mind, technology and not good feelings about technology either. It was like technology was a bad, dirty word. I think that he was saying to me, beware of the technology, don't go into it too heavy because it's not going to be good for you. It was only when I was looking at him and his face and his eyes that I got that. (1:02:33)

As soon as I looked away from him, that's when all of reality and everything that was happening came back to. And that's when I realised that something really strange is happening here. It's fascinating. This was imagery coming through for them, communicating. But it's done through right in your brain. You were saying that you thought that maybe they were trying to tell us something about the future. Can you say more what you thought it was or what was it like? (1:03:06)

It was like in the world, all the trees would just go down and there would be no air and people would be dying. I think that in space there's no love and down here there is. There is love? Yes. Is there anything we can do with that love as far as taking care of the earth? You talked about the message that we don't take care of the earth. (1:03:36)

No. Why not? Several of them talked about a message being transmitted through the eyes, that the beings were trying to tell us something. What gave that a certain edge of sincerity was they weren't offering solutions, like we've got to become environmentally conscious and do something about the earth. I'd say, well, what are we supposed to do? And they would say, well, no, that's not what they were conveying. (1:04:01)

They were simply telling us that this is what's going on and they felt very upset about it. (1:04:06)

But it wasn't like an ecological, political program or something. So that gave it a kind of authenticity. At first, with no news coverage, they took it seriously. I leave you to check for little green men and flying saucers. And then when Reuters got hold of it, it got very serious. There was a bit of a buzz. It was all in the news and everything. (1:04:30)

You had people that knew about the school from all over. Not just in Zimbabwe, but it was all over the world. Ariel School in Ruwa, about half an hour's drive from the capital Harare. On the other side of the world, an unusual visitor called into a Zimbabwean playground. Unexplained mysteries. Something major has happened in Africa. A unique mass encounter between aliens and schoolchildren. (1:04:57)

Hello, welcome back. Someone who started off as a sceptic, a Pulitzer Prize winner and all the rest of it, have actually been convinced that the people you interviewed at great length and talked to you about their encounters with aliens, that they were actually telling the truth. There is something out there. There is some kind of authentic mystery here, which my training in psychiatry just hasn't prepared me for. (1:05:17)

With all the skill that you have, you are a top American psychiatrist at Harvard, you would be able to tell when people were telling fibs. That's what I'm supposed to be trained to do, is to distinguish between fantasy dreams, psychosis or authentic experience. And this has all the marks of authentic experience. And we just stared at it and we heard this flute, sort of like a flute noise. (1:05:38)

Then I saw this black figure running in slow motion and then I didn't want to see it, so I looked away and I looked again and it wasn't there anymore. When you looked at those children, they were absolutely credible. And you can look at their faces, even on television you can look at their faces and know if they are bullshitting or not. And they weren't. We came away convinced that an extraordinary event occurred here, one of quite unique, I think, in UFO history. (1:06:09)

If there's anything that could convince a skeptical, closed-minded public that some kind of intelligence that is not, as the headmaster said, of this world, then this event should persuade people. I believe, overall, this is a phenomenon of enormous complexity, meaning and value for understanding of ourselves, who we are in the universe, and we're just beginning to grasp what this is about. Welcome back to Larry King Live. He's a Harvard psychiatrist, and though he was once skeptical that beings visited from other planets, he now believes differently. (1:06:54)

John Mack has been a psychiatrist at Harvard University for more than 30 years now. He won a Pulitzer Prize two decades ago for writing a psychological biography of Lawrence of Arabia, but these days his writings have placed him on the academic fringe. Meet Dr. John Mack, a believer in aliens from outer space. (1:07:13)

What would the academics up at Harvard University think about all of this? We started to hear that John was getting to be in trouble. His practice was beginning to be largely about the investigation of these strange phenomena. He had started support groups so that the various people who had reported these strange phenomena could hear the stories from each other and begin to feel a little bit normal. (1:07:40)

No matter how I looked at it, they were talking the way people talk about something that's happened to them. I was stuck with this dilemma. What do you do at that point? Do you say, well, I'm sorry, there's got to be some kind of mental illness I never heard of before? Or do you say maybe what I thought was possible wasn't complete? It seems to me it's clinically and humanly more honest to say there's something I don't know here and to follow your clinical instincts. (1:08:10)

What did you say? What did you tell your mom? This is Kaylee talking now. Go ahead. I said, Mommy, I saw an alien at school and then my mom said she, my mom never would believe me. Yeah? Did it upset you when your mom didn't believe you? Yeah, sometimes. Kaylee! Hi! Hi! How are you? I'm good. How are you? Oh, it's so nice to see you. I know. (1:08:38)

How does it feel? It's crazy. Right? Yes. So do you want to take a little walk? Oh my gosh. And I mean... I know, we have to look. Okay, let's look. Okay. Yeah. I was trying to find mine and I've been looking to find all my pieces because I don't have my drawings as well. See, like these ones you can't see. (1:08:59)

I know, that's why I'm like... Right? Not here. Well, we can keep going. Tell me what you remember. See, I was playing rugby over here. In this open part over here with the little boys. And then all the logs were down there. We're all here. And then... I don't know why I remember a huge tree like this down there. Because that was... that field wasn't there. (1:09:25)

This is where I kind of remember it happening. Like standing over there and then ran. I must have run there closer to... I remember being close to the tuck shop. Well, that's what I remember right here. And I remember Liesl and I right there. So it must be there. Yeah. And... yeah. Emily? Yes. Miss Bates found some of the drawings. Miss Bates found some of the drawings? (1:09:56)

And an envelope on her desk. Aww. Up in the office there. But I think we've been such a run around this morning. We're trying to do things. So they just let us know they're there. Oh, how exciting, right? I hope mine's there. I really hope mine's there too. I hope they're both there. I haven't opened any yet. I haven't looked. Oh my gosh. (1:10:20)

You must be kidding me. (1:10:22)

I'm scared. I'm kind of scared too. Okay, you open it with me. We're together. We're here together. Let's take a peek. Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. I can't see it very nicely, but I'm sure there's... There's a tree. I've drawn this again. Exactly. Like this. You see, it's all shining as well. I saw a crazy light. Oh my gosh. With this coming down. (1:11:13)

I think I blocked out a lot, man. You remember, like we keep saying, like... I think we blocked out a lot. I really do as well. Yeah. Holy shit. Wow. I know, I think a lot of people, like, didn't believe us. It's beautiful. It's so peaceful. I have the best memories here. Me too. With us. I've been so terrible. Well, Miss Bates, she wants to see you. (1:12:06)

She's a little hurt, because she feels like the students have avoided this place for such a long time. Well, you see, that's the thing, is like... I know. What happened. I know. I think that's why I've never come back. I didn't want to deal with... Deal with it. Coming here and remembering all the stuff. I think that's the honest God's truth, that's why I didn't come. (1:12:26)

Yeah. So, 20 years later. We still have the same story. But that's the funny thing, is like, I'm adamant about this tree and the light, and there on my picture, which I don't even remember drawing, it's there. It's there. And I drew that. I can't wait to show my mum. You have to see it to believe it. If somebody's a staunch believer that it's not, how's me telling them my experience going to change what they think? (1:13:04)

It will change what they think about me. It's not going to change what they think about the universe. And I don't need that. But, with 60 of us all saying it together, that will change what that one person thinks of the universe. Many of you are going to think my guests today have lost their minds. To be honest, their stories do sound really crazy. (1:13:32)

But we were intrigued by this man. He is Dr. John Mack, who does believe their stories. The president's lawyer said, what do you think it's like for the dean of the medical school to see one of his professors on Oprah Winfrey saying that men, women and children are being taken by little green men? It does reflect, I think, the anxiety that this caused. (1:13:56)

Well, doctor, is the profession embarrassed when one of your colleagues puts forward theories like this? Oh, yes, we're very embarrassed. Embarrassed for the profession and a little worried about John himself. What, he's gone off the rails a bit? Well, John is a man of great gift and great intelligence. But he's also a man who tends to take on enthusiasms. And in this time, he's gone, gone too far. (1:14:20)

We're worried about him. We hope he'll pull himself together. Come back? (1:14:25)

I sensed that I ought to try to get ahead of the curl on the high exposure that I had. But I was too late. There was something afoot. They were putting together a committee to look into the work and see if I had maintained the standards of the Harvard Medical School. I am Arnold Relman. I am a physician. I was asked by the dean of the Harvard Medical School to look into John's activities. (1:14:59)

In view of all the publicity and the fact that John was using the Harvard Medical School's name quite liberally and implied that the Harvard Medical School was somehow sponsoring what he was doing, the dean wanted to know, what is he doing? His research is shattering preconceptions about alien abductions. He's studied over 100 people and is convinced they are telling the truth. John, you have a very high profile and the fact that you're a professor at Harvard tends to make people believe you. (1:15:28)

Do you think you could be seriously misleading people about what's going on here? The concern is, what is his relationship to the subjects? Is their psychological welfare being protected? And is this a violation of medical standards? I miss this place so much. Just after talking to Mrs. Wacha and the kids in the school and the music in there. I'm like, what's going on? (1:16:24)

It's a horrible feeling, to feel alone. Now you've got us. You've got the whole Ariel family. Everybody's there, looking out for you. Trace and Ginny, they'll be on the other side. Everybody's there for you. Everybody's looking out for you. And I needed that, you know, so badly. They forget that there's a human being. Behind all of this. And nobody asked for it to happen. (1:17:01)

There's Liesl. Liesl Fungi Graham. I remember her too. I remember the face, but I don't remember the name. There are many people who probably are not going to believe certain things until they happen to them. Period. That probably is even more pronounced in the West compared to many other cultures. Because we have advanced so far technologically. Because our technology, which is based in science, is so dramatically powerful that people start thinking that must be all there is. (1:19:09)

A lot of the criticism about John and John's work presupposed that it was simply impossible that people could be visited by aliens, that aliens even exist. To reduce knowledge of reality to purely the physical world? What about the whole emotional world, the spiritual world? When you go into subatomic reality, there is no material world. There's only possibility and probability. The new findings in physics, if you take them seriously, are just as undermining of the dominant worldview as anything I'm talking about. (1:19:48)

Baloney. Old-fashioned physics, new-fashioned physics, quantum mechanics, string theory. You've got to have evidence. You have to be able to measure something. I am morally and virtually certain that what we're dealing with is some kind of internal psychological phenomenon. (1:20:11)

It is inconceivable to me that these people are being abducted by aliens. If they were, then the whole world as we know it is upside down. Harvard University was the kind of global champion of the classical liberal worldview. And he was trying to propose an alternative worldview with the reality of extraterrestrial intelligence. A worldview is a kind of psychic glue. It sort of orients you. (1:20:44)

It's what allows people to think they know who they are in the worlds that matter to us. Family groups that we're in, institutions, schools. What's possible is a matter of worldview. A culture decides what's real. What's real in this culture is completely different than what's true in other cultures. I really think human egoism in the broadest sense is what is at stake. Our sense of value, our sense of who we are. (1:21:18)

Are we powerful? Are we in charge of our own fate? Freud said there's three big blows to human egoism. The first was the discovery by Copernicus and Galileo that the Earth was not at the center of the cosmos. The second was Darwin's finding that we're not particularly different from the other animal species. Freud claimed his was a third, that we're not really in charge of our own individual lives. (1:21:49)

And this, I think, could be a fourth. We're far from being the most intelligent or advanced creatures in the cosmos. I think in the broad scheme of things, it's not a socially good thing to do. It promotes the cult of mysticism and magic and superstition. You know, the X-File kind of mentality. They're out there and the government won't let us find out about it. (1:22:25)

It's childish and it's not good for the American public. Why should this be so remarkable when we claim to believe in God and all kinds of spirits, and yet there's something about this one which takes a form that is particularly disturbing to us. There's a lot of perrumpfing that goes on. Well, we don't really want to be identified with this kind of science. (1:22:52)

It's okay to be identified with other bizarre views that might emanate, but we have our limits too. Remember, we're a university that has a divinity school. We know the boundaries. Theology is okay, but extraterrestrials, no. Angels, yes. Extraterrestrials, no. Let's just sit down and rationally, objectively talk it through, because there's a lot we don't understand. There's a lot we worship in our various religions that's meaningful and inexplicable. (1:23:31)

You can't just rule stuff out willy-nilly, because there is a magical side of life that is very precious. I'm a Christian in my beliefs, but that doesn't mean to say that I think there's no other types or forms of life that exist in the universe. There is a God, but there's also other things around that can't be explained, you know. It's another creature. (1:24:05)

They teach you there's no such thing as aliens, because God created just human beings. That's what I was taught too. That's what I grew up thinking. (1:24:13)

The universe is so big, so I can't completely say it's a fact that there's no such thing as life outside of Earth's solar system. The universe is a beautiful, strange place, and we're just human beings, and we can't know everything. Maybe we don't have the capacity to understand it. We may be just exploring the limited reaches of space. Beyond that, we absolutely know nothing in terms of life or how life exists elsewhere. (1:24:45)

Maybe it's too disturbing. In the beginning of my going public with this, I received absolutely no general acceptance. There were no particular advantages to be gained, and every disadvantage. There were assaults from every direction in terms of the main part of my profession. If it was an opportunity, it was an opportunity to commit professional suicide. It's a dirty subject. If you want to sustain a career in the BBC after having been in many war zones, you don't suddenly come up with a UFO story, which was absolutely waterproof. (1:25:32)

Then they just said, Tim's suffering from the stress and strains of all the war zones he's done, he's lost the plot, he's gone bonkers. I think that's when my career with the BBC... ...ended. Gone. I think I lost my credibility, because you don't talk about these things. When I was in residency, John's office was on the main floor of the psychiatric wing. When I came back in 2004, his office was off-site. And I actually took that as a sort of metaphor for him being pushed out and extruded in a certain sense. (1:26:24)

Finally, the dean of the medical school wrote a letter to John, basically apologizing. And saying that it was unfortunate that he had misconstrued what it was that they were trying to do. And reiterated this totally foolish position that they had, that all the dean was trying to do was to get some information so he could respond to calls that he was getting. And so they ended up dropping the entire thing and letting him go back into doing his normal work at the university. (1:27:00)

I accept Dr. Mack's statements at face value. He is inquiring and probing, and he has the right to be wrong. The most fundamental right that any academic has is the right to be wrong. Prove that he's wrong. That's the job of other academics. He became the iconic figure of someone from inside a major institution who was willing to take the risks and pay the consequences for what he believed in. (1:27:32)

My respect for John Mack, for his courage, for the difficulties that he's undergone. I think any human being would have to admit that if the UFO phenomenon is occurring as the reports suggest, it's the most important event in human history. You can fit in one suitcase. I'm going to miss you when you go. Are you going to miss me when I go? Yes! (1:28:46)

I really thank you for everything. I know I felt so welcome here. (1:28:56)

To our basement. Come on, you'll be fine. I know. Absolutely fine. It's a very precious thing to me, to be able to have this drawing again and look at it and say, after 21 years, I'm still depicting it exactly the same way. And I can put it with the rest of them. I have probably over 300 pieces. And it started here. I don't know what it means for me further down the road, but I feel more confident. (1:30:49)

It's a stepping stone forward to go out, show my art, share my story, and feel good about it. With my family, they've been extremely supportive throughout this whole thing, and they've understood that this is something that I've had to go through. My mother has started speaking a bit about it. My father, for the first time at the dinner table, brought it up. But I don't know if this is something that they'll ever be able to accept completely. (1:31:26)

But I know that they love me and they trust me. They know, because they were there, that something happened. I'd like to introduce Emily Tripp, one of the witnesses at the Ruiz & Bobway in 1994. That was the day my world shattered. And my outlook on the world became something completely brand new to me. I'm thankful for going through such a process and a journey in life, which has led me to discover, look deeper into the meanings of things, and become more self-aware. And I appreciate you taking the time to allow me to speak. (1:32:33)

And thank you for your understanding in something so very personal. I don't know why it had to be Rua. Small, rural, farming town. I truly don't. But, for whatever reason, it did. It happened. I'd like to know what we've seen and find out what it wanted. Why us? Why us kids? You know? It was a wonderful experience, actually. Because I know, definitely, I'm not going to see something like that ever again. (1:33:34)

Maybe, who knows? It's something that I will pass on to my kids one day. They might be just here as observers. We're just an interesting part of the local community. Like, we go to safari in Africa, see this other creature which is unique to that world. For some people, it is scary. Very scary. Because it kind of makes them feel humanity is not in complete control of their destinies. (1:34:15)

And we think we are the dominant species on the planet. But maybe we are the dominant species on the planet, but maybe not the dominant species in this corner of the universe. I think it's left me open-minded. I think it's a bit arrogant to say that we are the only life in the galaxy of the universe. I think it's good to speak about it. (1:34:39)

If there was one experience I'd like to relive, it would be that particular experience. I don't really say, I swear, man, it was there, that sort of thing. (1:34:50)

You don't have to believe me. I'm sure a lot of people who have seen it barely believe themselves. I don't think that the answer is out there. I don't think that I'm going to find an answer from googling it or from talking to others about it. I think it's a long story, is the answer. I think the answer will come maybe in this lifetime, maybe in the next. (1:35:14)

I don't know. I'm glad I was there. It really stretched my mind and gave me a new perspective on life, the universe and everything, really. I would not have missed that for the world. That's all I can say. Would you like to see him again? Yes. You would like to see him again. And if you saw him again, what would you do? I'll ask him some questions. (1:37:49)

What would you like to ask him? I'll ask him what is he doing on earth and what does he want with us.

(1:37:55)

(2025-07-03)