Robert Hastings : Phillip Corso はアレはジョークだと周囲に告白していた。彼の主治医は「現実と妄想」の識別が困難になっていたことを指摘

2025年1月30日 · 約50分

前置き

Robert Hastings が Philip Corso について聞かれて、答えた内容が記録に値する。

DeepL は相変わらず係り受け構文を無視するので、和訳は酷い。意味不明。まともな AI で訳しなおすのもダルい。要点は以下の部分。

要点

Would you mind commenting on something you probably don't take that very seriously, but still was a major attempt to explain what Roswell was and its utility, which was the day after Roswell by Colonel Philip Corso. What do you think of that effort in that book?
No one that I respect considers it credible. Corso himself is allegedly on record as saying it was a joke. I've talked to people whose credibility I respect who said that off the record he actually admitted that he was getting away with a lot and he thought he was having a high time. (0:10:41)
...
And Kevin Randall, a highly respected Roswell researcher, told me that he had a letter, a private letter from, I believe, Colonel Corso's physician, personal physician, in which this gentleman said after Corso's death in this letter that Corso had mental problems at the end of his life, that he had some ability, some inability to deal with reality. (0:11:24)

Robert Hastings は UFO 研究者の中では珍しく Linda Moulton Howe を端的に

Linda Howe is very good at that. She can't differentiate between credible sources and liars and hoaxers. (0:13:28)

と批判できている。

FasterWhisper AI(large-v2 model) + DeepL(2024-07 model)

Would you mind commenting on something you probably don't take that very seriously, but still was a major attempt to explain what Roswell was and its utility, which was the day after Roswell by Colonel Philip Corso. What do you think of that effort in that book? No one that I respect considers it credible. Corso himself is allegedly on record as saying it was a joke. I've talked to people whose credibility I respect who said that off the record he actually admitted that he was getting away with a lot and he thought he was having a high time. (0:10:41)

And I don't want to say specifically what I'm about to say. I don't know the exact facts, but I can relate to you, generally speaking, that shortly after the book came out, in the mid-90s, I talked to Kevin Randall. I said, what's the deal with this Colonel Corso? And Kevin Randall, a highly respected Roswell researcher, told me that he had a letter, a private letter from, I believe, Colonel Corso's physician, personal physician, in which this gentleman said after Corso's death in this letter that Corso had mental problems at the end of his life, that he had some ability, some inability to deal with reality. (0:11:24)

For example, Randall mentioned Corso's claims that aliens had contacted him, according to Kevin Randall, and had told him to get onto Holloman Air Force Base, where allegedly they had craft that the Air Force had captured. (0:11:43)

And Corso's job was to get onto the base and to shut down the base's radar so that the aliens could sneak into these craft and take them off the base, fly them away without being tracked on radar. Now, hopefully none of your listeners believe that's a credible story. You know, that's obviously not the statements of somebody who has their mental faculties, in my opinion. So whether it was due to Corso having a good time by pulling the wool over everyone's eyes, or, you know, he was actually unraveling mentally at the end of his life remains an open question. (0:12:25)

But anyone who looks closely at the statements he's made, and the background story behind his book, is clearly there's no credibility in his claims whatsoever. One of the things I found interesting was that since his claims were so specific, shall we say, that there didn't seem to be any kind of pushback by any of the authorities. It seemed like they just let him get away with saying all those things also, maybe because they didn't particularly worry about it. (0:12:57)

Well, when you say authorities, I don't know if you mean the media or the government. I mean both, particularly the government. They weren't saying, unless it happened and I didn't realize it, but it didn't seem to me that there was any real pushback against them by the government. He was creating, I mean, he was muddy in the waters with what he was adding to the public domain. Linda Howe is very good at that. She can't differentiate between credible sources and liars and hoaxers. (0:13:28)

And so when you listen to what Linda Howe puts out, it's a mix of credible information with absolute nonsense. We could get into the discussion of the MJ-12 incident, which she primarily was involved with bringing to the public back in the 80s, which is a total fabrication, hoax, slash disinformation scheme. And she's still talking about that as if it were credible information. So, I mean, people like that serve a purpose. (0:14:04)

They muddy the waters. And Corso, from the government's point of view, given that at some point, credible people, people who would research what he was saying and what it was based on, and do background checks like Rambo did on the man's mental health and so on, would quickly arrive at the fact that this was not a reliable source of information. That just helps the government obfuscate the actual story, because you've got all this nonsense floating around out there. People don't know what to believe or not to believe. (0:14:25)

It serves the purpose of those that are trying to keep the core incident, the actual facts of the case, as presented, for example, by General Exxon, to the public. I see. (0:14:54)

▼DeepL 訳（酷いレベル）：展開

ロズウェルが何であったか、そしてその有用性を説明する大きな試みであった。その本の中のその試みをどう思いますか？私が尊敬する人たちは、誰も信用できると思っていません。コルソ自身、あれはジョークだったと公言している。私が尊敬する信頼できる人たちに聞いたところ、オフレコでは、彼は実際に多くのことから逃げ回っていたことを認めており、彼は楽しい時間を過ごしていると思っていたそうです。 (0:10:41)

そして、これから言うことを具体的に言いたくはない。正確な事実は知りませんが、一般的に言えば、この本が出版された直後、90年代半ばに、ケビン・ランドールと話をしました。私は、このコルソ大佐とはどういう関係なのかと言った。ケビン・ランドールは、ロズウェルの研究者として非常に尊敬されている人ですが、彼は、コルソ大佐の主治医、個人的な主治医からの手紙を持っていると言いました。 (0:11:24)

例えば、ランドールは、ケビン・ランドールによれば、エイリアンがコルソに接触し、ホロマン空軍基地に行くように言ったというコルソの主張について言及した。 (0:11:43)

そしてコルソの仕事は基地に乗り込み、基地のレーダーを停止させることだった。そうすればエイリアンはこれらの機体に忍び込み、基地から持ち出し、レーダーで追跡されることなく飛び去ることができる。さて、リスナーの誰もそんな話が信憑性のある話だとは思っていないことを祈る。私の意見では、それは明らかに精神的に正常な人の発言ではない。だから、コルソが皆の目を欺いて楽しい時間を過ごしていたのか、それとも実際に人生の終わりに精神的に崩壊していたのかは、未解決のままだ。 (0:12:25)

しかし、彼の発言や彼の本の背景をよく見れば、彼の主張に信憑性がないことは明らかだ。私が興味深いと思ったことのひとつは、彼の主張があまりにも具体的であったため、言うなれば、どの当局からも何の反発もなかったように見えたことだ。特に心配することもなかったからか、当局も彼の発言をそのまま放置しているようだった。 (0:12:57)

さて、当局と言っても、メディアを指すのか政府を指すのかわからない。特に政府。彼らは何も言わなかったし、私が気づかなかっただけで、政府による彼らに対する実質的な後押しがあったようには思えなかった。彼は、つまり、パブリックドメインに追加するもので水を濁していたのだ。リンダ・ハウはそれが得意だ。彼女は信頼できる情報源と嘘つきやデマの区別がつかない。 (0:13:28)

だからリンダ・ハウの発信するものを聞くと、信頼できる情報と絶対的なナンセンスが混在している。 MJ-12事件については、彼女が80年代に世間に知らしめた、まったくのでっち上げであり、デマであり、偽情報である。そして、彼女はいまだにそれが信頼できる情報であるかのように話している。つまり、あのような人々には目的があるのだ。 (0:14:04)

水を濁すのだ。コルソは、政府の立場からすれば、ある時点で、信頼できる人々、彼の言っていることやその根拠を調査し、ランボーが行ったように、彼の精神状態などの身元調査を行う人々が、この人物が信頼できる情報源ではないという事実にすぐにたどり着くだろう。このようなデタラメな情報が出回っているのだから、政府は実際の話を難解にするだけだ。人々は何を信じればいいのか、何を信じなければいいのかわからない。 (0:14:25)

核心的な事件、例えばエクソン将軍が提示したような実際の事実を世間に知られないようにしようとしている人たちの目的にかなうのです。なるほど。 (0:14:54)

音声(53:15)

THR 18： NUKES AND UFOS- ROBERT HASTINGS PART 2

FasterWhisper AI(large-v2 model) + DeepL(2024-07 model)

▼原文展開

This is Johnny Blue Star. Welcome to Threshold, a global media event. Is the universe just a random dance of atoms? Or is it a manifestation of a supremely intelligent architect? Can its purpose, or our purpose here on Earth, be adequately assessed? Can we commune with it, know its intentions, cooperate with its direction? Here, we define Threshold as a gateway state of awareness, allowing mankind to cross into a place of real cognition. (0:00:32)

Threshold allows us to approach questions of higher reality through the door of experience, rather than mere belief. Welcome to Threshold, where we tear away the veil from commercial media, bringing our audience and participants into another realm of reality and enhanced communication. Welcome back to Threshold. I'm with UFOs and nukes author Robert Hastings. This book is about extraordinary encounters in nuclear weapon sites and is the result of decades of research by Robert Hastings. Welcome back, Robert. Hello. One of the most controversial, but perhaps significant examples of UFO involvement with our weapons was the Big Sur incident that you describe in your book. (0:01:25)

In this alleged event, which occurred in 1964, an Atlas D intercontinental missile launched from Vandenberg Air Force Base was seemingly shot down by a disk-shaped UFO. Maybe you could fill us in about details about this incident and the implications for government involvement in preventing the open disclosure of UFO events. We primarily know about this case through the very courageous efforts of Dr. Robert Jacobs, who was an Air Force lieutenant in 1964. He was the officer in charge of photo instrumentation at the base. (0:02:03)

His job was to use a high-powered telescopic camera to film missile tests over the Pacific Ocean. He has been able, through his personal log and other means, to pin the date of this event to probably sometime in September of 1964. What they witnessed, long story short, through the telescopic camera was as the dummy nuclear warhead which they were testing, which was being sent out over the Pacific Ocean for a splashdown. (0:02:39)

They witnessed on film a disk-shaped object with a dome flying in from out of camera frame, circling this warhead and at four different junctures firing what looked like, he said, not quite like lightning, but very similar to lightning in appearance, a beam of some kind from the UFO to the dummy warhead. There were four separate flashes, at which point the UFO left the camera frame and the warhead began to spin and tumble and fell into the ocean hundreds of miles short of its target. (0:03:12)

A second officer who was involved in photo interpretation, a retired major named Florence Mansman, who after retiring from the Air Force began research at Stanford University on various technical systems, very intelligent, technically oriented man, has come forward after critics said that Bob Jacobs was lying, has come forward and corroborated his story. There are letters at my website on the document page in which Mansman saying Bob got it 100% right. (0:03:46)

But Mansman was a little reluctant to talk about it because the film was confiscated by the CIA. And he clearly says that, but apparently there was some pressure applied to Mansman, or at least he was concerned about pressure. (0:04:01)

And so what he said was far less provocative than Bob Jacobs. What Bob Jacobs, on the other hand, said, I felt that the public had a right to know about this. He wrote a couple of magazine articles about it in the early 80s, at which point he began getting death threats over the telephone. Clearly somebody was very unhappy that he had gone public with a story that confirmed that whoever fly the UFOs not only can disrupt the functionality of nuclear missiles in their silos on the ground, but can actually pace them in space, catch up with them, as the film clearly demonstrated, and shoot them down, literally. (0:04:40)

And as you might imagine, the Pentagon, the CIA, would not want this information to be known publicly. Nevertheless, Bob has stuck to his guns. I have articles at my website about this. Now, skeptics have said this is a lie by Jacobs, and they never mention Mansman because Mansman corroborates the story completely. So when the debunkers are trying to get rid of this case, they always concentrate on Jacobs and never admit that someone else, a distinguished Air Force officer, has corroborated that Jacobs was 100% truthful in what he said. (0:05:17)

But at my website, again on the document page, if you scroll down, there is an article that the Reuters News Agency circulated in the summer of 1974 that talked about an incident some months earlier in the summer of 73, where an Army spokesman went public and said virtually the same thing happened a decade after the Big Sur case. He was briefing the media. Apparently this Army officer who was involved with the Army's ballistic missile program was unaware of the degree of sensitivity involved in these cases and was quite candid in what he told the media. (0:05:59)

In that case, you'll see the article talks about ghost ships, which is what the reporter for the Reuters News Agency chose to characterize the UFO as a ghost ship. It talks about one of these mysterious objects pacing a dummy nuclear warhead in flight and maneuvering quite near it. It describes it as saucer-shaped and so on. I mean, just remarkable admissions that you would not expect to read in the media. (0:06:26)

In that particular case, the article doesn't explicitly address it. Apparently the warhead did splash down on its designated target, but it's quite clear what was said, what was admitted to publicly. You've got virtually a carbon copy of the Big Sur case a decade later, where an unidentified flying object maneuvered near a dummy nuclear warhead in flight. Well, during the first part of the show, we did play a radio broadcast from the original Roswell incident right after Roswell took place. And that was very explicit too. (0:07:01)

And it became a weather balloon, I think, a day later. But it couldn't have been more clear from what they were talking about that it was some kind of extraterrestrial object. There's so much written about Roswell, most of which, in my opinion, is... I mean, the story, you're always trying to separate the signal from the noise. There's so much noise out there nowadays. (0:07:27)

What I recommend to people, if you want a good bead on the Roswell case, Google Arthur Exxon, General Exxon, E-X-O-N. He's a retired Brigadier Air Force General, now deceased, who, in the 1990-91 timeframe, publicly admitted, I mean, candidly talked to researcher Dr. Kevin Randall and others about the fact that the Roswell craft was, quote, a craft from space. (0:07:56)

And Exxon was at Wright Field, later Wright-Patterson Air Force Base. When plane loads of debris from the craft arrived at the base for analysis, he was, at the time, involved in an engineering course, a two-year program provided by the then Army Air Force to enhance his engineering skills. Then Lieutenant Colonel Exxon said that the engineers that were involved in the analysis of the debris from the Roswell craft, he said that two of them felt that it was probably Russian technology based on captured German technology at the end of World War II. But Exxon said the majority of the analysts felt this was extraterrestrial. (0:08:53)

And once that analysis had been made by the actual analysts at Wright Field, Exxon says the information quickly went up the chain of command all the way to President Truman. And Exxon is on record as saying within 24 hours, everyone from Truman on down knew that we had in our hands a, quote, craft from space. Now, a researcher named David Rudiak has a website called Roswell Proof. If you go to that website, Roswell Proof, and Google Exxon, E-X-O-N, General Arthur Exxon, you will read for yourself his verbatim statements. (0:09:23)

These were either on audio tape or in writing to various researchers. (0:09:52)

So the debunkers can say what they will, but if you cut through all of the crap, which a lot of it is, that has come forth about Roswell in the decades since, and go back to this one credible source, you'll see that a former high-ranking Air Force officer, who, by the way, 20 years later in the early 60s was the actual base commander of Wright-Patterson Air Force Base, saying on the record that Roswell involved the recovery of an alien spaceship. (0:09:57)

It serves the purpose of those that are trying to keep the core incident, the actual facts of the case, as presented, for example, by General Exxon, to the public. I see. (0:14:54)

You know, getting back to your original, one of the original inspirations for your research was an article discovered by Dr. Alan Hynek, which had to do with activities of UFOs at the Minot Launch Control Center in North Dakota. Now, he originally, of course, the story that a lot of people know, he was more or less considered an adversary of the UFO phenomenon when he was a consultant with the Air Force's Project Blue Book, but later changed his attitude. (0:15:08)

What do you think of his reverse on what it meant for the UFO community? (0:15:14)

I believe the case you're talking about was from August 25th, if I'm not mistaken, 1966, where UFOs maneuvered near several nuclear missile sites operated by Minot Air Force Base, North Dakota. At the time, he was a consultant to Project Blue Book. As you said correctly, he was a debunker. He was a skeptic. When he left Air Force service, I think in 70 or 71, probably 1970 at the closure of Blue Book, he slowly but surely went from skeptic to a proponent for the reality of UFOs. But in December of 1966, the Saturday Evening Post, which was a major magazine at the time, wrote a story about UFOs largely based on Hynek's perspective on it. (0:16:08)

And they actually brought forward and mentioned this case that was technically still classified about these UFO incidents at Minot's missile sites. What Hynek did, to his credit, on a couple of occasions, he did this also with another incident in August of 65 at F.E. Warren Air Force Base. There were pieces of paper that were discussing very sensitive things that, primarily due to oversight, did not get formally stamped with a classification level. (0:16:37)

And to his credit, Hynek, in effect, put those in his briefcase and took them home, and over time, publicly released those. And so he was trying to push for the truth in a very surreptitious way when he could. I mean, if he had leaked a classified document, he would have been in deep trouble. But it's clear by those two actions in the Saturday Evening Post article, and later in his book, The UFO Experience in 72, where he released this document about incidents at F.E. Warren's missile sites, that he was trying, within the letter of the law, without getting himself in trouble, to talk about these cases publicly and get some discussion going about them. (0:17:19)

So yes, when I became aware of, some years later actually, this article in December of 66, I was not aware of until 1973, it was clear to me that multiple sources, credible researchers, were talking about UFO activity at missile sites. Well, you mentioned specifically, you actually published part of these log entries that he disclosed in 1972. Yeah. And it's pretty amazing stuff here. I mean, it was just, all kinds of stuff were happening there, right? (0:17:53)

In that particular case, it was a telephone operator for Project Blue Book got a call from F.E. Warren Air Force Base. The man who took the call was making notes in which he was talking about rather amazing things. As you said, the log is published in my book. In which, you know, over a timeline, he had the actual time that the events occurred that he was being... they were being reported to him over the phone by persons at F.E. Warren Air Force Base calling Project Blue Book. They have the exact time and then several, I would say, over a dozen entries where at one missile site or another designated, for example, Echo or Tango or Kilo. Cases where disk-shaped objects, in some cases up to nine objects at one time, were seen in formations above these missile sites. (0:18:48)

And when that telephone log was handed to staff members at Blue Book and including Heineck, Heineck at some point became aware of it, someone had failed to put a classification on this telephone log. It was not a technically classified secret or top secret or even at all. (0:19:07)

So that's what allowed Heineck to publish it in his book, The UFO Experience in 1972. And at that point he had left Air Force service. You can imagine that people in the Pentagon were extremely pissed off by the fact that he had done that. And previously when he had leaked the Minot cases in this Saturday Evening Post article. So again, he was, even though the majority of his time with Blue Book he was quite skeptical, he was the one who came up with the swamp gas explanation for what were really credible UFO sightings in Michigan. And 66, even though that was his public face toward the end of his involvement with the Air Force, he was beginning to do these things like where he could within legal means release very sensitive information about UFOs at missile sites. (0:19:57)

Yeah, in this particular case, I noted that they even had one situation where they had a white oval UFO over a site, H20, H2. And in another case there were six UFOs stacked vertically. I mean, all kinds of strange and complex formations all at the same time. Sort of like a major exhibition or something. This last incident involving the six UFOs that were stacked up, they were actually in a diagonal formation at a lower altitude to a higher altitude. (0:20:35)

They were moving off at a diagonal angle, but hovering in formation. I've actually interviewed the launch officer, Jay Earnshaw, who was involved in that. In fact, if one goes to my website, UFOHastings.com and goes to the documentary page, I have a now-completed documentary film based on my book. You can click on a link to the writer from the film, and you'll see Jay Earnshaw talking about this incident where these six UFOs were stacked up in this diagonal fashion outside of a launch control facility at his missile facility. (0:21:17)

These guys are on the record again in the press conference that I held in Washington, which CNN streamed live on September 27, 2010. It's on my homepage. You can see a full hour of Air Force veterans talking about UFO activity at missile sites, which they were directly involved in. Yeah, it is a tremendous experience to view that. I've seen it several times. One time a long time ago. (0:21:47)

Recently, again, it still holds just the same fascination for me. Are you still engaged in presenting a documentary? The film was finished in June, and a benefactor, a wealthy individual, basically financed it, put up $130,000. I raised $15,000 through public funding operation. So the film basically cost almost $150,000 to create. Creating a documentary film is not cheap. In any case, I'm on the threshold of hooking up with an agent, a film distributor. We hope to license the film both in the U.S. and around the world. (0:22:33)

I'm trying to maximize the audience worldwide for this film. Putting it on YouTube does not do that, and it does not help my benefactor, the man who paid for the film, make his money back, which is all he's trying to do. (0:22:46)

So we're trying to get the film licensed. It's right now in limbo. It's finished. It's going to knock people's socks off if it does get broadcast. So we're making every effort to get some network in the U.S. interested in airing it. If my agent or the man that I'm about to hook up with is successful, hopefully within the next year we're going to have this on something like the History Channel or something equivalent to that. (0:23:15)

I'm also trying to get it broadcast again in Europe, Australia, Japan, just so this is a worldwide presentation. Well, that's terrific. I'm just very glad to hear it, and I know how difficult it is to do such things. We're going to take a break now. People, again, go to my documentary page and look at the, I think it's a five-minute excerpt, the trailer from the film. The film's called UFOs and Nukes, The Secret Link Revealed, and you can Google those words and see the video, or else you can go to my documentary webpage and access it as well. (0:23:54)

Yes, it's really interesting. Well, we're going to play another song by Stephanie Slevin. This one gives a bit of the mood one might have when looking at the countries involved in engineering the mad scenario. It's called Look at What You've Done. You broke and starved her body, and I freed you from your sin. But look what you've done to this child of mine, cause you let the darkness in. You cannot be saved, for I gave you a lasted chance, but you chose the path to darkness. (0:25:04)

And you did the devil's dance. Oh, look what you have done to this little child of mine. Look what you have done, for your darkness has gone blind. Forever in her sorrow, her happiness assured. Little broken girl, nobody wants to know. And I did always love her, since the age of birth. But she could not feel my love, for she felt she had no worth. (0:25:57)

Oh, look what you have done to this little child of mine. Look what you have done, for your darkness has gone blind. And you can see her torment, as she cries out in the rain. And I can feel her pain, as she always calls my name. It is the 15th century. El Tesoro de Cielo, a Spanish treasure ship sends a scouting expedition to a strange island. Golden statues surrounding them prove the enormity of their find. Suddenly, hordes of foolish creatures with scaly green flesh and skeletal wings descend upon them from the sky. (0:27:09)

What do you think of this, Rufio? These creatures are fragile, Captain. We can take them with our swords. They seem supernatural. Who knows what powers they possess? Fallen angels, weakened by their treason. My God! Are you saying we lethal them? The devil's host? I'm saying, whatever they are, we can take them. Do any of you cowards dare join me? Up against sharp knife-like nails and hideous fangs, the men's swords rip into slimy green flesh. Though black blood pours copiously from their half-naked bodies, creatures miraculously persist. Can the crew survive this bloody, cursed battle? (0:27:45)

Find out more by googling The Thrice-Born, a new sci-fi supernatural novel by Carlos Lopez Avery and Johnny Bluestar. Google with the words Carlos Johnny Kendall. The Thrice-Born. That's Carlos Johnny Kendall. The Thrice-Born. This is Johnny Bluestar. I've worked as a lyricist with Patricia Welsh for over five years, along with Russian composer Edgar Arends, a friend and colleague. Her ability as a singer is simply amazing. She brings a unique and dramatic flair to every song she sings. (0:28:20)

Over the next few months, we shall be releasing a number of these songs, part of an album called Hadley's Castle. Meanwhile, Patricia has been busy creating a super enjoyable collection of classic standards in an exciting 46-song, three-CD collection. (0:28:35)

Standards spanning decades of hit songs. Going to a friend's home for dinner, cocktails, dinner, and dessert with Patricia also makes the perfect hostess gift. This three-CD compilation is the perfect background music that sets just the right mood for any dinner party. To purchase this album, just go to patriciawelch.com forward slash cd. That is patriciawelch.com forward slash cd. You won't be disappointed. Well, I think that there's so many amazing parts to this book and also to your press conference. Let's combine them for a second. Perhaps you could tell us, first of all, how you managed to bring off a press conference like this. (0:30:02)

Bob Sallis, who is a former missile officer, he was involved in an incident at Malmstrom when my dad was there in March of 67, called the Oscar flight shut down. He was on alert with his commander, a man named Colonel Fred Mywald, who passed away, I think, three years ago, maybe. Sallis, back in, I think, 94, 95, went public and said that I was on duty at Oscar flight at Malmstrom when this object flew in out of nowhere and hovered over the front gate of the launch control facility, at which point the missiles went down. (0:30:47)

And Mywald, Colonel Mywald, has admitted part of that. He is very reluctant, or he was in his life, to fully corroborate what Bob had said, either because of what he viewed as his patriotic duty to keep it classified or whether he had other concerns about repercussions if he went public. I don't know, but he did substantiate that there were UFOs present that night, that after the missiles shut down, they got alarms on two of the missiles, meaning that there were intruders that had violated the security around these two particular missiles. (0:31:28)

Each one of these launch control facilities controls 10 missiles, and Mywald admitted that they had sent out a security alert team to Air Force police to try to investigate one of these cases. And these guys saw the UFO hovering over the missile and were so terrified, they immediately turned around and raced back to the launch control facility. Mywald said that one guy was so undone, was so terrified, that he actually had to be taken to the base hospital before the end of his shift. (0:32:02)

So he's partially confirmed what Salas had said. Salas and I had been in touch since 1998, and we decided at some point we would try to hold a press conference and get the media's attention. So it took time to get the money together, to get the people willing to go on the record to publicly talk, and we did pull that off again on September 27, 2010. The other thing involved was the money. (0:32:37)

We had to raise funds, again, through a public funding campaign. We managed to raise, I think it was about $4,000. We also had another military veteran, who I'm not at liberty to identify, who was willing to put up all of his Marriott hotel points to put up these veterans that appeared at the press conference, which would have cost us several thousand dollars to do that. (0:32:54)

And so just by hook and crook, we basically pulled it together. (0:32:58)

What amazed us was we thought we would get some coverage, some degree of coverage, but about 10 minutes before the event was about to start, CNN showed up and said, If you give us a few minutes to set up our cameras, we're going to stream this live. That's great. We'll wait. So we did, and they did in fact stream it live, which is what I have at my website. (0:33:23)

So we actually, if one Googled the title of my press release for the news conference, in the three days prior to the news conference, you would get set up to 2.7 million hits just by Googling the title of a press conference. So it went viral. I mean, we had the world's attention for about a week. Getting back to the suppression of this overall story by the media, with one exception, I was interviewed by CNN two days later. (0:33:54)

None of these veterans were approached by big name media and asked for follow-up interviews. No investigative, gated reporters went to the Pentagon to try to either refute the story or get some substantiation. The story, it was like it never happened, even though it got this worldwide publicity for two or three days. And I think in large part, a lot of that has to do with media bias, people who think they know that UFOs are nonsense and not a serious news story and are unwilling to risk their personal reputations or their network or their news organizations' reputations by covering, seriously covering a UFO story. (0:34:39)

I think that's part of it. But we know from what's called the Church hearings back in 1975 in the Senate, Senator Frank Church did investigations into CIA operations and abuses of American law. And there was one day devoted to CIA infiltration of the national media. And in that one day, before it was more or less cut off prematurely, in my opinion, there was a discussion of CIA having an ongoing working relationship with major media groups. (0:35:13)

And again, this was 1975, including the New York Times, CBS News, and Time Magazine, major, major news outlets in the United States. And there was testimony presented under oath in the Senate that the CIA had an ongoing working relationship to plant stories, to kill stories, basically do what the CIA's bidding was in a given case. And I think it's clear when you look at how the New York Times, the Washington Post, other major media groups have covered the UFO story. (0:35:47)

After 1953, when it seems as if the CIA took control of it, there's some substantial corroboration documentation. In my book I have a whole chapter about the CIA. The Air Force basically has been following the lead of the CIA since 1953 on the UFO story. Most people don't know that. And there was a taste of that presented in these Senate hearings in 1975. So it's not just media bias, it's not just people worried about their reputations when a big UFO story doesn't get covered. (0:36:23)

It's something going on behind the scenes involving government pressure, government persuasion, whatever the relationship is. (0:36:31)

There's a man, unfortunately he died very young, Jerry Hansen, but he wrote a book called The Missing Times. I would recommend this book as strongly as I would recommend my own book. He spent years pursuing government infiltration of the media. He's got it in this book, The Missing Times, chapter and verse, documented completely. If people want to know about how the CIA and other agencies have infiltrated the media on the UFO story, and suppressed stories, changed stories, manipulated information before it gets to the public, Jerry Hansen is the man who documented it in this book called The Missing Times. It's available as an e-book at Amazon. You know, there's... I wish we had a couple more hours, because I'm looking at my notes here, and I see that there's just so much that I took out to discuss, but there's so much more that's in your book. (0:37:31)

But one of the things that I think, since we've talked a little bit about the shooting down the plane, and the disabling of missile launch, of missiles. Now, here's one, the really important one, that occurs in Minox Air Force Base in the mid-60s, where a UFO, one UFO, passes over many different flight areas and initiates anomalous signals from various missiles in that flight. (0:38:05)

At one time, seemingly initiating a launch-in-progress signal. Now, that strikes me as a very powerful form of manipulation. Yeah, that... I think I opened that chapter in my book by saying this is the most frightening or disconcerting case that I had uncovered. A man named David Shure, his name is spelled S-C-H-U-U-R, and if one Googles UFO David Shure, you can find his on-the-record testimony now online. (0:38:41)

But he told me back in 2007 that when he was a missile launch officer at Minot, in 66, he couldn't pin down the month. He, as you said, got indications from his guards that this object was moving from missile to missile. These are widely scattered about three to five miles apart from one another around the countryside surrounding a given launch control facility. He was in what's called the Echo Flight Capsule. He said that when a guard reported that the UFO was hovering above, let's say, E-3, missile E-3, suddenly down in the launch capsule, he got the indication that that missile was preparing to launch. (0:39:23)

And they, you know, freaked out. Of course, he and his commander, they flipped what was called an inhibit switch to prevent the missile from being launched. But in the meantime, the UFO had moved on to another missile and had done the same thing. David Shurer said he didn't think that all 10 missiles were affected, but he estimated that the majority of them were. (0:39:44)

His case is not unique. If one goes to my articles page, I think on page two at this point of my articles, more recently, another launch officer who was at Malmstrom in 74, he wishes to remain anonymous. (0:40:00)

I talked to him two nights ago to ask him if I could use his name in my book and in the future. And he said he'll think about it. But in any case, he told me the identical story, basically, where a UFO had activated one of his missiles at Malmstrom in 74. Now, even beyond that, the investigative television, investigative journalist George Knapp smuggled documents out of the Soviet Union or Russia at that point in 93 that talked about a case on October 4th, 1982, at a Soviet missile base where, according to the documents that are now in the public domain that Knapp smuggled out of Russia, there was actually an incident where a UFO had activated the launch sequence in several missiles at this base. (0:40:52)

The question is whether or not those who were creating these problems had actually intended to launch these missiles or whether they were just trying to freak out the people controlling the missiles, knowing that they had means whereby they could shut them down. In the case of David Shure, he said all we did was flip this inhibit switch. It's unclear from the information that I'm familiar with whether or not the Soviet missile operators had that same opportunity, whether or not they were able to shut down this intending launch. (0:41:25)

In any case, the sequence, the anomalous event ended, and the launch sequence went back to a normal operational status. But my view is that those aboard the UFO are just trying to rattle the nerves, freak out both American and Soviet-slash-Russian military, basically, and the missile operational people in particular, just to show, you know, you think you're in control of your missiles. Well, you're not. We're in control of your missiles. (0:41:57)

And to me, that sends a message. One of the key themes in my book is that those aboard the UFOs, whoever they are, are attempting to send a signal both to us and the Russians that having nuclear weapons threatening to use them is potentially mass suicide for the human race, and would set back human civilization dramatically, not to mention irrevocably polluting the environment with radioactivity, which takes hundreds, if not thousands, of years to decay over time. (0:42:32)

So the entire planetary environment, due to wind patterns, even in nations where they were not in part of the nuclear exchange, the radiation would circle the globe and basically pollute the planet with massive amounts of radioactivity, which has long-term health and other environmental effects for not only humans, but countless animal species. So, you know, what I try to do in my book is differentiate between what the testimony is, what these people say happened, and then separate from that, my interpretation of these events. (0:43:07)

One thing that I noticed about this event that we know is that these inhibitors switches, they flip it once, but if another one doesn't come in, the missile will launch automatically. I would have to go back and look at his testimony, but I believe that's correct. I believe you need a second one. Procedures have differed over time. The gentleman who most recently spoke to me about the incident, he doesn't mention that fact, that a second capsule was required, but that may well be the case. That may have just been an oversight on his part. (0:43:42)

You did put that in your book. (0:43:44)

I don't doubt that. Again, it's just been some time since I read word-for-word what David Scher told me, but that does sound familiar that, you know, the way the system was set up, you had to have a second capsule come in and, in effect, substantiate that this was an unauthorized launch and step in and flip the inhibitor switch as well. But again, the basic message to take away from all of that is that the U.S. and Russia thinks that we have control over our missiles, and the actions of those aboard the UFO makes clear to both countries that they clearly can override our technical safeguards and, in effect, either shut down, as Bob Salas and other officers have described, the missiles, or else activate them temporarily. (0:44:32)

So it's pretty frightening. Hopefully the Pentagon and the Kremlin have gotten the message. But we still have weapons. We haven't gotten rid of them. Politicians ultimately decide what missiles we're going to have, what levels of nuclear weapons. So it's not as if the military can unilaterally decide to get rid of weapons. Both countries have to make a firm commitment to not only downsize the arsenals, which they have since the Cold War ended, but just to eliminate them altogether. I don't see that happening in my lifetime, certainly. (0:45:06)

Let's go back into sort of the motivation of these visitors. First of all, you said something intriguing to me that I did not really know, although I think you might allude to it in your book. Where were the UFOs before Roswell, before even the explosion of the atomic bombs? Were they around Trinity? Were they around the Manhattan Project? What were they doing in regards to the development of atomic energy in this way, atomic weapons? (0:45:45)

The one case that I briefly alluded to when we first talked about an hour ago is the fact that I interviewed a former Navy pilot named Bud Clem, who was stationed, his squadron was stationed at Naval Air Station Pasco in Washington State in the closing days of World War II. This was in January of 1945. The war ended in August of 1945. And Bud Clem told me back in 2009 that on three separate occasions, his squadron of Hellcat fighters, this was pre-jets, these were prop planes, were sent up to chase an object that was hovering above the Hanford plutonium production site, which was right across the Columbia River from Naval Air Station Pasco. And that they didn't, of course, know about UFOs at that time. There were reports of what were called foot fighters, balls of light that were seen chasing or flying around allied bombers during the war. But this was a case where you had a single object hovering directly above this plutonium production site. (0:47:00)

Wow. And Bud Clem, this Naval pilot, illustrated an article talking about his involvement in this incident where a Hellcat Navy fighter chased a UFO that was hovering above the Hanford site. And as the aircraft approached the UFO, it went from basically stationary position above this top-secret site to zooming away towards Seattle and quickly outrunning the aircraft. (0:47:59)

We now know, and in fact I present them in the article at my articles page, we have Army documents from the time talking about the fact that on three occasions there were unknown aircraft above the Hanford site in the closing days of World War II. So even before the end of World War II, UFOs were maneuvering around atomic weapons sites. That is amazing. (0:48:52)

Now, of course, one question would follow, is if they were so interested and perhaps alarmed by what we're doing, and they have so much technical capacity, wouldn't you think they might try to stop us? Because after that... ...interpretation of things, basically what you need to do instead is just look at the data. (0:49:10)

What does the data show? What is the information coming from these documents and these military sources? It does not show that they intervened in, for example, stop the atomic bombings in Japan. They clearly didn't. So what they're doing on the whole is observing the development of nuclear weapons by humans. From time to time after the war, they intervened and began tampering with these weapons, according to my missile launch officers. So that's the degree, that's the level of interference or engagement that they've been involved in. (0:49:33)

I say in my book, I think whoever are flying these craft have probably been here for hundreds, if not thousands of years. (0:50:00)

And it was only with the advent of nuclear weapons at the end of World War II that they began in a very low-key, surreptitious, behind-the-scenes fashion, interjecting themselves in a more direct manner to make their presence known to the military leaders in both the U.S. and the Soviet Union. And to also demonstrate from time to time that they had the ability to control, to either shut down or activate these nuclear weapons. But because they have not at the same time shut down all the weapons, you know, destroyed all the weapons, clearly they are not going to go there. (0:50:17)

They are perhaps presumably hoping that we as a species are smart enough to take care of the problem ourselves over time. And these little, these interventions behind the scenes could be viewed as heavy hints or nudges, perhaps, this is speculative, of course, to try to persuade both the Pentagon and the Russians to, you know, seriously address the fact that we have these deadly weapons that have all these terrible consequences for the human race and, you know, the planet. (0:50:47)

To me, that suggests an overarching agenda on their part. They probably intend contact with humankind at some point, but they're not ready to do that yet. And so they saw in the last 50 or 70 years that we were on the threshold of self-destruction through nuclear war. And so they engaged in these behind-the-scenes activities, but without really alarming the populace of the world as a whole, without making these actions terribly overt. I mean, if the Freedom of Information Act didn't exist, these documents that talk about the missile cases wouldn't be public. (0:51:28)

If people like myself and Bob Salas hadn't pushed the issue publicly and tried to get the media's attention, the vast majority of people would not know anything about these nuclear weapons cases. Even now, you know, with our efforts, you know, probably one in a million people know that this is going on. I mean, we're trying, but the mass media is not picking up on the story, so we're not getting the kind of exposure that the story deserves. (0:51:55)

Well, Robert, we're going to have to go soon. I want to thank you for being here. If you want to mention something more about how to contact you, please do so. (0:52:05)

Well, my website is UFOHastings.com. Again, there's a trailer to my film on the documentary page. You can purchase my book there. Please help buy it at Amazon, UBScout. And if anyone who is a military veteran who was involved in a nuclear weapons case wants to contact me, my contact information is at the website. I really don't have the time to contact anyone who has a question or email people who have just general questions about UFOs, but I am interested in hearing from military veterans who can add to the database. (0:52:42)

Well, thank you for coming, and we really appreciate it. We'll be back in Threshold next week. It's very likely that we will be talking about crisis investing, particularly in precious metals. So, Robert, I hope we can talk more sometime. It's been an exciting experience. Bye-bye. Take care. We'll be back next week, and we will begin to explore some other areas, but I don't think it would be hard to beat this one. Thank you very much. (0:53:14)

(2025-01-30)

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