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AI 整理 : Don Schmitt の 2019年講演 : Roswell 事件の解説

· 約159分

前置き​

Don Schmitt による 3時間に及ぶ講演（2019年、オーストラリア）を AI(NotebookLM plus) で整理した。もちろん、講演のテーマは彼のライフワークである Roswell 事件。

音声対話 by AI

https://notebooklm.google.com/notebook/cf0c90e6-bdfd-444e-ab92-98ed1d768eb9/audio

概要

ロズウェル事件：目撃者の証言

提供された文章は、ドン・シュミット氏が2019年に行った講演の文字起こしであり、ロズウェル事件に焦点を当てています。 講演の中でシュミット氏は、この事件が世界で最も広く知られたUFO事件であると強調し、目撃者の証言、軍による脅迫、および政府による隠蔽工作に言及しています。

彼はまた、事件に関連する物質の特異性や、政府が気球を墜落した物体として偽装したという主張についても詳しく説明しています。さらに、ロズウェル事件の目撃者や関係者が受けた苦痛や、事件の真実を隠蔽しようとする政府の行動についても語られています。

情報源 : 講演動画(2:56:14)​

Don Schmitt 2019

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4Z2KWi0yEg

要旨

ドン・シュミット氏の講演録を基に、ロズウェル事件に関する詳細なブリーフィング資料を以下にまとめます。講演者の主観的な意見や他の見解への批判を避け、事実とされる事柄や関係者の証言に焦点を当て、網羅的に整理しました。

ロズウェル事件に関する詳細ブリーフィング

  1. イントロダクションとロズウェル事件の概要

ロズウェル事件は、おそらく世界で最も広く知られたUFO事件であり、あらゆる側面を包含しています (0:02:40)。講演者ドン・シュミットは、ウィリアム・シャトナーとの共同講演を例に挙げ、この事件の注目度を強調しています (0:05:00-0:06:47)。シュミット自身は当初懐疑的でしたが、証拠によって考えを改めたと述べています (0:19:15-0:20:01)。

  1. 歴史的背景：ニューメキシコ州の特異性

1947年当時、ニューメキシコ州は原子爆弾開発の中心地であり、軍事的に極めて重要な地域でした。

  • 初の原子爆弾の爆発地: 1945年6月にロズウェルの西2時間ほどの場所で最初の原子爆弾が爆発しました (0:07:54)。
  • 継続的な原子研究: ロスアラモスでは原子研究が続けられ、ホワイトサンズ性能試験場では鹵獲したドイツのV-2ロケットの試験が行われていました (0:08:34)。
  • 第509爆撃航空群: ロズウェルには世界初の原子爆弾飛行隊である第509爆撃航空群が駐屯しており、当時の米軍のエリート集団でした (0:08:34-0:09:00)。
  • UFO目撃情報の多さ: 米空軍のUFO現象公式調査である「プロジェクト・ブルーブック」によると、当時ニューメキシコ州では世界中のどの地域よりも多くのUFO目撃情報が報告されていました。「まるで誰か別の存在が、当時の我々の軍事力に非常に興味を持っていたかのようでした」(0:09:22)。
  1. 事件の経緯と公式発表の矛盾

1947年7月2日の夜遅く、ニューメキシコ州リンカーン郡の砂漠地帯で激しい雷雨の中、何かが墜落しました (0:09:22)。

  • 残骸の発見: 牧場主のマック・ブラゼルは、約1マイルにわたる奇妙な残骸を発見しました (0:09:40)。この残骸は、ブラゼル、その隣人、州警察官、保安官、そして原子爆弾を管理する第509爆撃航空群にまで届けられました (0:09:40-0:10:48)。
  • 「気球」の公式説明の否定: 軍は当初、墜落した物体を「空飛ぶ円盤」と発表しましたが、すぐに「気象観測気球」であると訂正しました。しかし、講演者はこの説明を強く否定します。「5歳の子どもでも気球だと認識できたような素材」にもかかわらず、気球の打ち上げを日常的に行っていたはずの原子爆弾部隊の責任者たちが「人生で気球を見たことがない」かのように振る舞ったことを指摘しています (0:10:48-0:11:14)。
  • 30年間の沈黙: この出来事はその後30年間、沈黙に包まれました (0:11:14)。
  1. 墜落現場と回収作業
  • 複数の墜落地点: ロズウェルの北西35マイルの地点には衝撃地点があり、そこからポッド、カプセル、2体の遺体、そして1体の生存者が回収されました (0:25:08)。これは軍人および民間人の直接の目撃証言に基づいています (0:25:08)。
  • 残骸の広がり: 残骸の破片は9/10マイル（約1.4km）にもわたり散乱しており、60人の兵士が3日間昼夜を問わず、手作業で一つ一つの破片を拾い集めました (0:26:50-0:27:30)。各破片はタグ付けされ、番号が振られました (0:27:30)。
  • 牧場の羊の反応: 牧場主のマック・ブラゼルは、羊が残骸の中を歩くことを恐れ、水を飲ませるために2マイルも遠回りさせなければならなかったと報告しました (0:33:33-0:33:45)。
  • 現場の環境変化: 調査の結果、墜落地点の土壌にはリン酸レベルが異常に低いなどの変化が見られ、これは1947年に現場を汚染除去しようと漂白剤を大量に流し込んだためと考えられています。これにより、牛が5年間もその場所で餌を食べなくなったとされています (2:46:10-2:49:51)。また、軍がアクセスを許可する前に、その地域は焼却されたり破壊されたりしたとの報告もあります (2:49:51)。
  1. 回収された物体の特徴
  • 破片の特性: 回収された素材は「紙のように薄く、金属のような素材」で、「手に持つと重さを感じない」ものでした (0:29:13-0:29:20)。
    • 破壊不能: 「切ることも、燃やすこともできなかった」うえ、「弾丸でさえ貫通しなかった」とされています (0:29:20-0:29:30)。基地の技術者たちは、直径約4フィートの大きな破片を16ポンドの大型ハンマーで叩いても、ハンマーが跳ね返り、「傷一つつけられなかった」と証言しています (0:29:30-0:29:48)。
    • Iビーム: 同じ素材のIビーム状の部品もあり、指の小指ほどの厚さで、その全長に沿って「奇妙な記号」が記されていました。これらの記号は見たこともないもので、解読不能でした (0:29:50-0:30:17)。
    • シルクのような素材: 光を当てると反対側から光が放出される「シルクのような素材」の繊維も発見されました (0:30:20-0:30:30)。
    • 記憶素材: マック・ブラゼルの息子ビルは、軍の清掃後に残骸から記憶素材の破片を見つけ、それを握りつぶしても、手を離すとすぐに元の形に戻ったと証言しています (1:08:29-1:08:49)。これは「自己修復する金属」のコンセプトに酷似しており、ロズウェル事件から数ヶ月後にバテル研究所がこの研究を開始した報告書が存在すると講演者は述べています (2:22:49-2:23:09)。
  • 宇宙からの物質: 軍の工学者たちは、この残骸について徹底的な強度試験や圧力試験を行った結果、「この物質は宇宙からのものであり、地球のものではない」と満場一致で結論付けた、とケナー・ハートフォード将軍が証言しています (2:06:50-2:07:05)。
  • 破壊された理由: これらの素材は非常に頑丈であったが、それでも破壊されたのは、どのような素材にも「破壊点」が存在し、墜落時の衝撃がその限界を超えたためであると説明されています (2:25:28-2:25:45)。
  1. 軍と政府による隠蔽工作
  • 高官の関与: ロズウェル事件の隠蔽には、カーティス・ルメイ将軍（後に空軍参謀総長）、ロジャー・レイミー将軍（気球の記者会見を行った人物）、そして当時のニューメキシコ州上院議員カール・ハッチなどが関与していました (0:38:24-0:40:01)。ハッチ上院議員は、事件の回収期間中、トルーマン大統領と繰り返し会談しており、民間人に軍の指示に従うよう指示していた可能性が示唆されています (0:39:20-0:39:45)。
  • メディアへの圧力: ロズウェルのラジオ局KGFLのオーナー兼マネージャーであるウォルト・ホイットモアは、連邦通信委員会（FCC）から、空飛ぶ円盤のニュースを流せば24時間以内に放送免許を失うと警告を受けました (0:46:29-0:47:13)。さらにチャベス上院議員からも、「これは我々全員にとって大きすぎる問題だ。真剣な話だ」と警告され、従わざるを得ませんでした (0:47:13-0:47:52)。その後、ラジオ局は荒らされ、事件に関連するすべての書類、メモ、電話番号が持ち去られました (0:47:52-0:48:00)。
  • 民間人への脅迫と拉致:
    • マック・ブラゼルの改心: 牧場主マック・ブラゼルは当初、墜落した物体が気球ではないと語っていましたが、軍によって拉致され、数日後に新聞社やラジオ局に連れて行かれた際には、「すべて誤解だった。ただの気象観測気球だった」と述べさせられました (0:51:56-0:55:01)。この際、ブラゼルは「言われた通りにしないと大変なことになる」と脅されたことをフランク・ジョイスに打ち明けています (0:55:01-0:55:30)。
    • フランク・アキノの脅迫: 残骸を最初に目撃した少女フランク・アキノは、将校から「今日見たことを二度と口にしたら、二度と両親や家族に会えなくなる」と脅迫されました (1:11:02-1:11:15)。彼女は長年この件について沈黙を守りましたが、後に講演者に真実を語りました (1:11:02-1:11:15)。
    • ブラゼル氏の妻からの回収: ビル・ブラゼルが発見した残骸の破片（葉巻箱いっぱいの量）も、軍の士官によって強制的に回収されました (1:16:02-1:17:50)。
    • 民間人への権限なし: 米軍は戒厳令が布告されていない限り、民間人に対する権限を一切持たないにもかかわらず、このような拉致や脅迫、家宅捜索、私有財産の破壊を行いました (0:51:56-0:58:50, 1:19:36-1:19:50)。
  • 目撃者の証言抑制: 多くの証人が、その経験について話すことを恐れ、長年沈黙を強いられました。一部の証人は、死の直前に真実を打ち明けました (0:21:42-0:23:21, 1:23:17-1:23:46)。
  • 「ストローマン」戦術: 軍は第二次世界大戦でドイツに対して用いた戦術を応用し、情報漏洩があった場合、それを否定するのではなく、一度認めてから別の情報にすり替える「ストローマン」戦術を使ったと説明されています (0:41:22-0:41:51)。「空飛ぶ円盤を捕獲した」というプレスリリースを出し、その後すぐに気球にすり替えることで、世間の信頼を得て30年間その偽情報が信じられたとされています (0:40:01-0:41:51)。
  1. 目撃者の証言と関係者の反応
  • 第509爆撃航空群の隊員: 爆撃機のパイロットである少佐は、格納庫でキャンバスタープの下に「小さな人影のような」ものが置かれているのを目撃し、そのうちの一体が露出していて「うめき声」を上げ、「膝を前後に揺らし始めた」と証言しています (1:01:49)。彼はこの経験からパニック状態になり、その場から逃げ出そうとしました (1:01:49)。
  • 軍高官の証言:
    • エドガー・ミッチェル博士: アポロ14号の宇宙飛行士であり、MIT卒の博士でもあるエドガー・ミッチェルは、ロズウェルで育ち、少年時代に事件について耳にしていました。彼は後に国防総省に勤務し、そこで何度もロズウェル事件の真偽を尋ね、多くの将校から「ロズウェルは真実だった」と聞かされたと述べています (0:14:03-0:15:40)。彼はラリー・キングの番組で、懐疑論者に対し「もしあなたが私の目の前に座っていたら、そんなことは言わないだろう」と公言しました (0:15:40-0:16:22)。
    • トーマス・デボーズ准将: ロズウェルの基地司令官だったウィリアム・ブランチャード大佐の参謀長であったトーマス・デボーズ准将は、「気球はデマであった」という宣誓供述書に署名しました (2:05:36-2:06:50)。
    • ウォルター・ホット中尉: 公報官だったウォルター・ホット中尉は、死後の公開を条件に封印された声明文を作成し、そこに事件の真実を書き記しました (1:56:11-1:56:40)。
    • エドガー・スケリー大佐: 戦闘機部隊の指揮官であったエドガー・スケリー大佐は、当初は「気球」だと言い張っていましたが、講演者が尋ねると、自分が頭を打って記憶が曖昧になったと主張しました (1:39:24-1:41:22)。しかし、ロサンゼルスへの近道を尋ねると、正確な距離と道を答えることができ、記憶喪失の主張に矛盾がありました (1:41:22-1:41:50)。
  • その他の高官: その他の複数の将軍や高官が、死ぬ前にロズウェル事件の真実を家族に告白しています。
    • リチャード・ランドリ大佐は、死ぬ前に妻に「ロズウェルは地球外生命体の船で、乗組員と生存者がいた」と告白しました (1:52:09-1:53:00)。
    • ジェシー・マーセル大佐（ブランチャード司令官から指示を受けて回収に当たった情報将校）は、事件から2ヶ月後の1947年9月、現象は現実のものであり、空飛ぶ円盤は実在すると記した手紙を書いています (1:54:35-1:55:18)。
    • 原子爆弾の無線起爆装置を発明したモトローラのシビルエンジニア、ライトル氏は、民間人ながら将軍級のGS-16という最高位の資格を持っており、彼もロズウェル事件について多くのことを語っています (1:55:20-1:55:45)。
  • 医療関係者の証言:
    • グレン・デニスと看護師: 葬儀屋のグレン・デニスは、軍事基地病院に派遣された看護師から、非人間的な遺体について聞かされ、そのスケッチも提供されました (1:58:31-2:01:16)。この看護師は事件後すぐにイギリスに転属させられました (1:59:06-1:59:25)。
    • メアリー・ロウ看護師: 別の看護師であるメアリー・ロウは、聖マリア病院から基地病院に緊急派遣され、そこで見たものが「今でも悪夢になる」と親友に告白しました (2:01:16-2:01:40)。
  • MPの証言: MPのメルビン・ブラウンは、救急車トラックの後ろに配置され、視線を前方に保つよう指示されていましたが、隙を見てタープを持ち上げ、2体の遺体を目撃しました。彼はロズウェルから数週間で転属させられ、ロンドン郊外の病院でガンで死に瀕するまで沈黙を保ちました (0:22:05-0:22:30)。
  • 放射線被ばくの証言: 現場で残骸の回収にあたった兵士たちは、自分たちが汚染されたものを扱っていると感じていました。彼らは基地に戻るたびに基地病院で検査を受けました。ある兵士の妻は、夫がシャワーを繰り返し浴び、食事中もキャンバス手袋を着用していたことを証言しています。また、夫の軍服を燃やす必要があったことから、遺体の話が真実であると確信したと述べています (2:49:51-2:52:49)。
  1. その他の関連事項と理論
  • 政府の隠蔽理由: 講演者は、政府がこの現象について「どこから来たのか、なぜ来たのか、誰が来たのかを知らない」ため、「無知の隠蔽」を行っている可能性があると示唆しています (2:09:14)。彼らは「開示のゆっくりとした流れ」を開始しており、海軍や陸軍も関与し始めていると述べています (2:09:14-2:09:47)。
  • 技術移転の可能性: ロズウェルの残骸は、バテル研究所、ランド研究所、ゼネラル・エレクトリック、ヒューズ・エアクラフト、ボーイングなどの民間企業に送られ、リバースエンジニアリングの試みが行われたと多くの目撃者が証言しています。これらの企業は政府から契約を受け、技術開発を行っていると説明されています (2:17:49-2:18:20, 2:21:38-2:22:09)。ただし、トランジスタや集積回路が直接UFO技術に由来するかどうかについては疑問視しています (2:22:09-2:22:49)。
  • マリリン・モンローとケネディ大統領: マリリン・モンローとジョン・F・ケネディ大統領がロズウェルやUFOに関する情報を知っていた、あるいは公開しようとしていたために暗殺されたという憶測が存在します (2:32:44-2:33:12)。ケネディ大統領がリンドン・ジョンソン副大統領をUFO監視グループに任命したという未確認情報も存在します (2:34:00-2:34:54)。
  • ソ連の反応: 1988年、ソ連の国営紙「プラウダ」は、1947年当時のヨシフ・スターリン書記長が「気球説」を信じず、独自に科学者たちに調査を命じたという報告書を公開しました。その報告書には、墜落した物体がアメリカ製ではないことが示されており、最優先で調査すべきだと提案されていたと記載されています (2:52:49-2:54:15)。
  1. 継続的な調査と物理的証拠の追求

講演者たちは、600人以上の直接的・間接的な目撃者へのインタビュー、ロズウェル博物館の設立（過去25年間で300万人以上が来館）、そして5回の考古学的な発掘調査を行ってきました (0:20:01-0:20:37)。彼らは今も物理的な証拠を探し続けており、さらなる発掘調査を計画しています (0:20:37-0:20:47, 2:12:48-2:12:53)。講演者は、「我々はこれを証明するつもりだ。一度限りで、これを実証するつもりだ」と結んでいます (2:12:53-2:13:00)。

timeline と 主要関係者

ロズウェル事件の主要イベントのタイムライン​

  • 1945年6月: ニューメキシコ州ロズウェルから西に2時間ほどの場所で、史上初の原爆が爆発。ロスアラモスでは原子爆弾の研究が継続され、アラモゴードのホワイトサンズ性能試験場では鹵獲したドイツのV-2ロケットの試験が行われていた。
  • 1947年7月2日夜: ニューメキシコ州リンカーン郡の砂漠地帯で激しい雷雨の中、何かが墜落。
  • 1947年7月3日以降: 牧場主のマック・ブラゼルが、約1マイルにわたる奇妙な破片の散乱現場を発見。彼は地元の保安官ジョージ・ウィルコックスや州警察官スクロッギンスに連絡し、破片をロズウェルに持ち込む。この破片は、原子爆弾を管理する第509爆撃航空団にも届けられた。
  • 1947年7月6日（日）: ブラゼルが回収した残骸がロズウェル陸軍航空基地に持ち込まれる。ラメイの参謀長トーマス・デボーズ大佐がクレメンツ・マクミューレン将軍に連絡し、ロズウェルの基地司令官ウィリアム・ブランチャード大佐に、牧場主が持ってきた残骸をすぐにワシントンへ送るよう指示する。
  • 1947年7月8日: ロズウェル陸軍航空基地の広報担当官ウォルター・ホット少尉が「空飛ぶ円盤を捕獲した」と発表するプレスリリースを出す。この発表は世界中に報道され、大きな反響を呼ぶ。同日、フォートワース陸軍航空基地のロジャー・ラメイ准将が、回収された物体は気象観測用気球であると訂正する記者会見を行う。本物の破片を気象観測用気球にすり替えて公開した。
  • 1947年7月上旬（事件後数日以内）:墜落現場からさらに25マイル離れた場所で、もう1つの墜落地点が発見される。そこではカプセル状の物体、2体の遺体、そして生存者が1体回収される。
    • 目撃者たちは軍から沈黙を強要される。KGFLラジオ局のオーナーであるウォルト・ホイットモアと共同オーナーのジャド・ロバーツは、FCCから空飛ぶ円盤の物語を放送すれば24時間以内に免許を剥奪すると警告される。
    • ブラゼルは軍に連行され、数日後に「誤解だった、気象観測用気球だった」と証言するように強制される。彼の事務所は荒らされ、関係する書類が持ち去られる。
    • 軍事警察のメルビン・ブラウンが救急車の後ろに隠された2体の遺体を目撃する。
    • フランク・ランダーマンと彼女の家族は、回収された破片に触れ、奇妙な特性を目撃する。その後、軍人から口止めと脅迫を受ける。
    • ビリー・ブラゼル（マック・ブラゼルの息子）が軍の清掃後に残された記憶素材の破片を見つけ、サリー・テトラリニに見せる。後に軍によって回収される。
    • 目撃者の中には、基地病院に急行させられたメアリー・ロウをはじめとする複数の看護師が、基地で異様な光景を目にする。
    • 軍事写真家のフレデリック・ベンタルは、ワシントンでブリーフィングを受け、ロズウェルに到着。テントの中で、地上の物体を撮影するよう命じられる。
    • ウィリアム・クィグリー軍曹は、爆弾ピットの周りで警備任務に就き、テントに隠された物体と、それがB-29爆撃機に積み込まれてフォートワースに運ばれる様子を目撃する。
    • フェリックス・マートゥッチ中尉は、フォートワースの滑走路で遺体安置所の職員が木箱を待っているのを目撃する。
    • チェスター・バートン中尉は、回収作業に携わった隊員たちが、基地病院で検査を受け、汚染された作業服を焼却するのを目撃する。
  • 1947年9月:アルフレッド・リトル准将が「この現象は本物である。空飛ぶ円盤は実在する」という手紙を書く。
    • ソ連のヨシフ・スターリンに、ロズウェルで回収された物体がアメリカ製ではなく、差し迫った脅威ではないが、最優先で調査すべきだという科学者たちの報告書が提出される。
  • 事件後30年間: ロズウェル事件は公式には「気象観測用気球」として沈黙が保たれる。
  • 1960年代初頭: バリー・ゴールドウォーター上院議員がカーチス・ルメイ将軍にロズウェルについて尋ねると、ルメイは激しく拒絶し、再び尋ねれば軍法会議にかけると脅迫する。
  • 1970年代後半: 沈黙が破られ、事件の調査が再開される。
  • 1990年代中盤: ドン・シュミットがウィリアム・シャトナーと共同でロズウェルに関する講演ツアーを行う。
  • 時期不明: 『Witness to Roswell』が出版され、3年間世界で最も売れたUFO本となる。エドガー・ミッチェル博士が序文を執筆。
  • 現在（2019年時点の講演時）:ロズウェル事件に関する600人以上の目撃者へのインタビューが行われる。
    • ロズウェルに博物館が設立され、過去25年間で300万人以上の来館者を集める。
    • 5回の考古学的発掘調査が行われる。
    • ドン・シュミットはロズウェル事件のさらなる物理的証拠を探すため、12月に地中レーダーによる調査、翌春には本格的なチームでの調査を計画していることを発表する。
    • アメリカ海軍と陸軍がUFO/UAP現象の「ゆっくりとした開示」を開始していることが示唆される。

登場人物 (Cast of Characters)​

主要目撃者・関係者

  • マック・ブラゼル (Mack Brazel): 墜落した残骸の散乱現場を最初に発見した牧場主。当初は異様なものだと報告したが、後に軍の圧力により「気象観測用気球」と証言するように強制された。
  • メルビン・ブラウン (Melvin Brown): 墜落現場で、救急車の後ろに隠された2体の「遺体」を目撃した軍事警察 (MP) の一人。後にロンドン郊外の病院で末期がんに苦しみながら証言を残した。
  • フランク・ランダーマン (Frankie): 子供の頃に回収された記憶素材の破片を目撃し、その特異な性質に驚いた。後に軍人から口止めと脅迫を受けた。
  • ビリー・ブラゼル (Bill Brazel): マック・ブラゼルの息子。軍の回収作業後に、記憶素材の破片を複数個（葉巻箱一杯になるほど）見つけ、その特異性を体験した。後に軍にそれらを回収された。
  • サリー・テトラリニ (Sally Tetralini): ビリー・ブラゼルから記憶素材の破片を見せられ、その特異な自己修復能力に驚いた少女。
  • ピート・アナヤ (Pete Anaya): ロズウェル陸軍航空基地で文官として働く、トップシークレットのセキュリティクリアランスを持つ人物。弟のルーベンと共にジョセフ・モントーヤ副知事の友人で支持者。
  • ルーベン・アナヤ (Reuben Anaya): ピート・アナヤの弟。ロズウェル陸軍航空基地の文官。
  • モーゼス・プラサード (Moses Prasad): ロズウェル陸軍航空基地の従業員。ピートとルーベンと共に、モントーヤ副知事の情報を聞くことになる。
  • ウォルト・ホイットモア (Walt Whitmore): KGFLラジオ局のオーナー兼マネージャー。政府から空飛ぶ円盤のニュースを放送しないよう脅迫を受けた。
  • ジャド・ロバーツ (Jud Roberts): KGFLラジオ局のマイノリティオーナー。ウォルト・ホイットモアと共に政府からの脅迫を受けた。
  • ジョイス (Joyce): おそらくKGFLラジオ局のフランク・ジョイス（言及あり）。牧場主ブラゼルの証言の変化に困惑し、その背後に軍の圧力を感じ取る。
  • グレン・デニス (Glenn Dennis): 多くの人に知られている遺体安置所の職員。彼は基地で目撃したとされるエイリアンの遺体について語り、その看護師から詳細を聞いたと主張した。
  • メアリー・ロウ (Mary Lowe): セントメアリーズ病院の看護師。親友に、基地病院での極秘の事態に駆り出され、悪夢を見るほどの光景を目撃したと告白した。
  • ポール・ブラゼル (Paul Brazel): マック・ブラゼルのもう一人の息子。父親が軍に逮捕されたという知らせを受けた。
  • フレデリック・ベンタル (Frederick Benthal): 専門の軍事写真家。ワシントンでブリーフィングを受け、ロズウェルに派遣され、墜落現場の「何か」を撮影するよう指示された。
  • ウィリアム・クィグリー軍曹 (Sergeant William Quigley): 第509爆撃航空団の隊員。爆弾ピット周辺の警備中に、テントに隠された物体がB-29爆撃機に積み込まれて運び出される様子を目撃した。
  • フェリックス・マートゥッチ中尉 (Lieutenant Felix Martucci): 爆撃手。フォートワースに物体を運ぶB-29に搭乗。滑走路で、学校時代の知人である遺体安置所の職員が「木箱」を待っているのを目撃し、「歴史を作った」と述べた。
  • エドガー・スケリー (Edgar Skelly): 退役大佐。第320爆撃飛行隊「ストレートフラッシュ」の飛行隊長。当初は「気球」だと言い張ったが、ドン・シュミットの執拗な質問に対し、記憶障害を訴えながらも、真実を知っていることを示唆した。
  • ウィリアム・エニス軍曹 (Sergeant William Ennis): 第393爆撃飛行隊の航空機関士でB-29の整備責任者。死ぬ前に、ドン・シュミットに「あの忌まわしいものがどうやって飛んだのか、突き止めなければならない」と語った。
  • チェスター・バートン中尉 (Lieutenant Chester Barton): 回収作業に携わった隊員。回収部隊が基地病院で定期的に検査を受け、作業服を焼却していたと証言。彼の妻も、夫がシャワーを浴び続け、疲労を焼却するのを見て、遺体の話が真実であると確信した。

軍人・政府関係者​

  • ジョージ・ウィルコックス (George Wilcox): ロズウェルの保安官。マック・ブラゼルから墜落の知らせを受け、破片を最初に扱った一人。
  • ロバート・スクロッギンス (Robert Scroggins): 州警察官。マック・ブラゼルから受け取った奇妙な破片をロズウェルに持ち込んだ。
  • ウィリアム・ブランチャード大佐 (Colonel William Blanchard): ロズウェル陸軍航空基地の司令官。当初「空飛ぶ円盤」を捕獲したと発表したが、後に気象観測用気球だったと訂正させられた。退役後、死ぬ前に妻にロズウェルはET船と乗組員、生存者であったと告白した。
  • ロジャー・ラメイ准将 (General Roger Ramey): フォートワース陸軍航空基地の司令官。回収された物体は気象観測用気球であるという「悪名高い」記者会見を行った。
  • クレメンツ・マクミューレン将軍 (General Clements McMullen): ラメイ准将の上官。事件直後にワシントンに破片が送られるように指示した。
  • トーマス・デボーズ大佐 (Colonel Thomas DeBose): ラメイ准将の参謀長。マクミューレン将軍に連絡を取り、ロズウェルの残骸をワシントンに送るよう指示した。後に準将となり、気球はデマであったことを宣誓供述書で証明した。
  • ウォルター・ホット少尉 (First Lieutenant Walter Hott): ロズウェル陸軍航空基地の広報担当官。当初の「空飛ぶ円盤捕獲」のプレスリリースを承認した。死後公開される密封された証言を残した。
  • カール・ハッチ上院議員 (Senator Carl Hatch): 1947年当時のニューメキシコ州上院議員。ロズウェル事件の回収期間中、トルーマン大統領と頻繁に会談していた。
  • デニス・チャベス上院議員 (Senator Dennis Chavez): 当時のニューメキシコ州の少数派上院議員。ウォルト・ホイットモアに政府の指示に従うよう警告し、「これは我々全員よりも大きい」と述べた。
  • エマーソン・アームストロング大尉 (Captain Emerson Armstrong): ビリー・ブラゼルから記憶素材の破片を回収しに行った軍人。

その他の著名人・専門家​

  • ドン・シュミット (Don Schmitt): 本講演の講演者。ロズウェル事件の主要な研究者、著者。当初は懐疑的だったが、調査を通じて確信を得た。
  • ウィリアム・シャトナー (William Shatner): 俳優（スタートレックのジェームズ・T・カーク船長役）。1990年代中盤にドン・シュミットと共同でロズウェルに関する講演ツアーを行った。
  • リック・スターンズ (Rick Starnes): ドン・シュミットとウィリアム・シャトナーの講演ツアーのプロデューサー。
  • エドガー・ミッチェル博士 (Dr. Edgar Mitchell): アポロ14号の宇宙飛行士で、月面を歩いた人物。ロズウェル事件の真実を信じ、『Witness to Roswell』の序文を執筆した。1947年当時はロズウェルで高校生だったため、事件の噂を耳にしていた。
  • ビル・ナイ (Bill Nye): 科学者（「サイエンス・ガイ」として知られる）。ラリー・キング・ライブでエドガー・ミッチェルをからかい、ミッチェルから直接対決を挑まれた。
  • カール・セーガン (Carl Sagan): 著名な天文学者、科学コミュニケーター。懐疑主義団体CSICOPの創設者の一人。
  • アイザック・アシモフ (Isaac Asimov): 著名なSF作家、生化学者。懐疑主義団体CSICOPの創設者の一人。
  • アーサー・C・クラーク (Arthur C. Clarke): 著名なSF作家。懐疑主義団体CSICOPの創設者の一人。
  • フィリップ・J・クラス (Philip J. Klass): 航空ジャーナリスト、懐疑主義者。UFO現象に懐疑的な立場を取った。
  • 驚異のランディ (Amazing Randy): 著名なマジシャン、懐疑主義者。懐疑主義団体CSICOPの創設者の一人。
  • ケビン・ランドル中佐 (Lieutenant Colonel Kevin Randall): ドン・シュミットの共同研究者。懐疑論者会議でUFO肯定派として論文を発表した最初の二人組の一人。
  • ジェームズ・マガー少佐 (Major James McGaha): 空軍の少佐。ドン・シュミットとUFO問題について討論し、政府の隠蔽工作という考えを激しく否定した。
  • ジョージ・ノーリー (George Noory): ラジオ番組「コースト・トゥ・コーストAM」の司会者。『Witness to Roswell』のあとがきを執筆。
  • J.アレン・ハイネック博士 (Dr. J. Allen Hynek): 著名なUFO研究者、天文学者。当初はUFOに懐疑的だったが、後に「ナットとボルト」のような物理的な現象だと確信するようになった。
  • ポール・デイビス (Paul Davis): ロズウェル映画のエグゼクティブプロデューサー。マリリン・モンローとUFOの関連についてのDVDを制作。
  • ピーター・ランク博士 (Dr. Peter Rank): 軍医、フライトサージャン。ベティ・キャッシュとヴィッキー・ランドラムに起こったUFOによる放射線被曝事件を調査した医師。ジョン・F・ケネディがリンドン・ジョンソン副大統領をUFO監視グループに任命したことを個人的に知っていたとドン・シュミットに語った。
  • ロバート・スピッツァー神父 (Father Robert Spitzer): カトリック教会のイエズス会科学者のトップで、教皇直属。ドン・シュミットに、バチカンのロズウェル関連ファイルへのアクセスを約束した。
展開

(transcript 1of3) (Don Schmitt lecture at 2019.)

If I were to ask everyone here this evening, how many of you feel that you have a cursory knowledge of the Roswell incident? You've read some books, you've seen... because it's probably the most highly publicized UFO case in the world, bar none. And for the very reasons that Ben... you don't count George, so... For the very reasons that Ben mentioned, it encompasses every aspect, everything we could ask for. (0:00:30)

Multiple witnesses, children, all the way up to four-star generals, going up all the chain of command as far as Washington itself. Physical evidence, physical remains, human beings as far as that were threatened, abducted by the military. I mean, the cloak and dagger surrounding Roswell is just unbelievable. In fact, this morning when I was on with... Liddy Gore. And the moment it came up as far as the witnesses being threatened over a weather balloon device, she had a hard time accepting that. (0:01:12)

Then I went, no, no, no, no, because we're talking not just one family, we're talking of dozens of families. For no other reason, they happened to be involved in this, were subjected to the most extreme measures at that time that the United States government could do as far as enforcing this cover-up. A cover-up that here we are now, 72 years later. I could have, I always point out, I could have former Presidents Clinton and Carter, the late Senator Barry Goldwater of Arizona, the late Congressman Stephen Schiff of New Mexico, and even the former governor of New Mexico, Bill Richardson, all standing here this evening. (0:01:54)

And every one of them would lament the fact they couldn't get the truth about Roswell. Each and every one of them has a separate account, or even accounts, of just what efforts they made in trying to get the answers, the truth about Roswell. So tonight we're going to be talking about the truth. We're going to be exploring the truth. We're going to be going into detail. (0:02:17)

We're going to be discussing things that you haven't read, that you haven't heard. In fact, I'd like to believe most of you are going to leave tonight and you're going to go, God, I didn't know most of that. And as I talked about the political participants, the celebrities involved, let's start a little lightheartedly as far as with a celebrity that I'm sure you all know of. (0:02:40)

Because this happened, I had the good fortune of spending two years on the road, back in the mid-1990s with, you'll never guess who, Captain James T. Kirk, William Shatner. We did two-man shows. I would do an hour on Roswell, and then he did an hour on Bill Shatner. And it was the very first time I worked with him. We were scheduled to speak at the Coliseum in Lubbock, Texas. And I was picked up at the airport, and I was driven to the Coliseum, and there was a limo parked out front. (0:03:25)

And the producer, whose name was Rick Starnes, he says, Don, we just want you to just get back and wait, and it was hot, you know, stay cool, that type of thing with the air conditioning, and we'll take you in as soon as we're ready. (0:03:39)

And they open the door, and I just crawl in the back seat, and I sit down, and they're sitting right across from me. He leans ahead, Hi, I'm Bill Shatner. And he starts to ask me questions about Roswell, that he was fascinated, he was intrigued with it, and then he felt that it really was something that he wanted to possibly do something with in the future. (0:04:02)

And then later, we're rushing through the airport in Dallas, because we have another show that evening in San Antonio, at the San Antonio Theater. And he has this leather garment bag on his shoulder as big as a horse saddle. And it was the producer, Starnes, and myself, and the three of us, running through the airport, and there's Shatner with a saddle on his shoulder. (0:04:29)

Come on, boys, we're going to be late. He's got these little granny sunglasses on, but everybody recognizes him. Everybody's doing double takes, and pointing, and we make it to the flight. We arrive in San Antonio, there's a limo waiting to pick the two of us up, and we're pulling up to the San Antonio Theater. And there on both sides of the street, the people are lined up, and he looks over, and he pats me on the... Look at that, Don, look at that. We got a sellout. (0:05:00)

And I look out my window, and there in the marquee of the Alamo Dome, tonight only, the Rolling Stones. And Bill, Bill, he goes, oh, no, no, no, no, we're doomed, we're doomed. Wouldn't come out of the green room. He just sat down in the green room, thinking the worst, fearing the worst. And finally, the producer, Starnes, bursts in, we got a sellout, we got a sellout, 2,500 people. I knew it, I knew we were going to sell out. (0:05:32)

And I'm up on stage, show begins, and for any of you who have ever done theater, you've been up on a stage, and for all the stage lights, you can't see beyond the first couple rows. You know, the lights are just that glaring, and I could hear all the buzz, the rumble up in the balcony, but so, I mean, you've got the feeling that you had 2,500 people in that theater. (0:05:58)

And all at once, I catch out of the corner of my eye, sitting at the end of the front row, but there's Bill Shatner, just sitting there, smiling, beaming up at me so proud. And later, when we're all backstage, a stagehand comes running out of nowhere, Mr. Shatner, where were you? We were trying to find you. Well, I was out in the audience. (0:06:27)

I was listening to Don. Well, you'll never guess who was backstage, wanting to meet you. Well, who? The mayor? No, Mick Jagger. So, while Bill Shatner's in the front row, listening to my presentation, the curtain behind me, Jagger was pacing back and forth as they were trying to find him. (0:06:47)

So, I'm the only ufologist in the world who can say that I was sandwiched between Bill Shatner and Mick Jagger at a UFO presentation. True story. Absolutely true story. He was wonderful to me. I had many, just a great, as far as shows with him. And I'm pleased he's still with us and still going strong. Okay, what were we talking about? No, I'm kidding. (0:07:17)

So, I had asked about those who feel that they at least know the general story. Is there anyone here this evening who really, this is the first time, they don't know, when I say Roswell incident, UFO crash at Roswell, does anyone here feel that, well, they want a summary, they want a quick summation of what happened? Okay, yeah, you're lying. Let's just do a little historical background of the area, New Mexico at that time. (0:07:54)

When I, especially when I lecture on college campuses, I invariably always ask, where was the first atomic bomb detonated? You'd be surprised how many learned faculty will, well, of course, Japan. How about New Mexico? In fact, two hours just west of Roswell, June of 1945. And then you had ongoing atomic research at Los Alamos in New Mexico. And then at the White Sands Proving Grounds in Alamogordo, New Mexico, you had all the testing of the captured German B-2 rockets. (0:08:34)

And then at Roswell itself, you had the first atomic bomb squadron in the world, the 509th Bomb Group. Select group within the United States military of the best officers, best pilots, crew, doctors, nurses. If you swept a broom on that base back in 1947, it was because you were the best sweeper in the entire U.S. military. So that's our background, our backdrop. And according to the Air Force, U.S. Air Force, Project Blue Book, the official investigation of the UFO phenomenon, there were more UFO sightings in New Mexico than anywhere else in the world at that time. (0:09:22)

It was as though someone else was very interested in our military potential at that time. And wouldn't you know it that the late evening of July 2nd, within a severe lightning storm in the high desert of Lincoln County, something crashes, something comes down. Ranch foreman by the name of Brazel discovers a debris field that covered an area of almost a mile long of the strangest material that he, his neighbors, a state police officer by the name of Scroggins, taking the material into Roswell, the sheriff, George Wilcox, his deputies, and then all the way to the 509th Bomb Wing in charge of the atomic bomb. (0:10:09)

No one can identify this material. We're going to be getting into that. And then the rest is history. Because you've all seen that banner headline, correct? Roswell Army Airfield Captures Flying Saucer, which was based on the press release that went out on Tuesday, July 8th. Official press release. We got one. The problem is five hours later, Washington intervened and said, you made a mistake. It's nothing more than a weather balloon device. (0:10:44)

Neoprene rubber, foil, sticks, string, and tape. (0:10:48)

Material a five-year-old child would have recognized, but the men in charge of the atomic bomb, they obviously never saw a balloon in their lives. Except they were the ones who launched those very balloons. Twice a day, in conjunction with bomb drop exercises. Again, another story, but nonetheless. They, of all people, knew exactly what that balloon was. So I can assure you, that was not what was recovered. (0:11:14)

Not what crashed. And so, this was something that then remained silent for 30 years. 30 years, nobody said another word about it. Because they were all sworn to secrecy. Including the civilians involved, who were even worse than being sworn to secrecy. And then, the very intelligence officer, first sent out to investigate this, was dying of emphysema. Then, Lieutenant Colonel Jesse Marcel, Jr., a senior. (0:11:49)

And he broke his oath of security. And that, then, began the revision, the truthful rewriting of what happened in 1947. The fact that it was the first press release that was the correct one. I always joke that the United States government is presently up to four official explanations regarding Roswell. Four. I always joke that husbands should try that with their wives when they get home too late. (0:12:25)

But there we have it. But then, which one, or is it a sampling of all four, but which of the four do all the witnesses 100% unanimously endorse? The very first one. Right to their very deathbeds. There is absolutely no witnesses to the weather balloon, no witnesses to Project Mogul, the same balloon, and certainly no witnesses to the anthropomorphic wooden crash dummies, Project High Dive, which happened five years after the incident. (0:13:02)

Now, ask how something that happens five years later could then become part of something that happened five years earlier. You're talking time travel, and only the government can claim such, you know, even happens. Because, obviously, we know it doesn't. So, we're going to go through this pretty much like we would in the court of law. We're going to have an opening statement of sorts, and then we're going to go through the evidentiary. (0:13:30)

We're going to have a break, then we're going to come back to it as far as with the bullet points, the hard points that need to be emphasized, and then a closing argument, closing statement. This particular book, and then the revision, Witness to Roswell, was the number one selling UFO book in the world for three years. In the world. It's one of the reasons that Roswell has become a household word around the globe, around the world. (0:14:03)

Gentlemen, you may recognize, maybe you don't, was gracious, kind enough, but enough of a supporter that he wrote the foreword to Witness to Roswell. Doctor slash Apollo 14 astronaut Edgar Mitchell walked on the moon. How many here can say they had an astronaut who walked on the moon foreword one of their books? And especially a book as controversial as UFOs, and even more controversial about Roswell. And yet he proudly did, because he said it was true. (0:14:47)

Because maybe some of you know, maybe some of you don't, that Edgar Mitchell, MIT graduate, received his doctorate from MIT. Where was he going to high school in 1947? (0:15:03)

In Roswell. He was a native of Roswell, New Mexico. He was there. He heard all about it, and especially after the balloon explanation, he still heard the officers talking about what it really was. And then as he grew up, graduated from MIT, went into astronaut training at Wright-Patterson, spent much time at the Pentagon, and he described how the one question I asked the Pentagon over and over again was, was Roswell true? (0:15:40)

And according to Dr. Edgar Mitchell, Roswell did happen. It was true. He had heard that repeatedly from officers, even at the Pentagon years thereafter. So when we were on Larry King together, and Bill Nye, the science... well, Bill Nye, the not-science guy, was on. And he started to make fun of Dr. Mitchell. And Dr. Mitchell actually said on the air, if I were sitting right there with you, you wouldn't say that to my face. (0:16:22)

In fact, I dare you to come and say it to my face sometime. But those typically are the tactics that are used by the debunkers, the scoffers. They're very brave when they're miles away. Point is, how often do they say anything right in your presence? In fact, we have a group back in the States called Committee for the Scientific Investigation Claims of the Paranormal, PSICOP. It's been renamed in recent years, but it was founded by the late Carl Sagan, Isaac Asimov, Arthur C. Clarke, Philip J. Class, amazing Randy. And my partner at that time, Lieutenant Colonel Kevin Randall and I were invited to be the first two pro-euphologists to present papers at their skeptics conference. (0:17:21)

500 people in the audience, all skeptics, to come and present papers on Roswell. And the week before, Kevin, my partner, my friend, backs out. He says, Don, we're going into a lion's den, they're going to rip us to shreds. I still went. It was then two against one, and the moderator was Philip J. Class, which some of you may have heard of. He will be remembered as probably the most infamous scoffer debunker in America on UFOs. And as the moderator, I realized it would quickly become three against one. (0:18:10)

And one of the skeptics I was debating was Major James McGaha from the Air Force, the United States Air Force. And at one point as I was getting into the cover-up, Major McGaha jumped up and he went, I've had enough. Anyone who would suggest that the United States government has ever perpetrated a cover-up in its history has another thing coming. I got the same reaction from the skeptics. (0:18:42)

They laughed. They laughed at their own. And he stormed off the stage. And I jumped up and I yelled, one down, two to go! And they applauded. So it can be done. Especially when you know you're on the right side. Especially when you have the confidence and the passion to know you're on the right side. And it's nothing that I arrived at on my own. (0:19:15)

Because I can't emphasize enough, I was a skeptic on Roswell. I thought we'd make a single weekend jaunt down to the land of enchantment and prove that it was a weather balloon device or something just as conventional. (0:19:31)

You know, just within the course of a weekend. I'm standing before you tonight and I'm saying I was 100% wrong. Because they're protecting their own territory, their own agenda. And believe me, I can assure you, they do have an agenda. I never did. I set out to disprove it. I let the evidence take me wherever it would. Believe me, if we proved that it was a balloon device or anything else conventional, I wouldn't be here tonight. (0:20:01)

But it's because we've interviewed over 600 witnesses, either directly or indirectly involved. We started the museum in Roswell, which has now had over 3 million visitors over the last 25 years. A quarter million a year come to our museum now. We've had five archaeological digs. I know Ben mentioned as far as that. I'm still regretting, but I let you know. And we're going back in December with more subterranean radar. (0:20:37)

And then next spring, we're going in with another full team. And I, again, I am the supervisor. I put the team together. We bring all the scientists in. And we're still looking for physical evidence. If somebody later wants to ask me, have you found anything? I'll answer that later. Point being, we're still searching. The investigation is still fluid. Unlike a skeptic who would stand here and say, this is what you're going to believe. (0:21:08)

And what I'm going to be doing this evening is repeating the eyewitness testimony of the people who actually handled it. Held it in their hands. Saw the events that transpired through the course of those days of the retrieval operation. The civilians involved, the military involved. And as I said, to their very deathbeds. What they finally confessed to. What they finally admitted to. Their wives, their children. (0:21:42)

Some of the saddest accounts of how this all eventually would come out. It'd break your heart. I mean, there were times that I even shed a tear because it was so touching the way they did it. I'll give you a quick example. Melvin Brown was one of the MPs posted behind an ambulance truck. Told to keep his eyes forward out at the crash site. (0:22:05)

First chance he got, lifted the tarpon back and there were two bodies. He waited until he was dying of cancer at a hospital outside of London. Because that's where he'd spent the better part of his life after he was transferred out of Roswell within weeks. To basically shut him up. Take him away from everyone else. He's lying on his deathbed. His wife is sitting with him. (0:22:41)

He's holding her hand. He knows he only has a matter of days. And he turns and he says to her, Dear, I need you to know I've always been faithful to you. Only been you. And then he goes on to tell her all about Roswell. And what he had experienced 40 years before. In other words, his faithfulness to his wife he placed at the same level as what he experienced at Roswell in 1947. You all understand that. You all see that. (0:23:21)

So these are the type of witnesses we're talking about. (0:23:27)

Because it's from their heart. It's from their very psyche as far as what they lived with. And then what the government of the United States did to rob them of their dignity. Their self esteem. By making the world believe it was merely a weather balloon when they knew it was the most phenomenal discovery in the history of mankind. George Norrie does coast to coast back in the States. He wrote our afterwards. Only afterward he's ever written for a book. (0:23:59)

But because again, he believed in Roswell so passionately that he would do that for us. So, New Mexico. Nearest town, Corona. The brief field that we continue to work. The descent path because there were three separate sites. The mid-air explosion in the midst of the thunderstorm. Raining debris that covered an area of almost a mile long. And two and a half miles from there was a secondary body site. (0:24:36)

Top of bluff. We call it the Deep Proctor site for a reason which we'll get into. At that location. And then another 25 miles from there, just 35 miles to the northwest of Roswell. There's the Roswell Army Airfield. The city of Roswell. The impact site. And that's where a pod, a capsule, two more bodies and a survivor were recovered. There was a live one. (0:25:08)

That's based on firsthand military and civilian eyewitness testimony. This is the debris field. You see it is totally unobscured. Open, high range, just like your outback in many areas. In fact, as often as I have flown over the area in small planes and helicopters, once you are airborne, you can see for 50 miles. Wide open. The point being, the rancher discovers the debris field early July 3rd. He doesn't report the crash until Sunday, July 6th. They don't send anyone to investigate it until Monday, July 7th. They put the press release out on Tuesday, July 8th. The point being, no one is looking for anything. (0:26:11)

They aren't missing anything. If they would have been looking for something, I'm talking military, they would have found it long before the rancher even did. And if it wasn't ours, then whose was it? A mogul balloon would have covered an area about like that. And yet the debris went up and even over this rise. This whole area went up and over. Nine-tenths of a mile. (0:26:50)

It took 60 troops three full days around the clock to pick up every last piece of debris. On their hands and knees they lined up. Shoulder to shoulder. Filling up sacks over their shoulders. Going to checkpoints. Depositing everything in the wheelbarrows and then going to other checkpoints. And then each piece was tagged and numbered. Pretty detailed recovery of just a simple weather balloon that, again, was nothing more than rubber and other off-the-shelf material. (0:27:30)

This was something, again, extraordinary. Now we're looking down site. This whole area was covered with wreckage. What type of wreckage are we talking about? (0:27:49)

Even when they come up, we call it the theory of the month. When they talk about, well, like Annie Jacobson in her book, Area 51, that it was a recovered Horton Brother Flying Wing the Soviets managed to capture from the Germans at the fall of Berlin and the World War II. And that Dr. Joseph Mengele took a group of 13-year-old boys and made them look like aliens. (0:28:17)

This is a New York Times best-selling book. It doesn't matter, we are able to document that Joseph Mengele was not captured by the Russians. He lived out the rest of his life in Argentina, like many of the other Nazis. And that the only Horton Brother Flying Wing which was recovered is now at the Smithsonian in Washington. And its tubular bicycle frame and varnished wood. (0:28:46)

And Annie Jacobson would have us believe it flew all the way from Russia into New Mexico with the plan to make America believe it was being invaded from outer space. And then I asked her, which of the 13-year-olds was flying? Doesn't matter, I don't want to hear that. No, no, that's my theory and you're not going to take it from me. Theory of the month. (0:29:13)

But they never addressed the wreckage, they never addressed what was actually recovered. Paper-thin, metal-like material. Weightless in your hands. Couldn't cut it, couldn't burn it. Even a bullet wouldn't penetrate it. Engineers at the base described how they took a larger piece of it, about four feet in diameter. They took a 16-pound sledgehammer and they proceeded to pound on it and the hammer would just bounce off. (0:29:48)

Wouldn't even scratch or mar it. Next time you're at a hardware store, pick up a 16-pound sledgehammer. It'll go through your car like tissue paper. Not this stuff. I-beam sections of the same material, about as thick as your pinky, but with strange symbols that ran the length of each piece. Symbols they had never seen before. Made no sense, nothing they could decipher. Silken strands of material that you could hold a light or a lighter up at one end and the light would emit out the opposite end. (0:30:22)

Well, what are they describing? Fiber optics. In 1947, yet fiber optics weren't developed until around 1970. And then the most amazing material of all, which we still refer to as our Holy Grail. Same, nearly indestructible material. But this you could crumble. You could crease, fold, crunch up into a ball. And when you'd place it down, it would unravel. It would assume its original shape and size. (0:30:53)

It had perfect memory. Memory material. We don't even have such material today. And yet, this is exactly what all the witnesses at Roswell described. Now does any of that sound like a weather balloon? Of course not. But again, the government back in the States wants you to suspend belief. And believe it only because they tell you to. It's known as anything but extraterrestrial. (0:31:21)

We have skeptics, scoffers, debunkers back in the States that you have to doubt and distrust the government at every turn. (0:31:32)

Except about UFOs. Then they're telling us the gospel truth. Can't have it both ways, ladies and gentlemen, we know that. But again, that's how they're trying to play the shell game. That we don't notice the sleight of hand as they continue to try to revise what really happened. It's a monument we have overlooking the site. Ben and James and a few of the others were out there a few months ago, right? (0:32:04)

I don't like that you etched your name on the side, but... It's a testimony to what happened there in 47. We never made it into a tourist attraction for a reason. To us it's like a battlefield. It's like if we accept that something died out there, somebody died out there related to the crash, we're going to continue to be dignified about it, respectful, and so at least people have something to go to, to photograph, to read and then take it in and know that they've been at potentially one of the most important locations in the history of mankind on this planet. (0:32:56)

The debris, this is pump site number one. That windmill is nine-tenths of a mile from the pinnacle, the upper northwest pinnacle of the debris field and there's a fence line and the debris extended all the way to the fence line. Nine-tenths of a mile. The rancher, Mack Brazel, would complain to the authorities when he reported it that he had the circle, the sheep, two miles around to get to the water trough. (0:33:33)

They wouldn't walk through the debris, they were scared of it, frightened by it. That he had to circle them two full miles just to water. Top this bluff, known as the Deep Proctor site. A few days after Brazel discovers the debris field, they note circling birds, suggesting from the storm, possibly a cow or a sheep were down, struck by lightning because it being high desert. (0:34:11)

And they found something else. It was Brazel, his son Vernon, another boy by the name of Sidney Wright, a young girl by her last name, Eddington, and Timothy D. Proctor. Because Proctor was the one who identified this site, he's now no longer with us, so in his honor, we call this, refer to this as the Deep Proctor site. Where Mack, as he put it, found something else. (0:34:47)

Two and a half miles from the debris field, and we'll be getting into shortly why we know for a fact Brazel found bodies. This is the impact site, 25 miles away, 35 miles north of Roswell. Again, wide open, nothing, nothing to obscure any area reconnaissance, any search. If they were looking for something gone off course, gone awry, rocket, balloon, go-cart, drone, anything, things they didn't have back then, they would have found it within hours. (0:35:33)

I'm standing there. This was formerly the west gate at the base. After heavy rains, military officers would exit out this gate and circle north around town, not to draw any attention, because for two and a half years, they were still going out to the debris field, making sure every last piece of physical evidence was gone. (0:36:07)

Still searching the site, for more than two years later, they were still making sure the physical evidence had all been retrieved. General Lawrence Craigie, secretary of the Army Air Corps in 1947. He would send his chief aide, Benjamin Gaines, to Roswell to check it out firsthand, report back to him directly. Craigie was long gone. We interviewed Gaines. Gaines told us it was no weather balloon. (0:36:46)

Gaines told us it was so important that then his boss, General Craigie, called for the first investigation of the UFO phenomenon. I mentioned Project Blue Book at the beginning. The first one was called Project Sign. And General Craigie signed the orders based on what they recovered at Roswell. They believed that they would have initiated a special UFO project over the recovery of a balloon, not in a minute. (0:37:19)

But yet, because of Roswell, Project Sign was initiated. General Curtis LeMay. How many ever heard of the story of Senator Barry Goldwater? A few of you. And asking then Chief of Staff of the Air Force, General Curtis LeMay, three-star general, he wanted to see the physical evidence at Wright-Patterson in Dayton, Ohio. Because who had told him all about Roswell was the former base commander, Colonel William Blanchard. Blanchard told Goldwater all about Roswell in the early 60s. And Goldwater's first reaction was to then go to LeMay and say, I want to see the physical evidence, I want to see the evidence on Roswell. And LeMay would tell him, hell no, and don't ever ask me again. (0:38:24)

Now Goldwater was merely a two-star general, major general. And LeMay was a three-star. And what nobody heard, what was never publicized, is what LeMay also added to his dismissal. He then added, if you ever ask me again, I will personally see that you're court-martialed. Again, over a balloon. You'll be court-martialed. And this was in the early 1960s. Senator Carl Hatch was the senior senator in New Mexico in 1947. Going back to all the records and all the White House logs, Hatch was meeting with then-President Truman, repeatedly throughout the Roswell recovery time. (0:39:20)

Again, coincidence? Or was it because Hatch was also dictating to the civilians he represented in New Mexico what they should do? Warning them, telling them to do exactly what the military was telling them to do. I say the architects of the cover-up, Colonel Blanchard, General LeMay, Sephora Stahl, General Kelly, General Ramey, who had the infamous weather balloon press conference, where they substituted the balloon for the actual material. (0:40:01)

His boss was General Clements McMullen. I'm often asked, those, again, who have a general knowledge of Roswell, we talked about the press release that went out, announcing they had actually captured a flying saucer. How many believe it was just an overreaction on the part of the Roswell Army Airfield? They jumped the gun. They essentially outran their headlights, so to speak. Fair question. I mean, does anybody here believe that they just overreacted? (0:40:34)

Or how many believe that it was orchestrated, it was scripted, it was contrived, it was written intentionally for a purpose? (0:40:43)

Because, if I were to tell you, Roswell didn't write the press release. Washington did. Why would Washington first admit they captured a flying saucer? Because they learned this technique in World War II. If something had leaked out, it was very effective with the Germans. If something leaked out, if something got out to the spies, if Germany already knew about something top secret that was being planned, they didn't deny it, they would admit it. (0:41:22)

You build it up and then you replace it with something else. You just can't deny something is in the works or something has happened, something was recovered. So, building of a strong man, you build it up and then you tear it down. And that's exactly what Washington hoped would work, and it did. Because, as I said, for the next 30 years, that's exactly what everyone believed and accepted regarding Roswell. Just the weather balloon. (0:41:51)

So, when Brazil brings the wreckage in on Sunday, July 6th, General Clemence McMullen is notified by Ramey's Chief of Staff, Colonel Thomas DeBose, to contact the base commander at Roswell, Colonel William Blanchard, to have some of the wreckage brought in by the rancher immediately to Washington. Washington already has debris in hand, the material I described. Late Sunday, July 6th. Press release doesn't go out until Tuesday, July 8th. Hardly a knee-jerk reaction. (0:42:32)

They've had plenty of time to devise the manner in which they were going to cover this up. And, again, it worked. General Hoyt Vandenberg, who was Chief of Staff of the Air Force at that time, another one of the architects. Some of you may remember the radio broadcast of H.G. Wells' War of the Worlds. Invasion from Mars was just nine years earlier, 1938. Very fresh in their memories at that time. (0:43:02)

Vandenberg was very concerned that if the truth about Roswell came out, there would be panic in the streets, that they wouldn't be able to hold people, you know, as far as at bay. So it was another reason they decided, we have to cover this up. So they also proceeded to conduct a series of demonstrations involving the weather balloons to make sure that people understood that that's all they were seeing back at that time. (0:43:33)

The neoprene rubber balloons and the hexagonal radar reflector kites at high altitude reflecting the sun, and the balloons would compress, become elliptical, and people would mistake them for flying saucers. The rubber balloons and the radar kites. Demonstrations all over America post-Roswell to drive home the point that these are nothing more than weather balloons. But not a single press account that we could find ever asked, well that's one thing when it's up at 10,000 feet. (0:44:17)

What about when it's on the ground in front of you and you actually handle it? Does it become a flying saucer then? Does the flimsy foil then withstand a 16-pound sledgehammer? Or even a bullet? Hardly. But nobody bothered to ask that question. (0:44:39)

I'm going to skip Alan Grant. Alan Grant worked with ABC out of New York at that time. And he got the assignment from New York to go and investigate Roswell. And the military had the entire area cordoned off and they turned him back. And before he died, he confessed to his wife. And we had spoken to her that Roswell was true. He then, in looking into that ABC News, knew it was the crash of a craft of unknown origin. (0:45:12)

There were bodies recovered, but the military denied them access and refused them information that they could even put out a report about it. Senator Dennis Chavez, minority senator of New Mexico at that time. Your freedom of speech here in Australia is pretty much the same as ours in the States, correct? Freedom of the press. Well, I can say the same about ours in the States. It's also now less and less, less and less. (0:45:50)

But back then, the Constitution was extended. Everyone respected it, especially post-World War II. The military, the government, walked on water. It ended, it saved us at the end of World War II. And yet, the reporters who already knew about the crash, who had talked to the rancher, who heard more than just accounts of wreckage, debris. Radio station KGFL, that's Walt Whitmore, as you see on your right. (0:46:29)

He was the owner, manager of the station. He, as well as his minority owner, Jud Roberts, received phone calls from the Federal Communications Commission in Washington. T.J. Sloey was the agent who we tracked down, who made the calls. And told the radio station, if they proceeded to announce the flying saucer story, they would lose their license within 24 hours. It's unheard of. You're putting out the news and the government calls you up and says you're going to lose your license, if you continue to put this story out? (0:47:13)

I constantly challenge the skeptics, the debunkers, give me another example where that has ever happened. It happened at Roswell. And then, if that wasn't enough, Senator Chavez calls up Walt Whitmore and warns him, you better do as they're telling you, I can't help you, it's out of my hands. This is bigger than all of us. They mean business. And they complied. In fact, within the next day, the entire radio station was ransacked. (0:47:52)

They removed every bulletin, every note, name, phone number, connected with the incident. As part of, again, their attempt to silence even the press regarding the incident. Frank Joyce is pictured there in 47 at the microphone at KGFL. There were two radio stations and two newspapers in Roswell at that time. When Rancher McGrath first came into town at the Sheriff's office, who should make a phone call? (0:48:34)

The Sheriff George Wilcox, hoping to get some late-breaking stories for his next newscast, but Frank Joyce. And the Sheriff says, I think there's somebody here you should talk to. And according to Joyce, the man sounded very perturbed, angry. (0:48:55)

He was complaining about, I had to circle my sheep two miles around all that garbage, all that wreckage. I've never seen anything like it before. There's a full mile of it. Who's responsible? Who's going to clean it up? And then, according to Joyce, the voice started to become more and more somber, actually frightened. And he started to say, it was horrible. It was horrible. It was just horrible. (0:49:27)

And Joyce is asking him, you're talking about wreckage. What was horrible about it? It was horrible. You wouldn't believe it. It was just horrible. What was horrible? Well, the stench, the smell was just horrible. And Joyce asks the voice on the other end of the phone, are you talking bodies? Well, you know, over at White Sands, they're launching those German rockets. Maybe they put a dog or a monkey up in one of the nose cones of the rocket head. (0:50:00)

To which the voice then shouted back, it wasn't any damn monkey. They weren't human. And so, Joyce has, again, no idea who he's just talked to. But nonetheless, he has the story. And they're going to now make every effort to get a hold of this rancher. And so, after Brazel leads Major Marcel, who I mentioned earlier, head of intelligence, he's accompanied by a counterintelligence officer by the name of Captain Sheridan Cavett, in case it's something foreign. (0:50:38)

They're covering both bases. The rancher leads them out to the site. It's approaching dusk. They spend the night in a shack called the Heinz House. Next morning, three miles to the south, they start gathering up debris. They fill up two vehicles, a 42 Buick convertible and a Jeep with a carry-all box. Meantime, Brazel, the rancher, goes about his duties. And he's then picked up by reporters from KGFL and whisked back down to Roswell to get the exclusive, to get the full story. (0:51:19)

That evening, they do a wire recording at the home of Walt Whitmore Sr. Next morning, they take Brazel to the radio station. They're going to broadcast this, including a live interview. Brazel steps down the block from the radio station, gets some breakfast at a local diner. It's there that the Roswell Army Airfield, the military, find him and they take him to the base. (0:51:56)

They abduct him. Now, I'm sure, again, the laws here are similar to the states, but back in the states, the United States military has absolutely zero authority over civilians unless martial law is declared. And there was no martial law declared at the time of Roswell, but zero. And they're kidnapping civilians. They're abducting non-military and taking them out to the base and hiding them out. (0:52:33)

Not just for one day, but five days. Would not even allow him, would not even provide him due process. Wouldn't allow him to even make a single phone call. Call his wife, call his boss, let them know where he is, he's okay, that type of thing. (0:52:51)

They keep him up all hours of the night. They deprive him of food and water. Ask him the same questions over and over again. And then they do a strip search. They do a full body cavity search. We believe they were looking for pieces of a weather balloon. But yet, that's exactly what he experienced. He would later talk about the indignity, what they did to him. (0:53:22)

And how he lost all faith in the United States government and the military because of that. They wrecked him. He was never the same. The sheriff, what they did to him. I could go on and on and on. Just what they did to the civilians over a weather balloon. And that's what I hope you keep asking yourselves. And you can insert anything else, rocket, plane, top secret. (0:53:48)

Because here we are 72 years later and they're still claiming it was nothing more than this menial material that even a child would recognize. Days later, after they had Brazel convinced, or at least they finally broke him. They escorted him to the newspapers, to the radio stations. In fact, Frank Joyce finally got to see who was behind the voice at the sheriff's department days before. (0:54:29)

And he comes in and he's ready to go on the air. Be interviewed right over the radio. But this time, the rancher is saying it was just all a misunderstanding. It's just a weather balloon. I regret that I got everybody excited over something so ridiculous. And Joyce is dumbfounded. That's not what you told me originally. And he takes him off mic, off the air. (0:55:01)

And he puts on a record, plays some music, and he follows the rancher out into the lobby. And he goes, what's going on here? This isn't what you told me, this isn't what you talked about. That's when Brazel, the older of the two, said, son, they told me it would go awful hard on me if I didn't do exactly as they said. And that's when Joyce noticed two MPs standing outside the front door, waiting. (0:55:30)

And Brazel started to walk away. And then Joyce asks, what about the little green men? And Brazel turns back and he goes, but they weren't green. Walks out the door and he thinks that's the last he'll ever see them. Next morning, Frank Joyce is walking up to the front entrance of the radio station. And his boss, Walt Whitmore, pulls up alongside of him and says, Frank, get in the back seat. (0:56:07)

We're going for a ride. I'm on the air in 15 minutes. Get in the back seat. He opens the door and he climbs in. And there's a man just sitting there in a suit, just staring ahead, not saying a word. For the entire two-hour drive, nobody says anything. Joyce is wondering if he's ever going to see his parents, his home, Roswell again. He's thinking it's a one-way trip. (0:56:42)

They take him to this shack. (0:56:50)

What's significant about it is this is exactly where the rancher Brazel and the two intelligence officers spent the night before they went to the debris field the next morning. It's called the Heinz House. It was there until just a few months ago. They finally tore down another one of our landmarks. What's significant in this story is that Joyce is told to get inside the shack. (0:57:21)

He goes in through the side door. No one else is there. A few minutes later, who comes stumbling in as though he was shoved into the shack but the rancher Mac Brazel. So there they see one another again eye to eye. And Brazel's standing there and he says to Joyce, You're not going to tell anyone what I said the other day, are you? (0:57:51)

To which Joyce responds, Not if you don't want me to. Good. And then Brazel turns and starts to exit and he turns back and says, You realize our lives will never be the same. And Joyce agrees and says, Well, they aren't at the moment. And then that's the last time he would ever see Mac Brazel. A few minutes later, Joyce exits. Car pulls up again. (0:58:24)

It's his boss, Walt Whitmore. The gentleman in the backseat is now gone. Not a word is said all the way back. Joyce can't believe what has just happened. But he realizes and he gets back to his office and his desk. The drawers are all pulled out. Papers on the top are all over the floor. They're sending another message to him. It's over. (0:58:50)

Don't ever say another word about Roswell. Pete and Mary Anaya. Pete and his brother, Reuben. They worked on the base, the Roswell Army Airfield, as civilians. So they had top security clearances. They were also known as Montoyistas. Because they were personal friends and supporters of the then Lieutenant Governor of New Mexico, Joseph Montoya. Montoya would go on to become a state senator. He was known as Little Joe. And I'm not talking about Bonanza. And so, at the time of the incident, the Lieutenant Governor, who was in Roswell, staying at the Nixon Hotel, downtown Roswell. Dedication of a new plane. (0:59:40)

We have the pictures of him standing on the platform, the stage, plane in the background. He calls up Pete and says, I'm out at the big hangar. Building P3, B29 hangar, where all the wreckage and the bodies transited through. But all he would say is, I'm at the big hangar. Come and get me the hell out of here right now. Come and get me. (1:00:12)

(transcript 2of3) (Don Schmitt lecture at 2019.)

Where will you be? I'll be at the water tower, right across the street. Just get me the hell out of here. So he and his brother, Reuben, and another base employee by the name of Moses Prasad. They drive out, they pass through the front gate because they have, as far as the security, a sticker on their windshield. They proceed out to the water tower and there Montoya is waiting. (1:00:41)

He crawls into the back seat. (1:00:44)

He's cupping his face. And he's going over and over again. You would not believe it. You would not believe it. As they drove into Roswell, you would not believe it became, they weren't human. They weren't human. Would you like to go back to the hotel? No, take me to your house. I need a drink. I need a drink right now. He's at Anaya's home with their wife, Mary. And she witnesses as he sits down on the couch. (1:01:18)

And he grabs a bottle of bourbon and he drinks down as far as a couple mouthfuls. And then, they weren't human. They weren't human. And he describes how they took him into the hangar. And he saw the silhouette what looked like smaller bodies under a canvas tarp. Except one was exposed. And it was moaning. It was groaning. And then he saw its knee start to rock back and forth. (1:01:49)

And that's when he quickly raced out of the hangar and made the phone call. Get me out of here. But then he warns all of the Montoyas and Prasad. If you ever tell anyone what I just told you, I will say you are liars. I will tell you you are liars. If the FBI asks me about this, I will say you are liars. (1:02:13)

And that evening, after, Montoya's aide, Donald Worley, who we also tracked down and interviewed, came to pick him up and took him to the Nixon Hotel. The Montoyas are now at the hotel. The Anayas receive visitors. Mary watches from the living room, the front room, as military officers are arguing with her husband and her brother, Ruben, in the front yard. And the shouting got louder and louder. (1:02:55)

And Ruben would then come into the house and said, They told me they would kill you and our children if I ever say another word about this. And to hear that from Mary, many years later, and she still cried as she described, They threatened to kill our children. And this was days after the weather balloon explanation. That is how extreme, and we're just getting warmed up as far as what the military did to the people back at that time. (1:03:37)

That's the late Frankie Rowe. She just passed away just two years ago. In fact, last time I saw her, and I knew she was ill, we brought her back to Roswell. And when we said goodbye, she said, I'll never see you again. And I was surprised that she was being, you know, that specific about her fate. But Frankie was 14 years old at the time of the incident. (1:04:09)

Her father was Dan Dwyer. He was a crew chief of the Roswell Fire Department. Let's see if there's a... There's the Central Fire Station at that time. There's her father in the middle, Dan Dwyer. Now, when word came in about the crash, and the phone line to the courthouse, the Sheriff's Department, also ran into the firehouse. (1:04:43)

So when the Sheriff was first notified by rancher Mac Brazel about the crash, the fire department immediately knew about it. In fact, Dan Dwyer and another fireman by the name of Ed Reeves drove either one of their car out to the impact site. They heard about the site much closer to town. And when they would arrive, they saw more than they had ever imagined. (1:05:21)

Meanwhile, Frankie had just been to the dentist. She had her tonsils removed some time before, and she was having a post-examination. So she stopped at the firehouse to see her dad, who wasn't there. He was north of town. And she was wondering what all the commotion was inside the firehouse. Well, there was a state police officer by the name of Robert Scroggins who had brought in something bizarre, something strange. (1:05:58)

And they were all passing it around, until someone finally handed it to Frankie and said, crunch it up. And Frankie would describe how she squeezed it and crunched it up into a ball. And they said, now put it down. And she placed it on the floor, and it slowly unraveled. And she watched it smooth right out. And then she picked it up again, and this time she opened up her hand, and she said it was like quicksilver, it was like water flowing between her hands. (1:06:33)

So Scroggins had brought in a piece from the debris field that Brazel had given him days before. He was returning to his home in Hobbs, east of Roswell. So he wanted to show his buddies at the firehouse what he had. Meanwhile, Frankie's father is out at the impact site. They see the pod, the egg-shaped, Volkswagen-sized capsule. And then something out of the corner of their eyes catches their attention. (1:07:11)

And they see something staggering. And then slowly turn and look at them. And the utter shock of what they witnessed. Frankie's father described it as the child of the earth. That the head was shaped as a child of the earth. The eyes wrapping around the side of the head. That's what it reminded him of. And what does a child of the earth look like? (1:07:47)

Like an alien. Or at least what witnesses have described for these past 70-some years. That was the best thing he could relate to in describing what he had witnessed. I'll give you another example. The rancher's son, Bill, found a piece of memory material after the military cleanup. And he took a piece over to a neighbor girl to show off. Her name was Sally Tetralini. And Sally told us how Bill stood in front of her and he said, Did you ever see anything like this before? (1:08:29)

And she watched how every time he crunched it up in his hand and then released his grip, it just smoothed right out. And her immediate reaction was, My God, wouldn't it be wonderful if clothes would be made of such material and I would never have to iron again. (1:08:49)

Again, the human perspective. Clothes not needing ironing. Seeing a non-human being and only able to describe it as it appeared like a child of the earth. So that evening, her father, because he had skipped out, and then got in trouble with the military because no sooner than they had arrived and they saw the survivor, they heard the roar of engines. And within a minute, the military roared into the site. (1:09:34)

And immediately, MPs jumped out. They grabbed the two firemen, took them to the side, warned them if they ever said another word, they'd never see their families again. So he's working later at the firehouse that evening. And Frankie and her sister, Dory, hear someone knocking on the kitchen door. And then they hear a commotion in the kitchen. They hear someone talking very sternly about what had just happened through that day. (1:10:15)

And then, they hear the voice demand, Where's your daughter? We're here to see your daughter. They step, an officer and two other non-commissioned officers step into the bedroom. And the one starts to, with a baton, a stick. We know what you saw today, Frankie. And if you ever, ever, say another word about this, you will never see your parents or family again. She broke down. Her sister was crying next to her. (1:11:02)

And for years, Frankie didn't say a word. She kept it completely to herself. Her parents never said another word about it. And then, in 1991, when we were told about Frankie, we confronted her. And all she did was cry. All she did was cry that first time. They told me they would hurt me. They told me they would hurt my family. And then, as we kept trying to gain her confidence, and she finally opened up to us, and she wept like a child. (1:11:41)

And then, a few months later, she was brave enough to go on a radio talk show over the phone with me. And we were in a residence in Roswell, and I was in one room and Frankie was in the other. And the host of the show was from Brooklyn. Heavy New York, Brooklyn accent. And he finally asks Frankie a question. And we hear dead silence over the phone and over the air, the broadcast. (1:12:25)

And then we hear someone crying. And I knew it was Frankie. He broke for a commercial. I raced into the room. What's wrong? What's wrong? And she goes, That voice, that voice, that's exactly the voice I heard back in 1947 threatening all of us. The heavy Brooklyn accent. Because the man that we had identified who did that was a police officer, former police officer from New York by the name of Arthur Philbin. Pictured right here. (1:13:03)

And he was the strong-armed man. He was 6'4", 250 pounds, booming voice. You can imagine the intimidation, the fear that he would have solicited, especially with children. And Frankie, who never forgot the man, never forgot the voice, always thought he would still come back. (1:13:30)

Well, Philbin died around 1970. We confirmed that. And then, after her own husband, James, would die when they were living in Portalis, about an hour northeast of Roswell. And she gets a phone call because after James passed away, she moved back to a small ranch just west of Roswell. One Sunday afternoon, she gets a phone call. I'm passing through New Mexico back to my home in Phoenix. I'd like to stop by. I'd like to say hello. (1:14:11)

And Frankie was surprised that she actually said, Well, yes, I'll be here. You can stop by. So she immediately calls me, all the way from New Mexico to Wisconsin. And I said, Well, Frankie, if you're really concerned, really nervous about somebody stopping by the house, maybe you should either inform the police that in the event something happens or leave. Don't even be there. (1:14:42)

Well, she decided to stay. Half hour later, a gentleman arrives. And she surprisingly opens the door. And he introduces himself as Brian Philbin. I'm the son of the man who threatened to kill you back in 1947. My dad died many years ago. And if he were still alive, he'd want to apologize. And he'd want you to have these. And he pulled out a bouquet of flowers from his back. (1:15:24)

They both cried. It was the first time a representative of the military was apologizing to the civilians and saying, We were just following orders. We were just doing as we were told. And we're sorry. We're sorry we put you through that. And here is our symbol of that apology. As Patrick remembers, Frankie was a wonderful woman. There was absolutely no reason to doubt a single word she said. (1:16:02)

And we have dozens of Frankies involved at Roswell. I mentioned Bill Brazel and the piece of material he found. He found enough pieces to fill up a cigar box. And his wife Shirley even talked about how he kept a piece in his leather chaps working the ranch. And he'd sit down at dinner in the evening. And she'd watch how every night he'd pull out that one piece and observe how no matter what he did with it, try to cut through it with a steak knife, hold his lighter up to it, nothing had any effect. (1:16:41)

And then he'd always crunch it up, fold it, cube it as far as with utensils, and then lay it down. And she'd watch along with her husband as it would just flow like water across the table. So, at one point, Brazel is in the nearest town of Corona. He's playing pool one night with some friends. And one of them happens to ask, Bill, did you ever find any of those pieces that your dad claimed were not made on this earth? (1:17:20)

And he makes the mistake of saying, or answering, Well, I found a few scraps. And who should be at his door the very next morning but a captain by the name of Emerson Armstrong and three other non-commissioned officers, stating, Mr. Brazel, we know what you have and you will give it to us. (1:17:50)

And he did. He turned it all over. Well, we tracked down Emerson Armstrong. We confirmed it was him. They did retrieve the pieces from Bill Brazel, son of the ranch foreman Mack. Then they had him lead them out to the site where he found these remnants, these artifacts, to make sure there weren't any more. But what was happening back at the house were three other non-commissioned officers came into the building. (1:18:24)

And in the presence of his wife, Shirley, and their daughter, Fawn, they proceeded to pull out drawers. They flipped over bed mattresses. They threw out all the items within the closets. They went out and slid open bags of feed. They tipped over a small water tank. All looking for other pieces of evidence. This was two years after the incident. Two years later, they were still watching. (1:18:55)

Some weather balloon. And I just, I point these out because these are us. We're not talking about people, high-ranking officers in the military, that maybe break an oath or they violate security. They say something. They see the wrong thing. They're at the wrong place at the wrong time. We're talking about any one of us in the privacy of our homes. And again, a military that has no authority whatsoever coming into our homes, violating our space, our property, and trashing our property. (1:19:36)

Threatening us. Telling us, we know what you saw, but we're going to tell you what you really saw. And it was just a balloon. After now 72 years, the official explanation is still in Washington. Roswell is just a weather balloon. Isn't that what they're saying about Westall? Just a weather balloon. It's a convenient explanation. They don't make a sound. They float. They hover. (1:20:08)

They move about erratically based on the winds. It's a convenient, easy explanation. And most of the time, they're wrong. Because it's so simple, it's silly. It's so unbelievable, it's almost as unbelievable as it being a genuine flying saucer. A UFO. So you have your Roswell here. It needs to be investigated further. It needs to be demonstrated that just as Roswell has stood the test of time, that Westall will also. (1:20:47)

And especially given, as we've raced with The Undertaker all these years with Roswell, we're down to the last five firsthand witnesses. Even the children are now passing away. Westall is 1966. It needs, as far as every effort, to find every last person involved while they still have a chance. While they can still come out from their fear, their intimidation. Because the governments of the world, sadly, are united on this topic. (1:21:20)

They all collectively say, don't say a word. We'll tell you what you actually saw. We'll tell you nothing happened. But we really know what happened, don't we? Especially the people who were there. One of them is here tonight. I won't introduce him, not to embarrass him, but I was proud enough to meet him yesterday. And I could say how reminiscent of the Roswell witnesses. (1:21:49)

He was describing exactly what I have heard hundreds of times from Roswell witnesses. (1:21:55)

So it is also happening right under your noses right here in Melbourne. It's not just far away in the desert of New Mexico. It's happening all around the world. So, we will continue. Sue Farnsworth, her father, Arthur, ran a local Ford dealership. They owned a ranch north of Roswell. A ranch that was near the impact site. So when her father took her out on horseback, took her to a very private, secluded area and said, Dear, I need to tell you where I went the other day and why I didn't come home for dinner the other night. (1:22:45)

I saw something. I heard what had happened. You heard it too. You heard about the flying saucer crash, didn't you? Yes, daddy. But they say it's just something else. And he says, well, I saw it. In fact, I saw what was inside it. Because some of us also managed to get out there before the military. And one was alive. And he wasn't from here. (1:23:17)

They told me they would kill you and your mother if I ever said another word. But I need you to know. I need you to understand that if I'm ever asked about this, I can't talk about it. Please, sweetheart, don't ever ask me about it again. But it was true. It did happen. And Sue remembers how one day she heard from a number of customers at the car lot. (1:23:46)

The military came into the auto showroom and took her father forcibly and led him into another room. And when he came back out, he was all beshoveled, his tie was twisted, his jacket was all turned. Again, government doing that to civilians. And I, for one, as I just said at the very beginning, I was a skeptic. And the one thing that just infuriated me was the fact that we elect these people and whoever gave them the authority to treat us like that and then tell us it was just a damn weather balloon. (1:24:31)

As they did with West Hall. Don't believe any of the hundreds of children and adults who were involved. We always know what's best for you. Well, I'd like to see them start just one time and show us that they really care about us. Because they sure work damn hard to get us to re-elect them every time. And then they turn around and betray us, stab us in the back. (1:25:01)

They tell us how to live, what to wear, what to dress, I mean, where to live, what cars to drive. Everything we do, think about it. And they tell us what's really out there. I always tell young people, when you gaze up at the stars late at night, wave. Because you never know what little boy is waving back from another planet. I mean, how many of you even consider that when you are looking at the stars, you're looking back in time? (1:25:28)

A lot of those stars no longer exist. (1:25:31)

When I go back to the States, I'm going back in time. I'm leaving Sunday morning and I'm getting back Sunday night. I'm going back in time. We need to think for ourselves. We need to decide what's best for us and our families. Because, I'm sorry, I've traveled to China, Japan, Russia, throughout Europe, Mexico, Canada, South America. I've yet to meet a government official who says, I'm only looking out for you. (1:26:03)

There's only one you and that's them. We need to look out for one another. And that's why, collectively, we can make a lot of change as far as the truth coming out about this subject. And I want you people here in the Melbourne area to really support the local investigators, the people involved with this subject in this area. I'm proud to know them. I'm proud to now call them my friends. (1:26:32)

And you are represented by some of the best investigators in the field. And I applaud them. I'm going to skip. I talked about Mac Brazzo and his son. His other son, Paul. Paul was working on a ranch in western Texas when he got the word that his dad had been arrested by the military. And he thought to himself, well, my dad's the foreman on the ranch. (1:27:08)

And he has no hired hands. Now the cattle and the sheep can fend for themselves. They're out in the open range. But the horses, the horses are penned. They can't be fed. They can't be watered. They need to be tended. So two days in a row, he tried to get out to take care of the horses. And both times, he was physically thrown off the ranch by the military. (1:27:34)

Who had commandeered the ranch house. Which was ten miles away from the debris field. So they set up a base of operation at their house. I talked about Bill's daughter, Fawn. There she is standing by the monument. Fawn described to us that she overheard her grandfather, Mac, on one occasion, make reference to the poor, unfortunate creatures. Referencing what had happened, what he had discovered. (1:28:20)

The poor, unfortunate creatures. She said he was the most gentle, the kindest cowboy, rancher. That if there was even a stray lamb, and how he would have it cradled in his arm and come riding back up to the ranch house because it had lost its mother. So that he would have treated these bodies the same way. That's Geraldine Perkins. There wasn't a phone service out at the ranch at that time. (1:28:55)

He didn't have phone, he didn't have running water, he didn't have electricity. They didn't get phone lines out in that area. Until 1986. Just imagine, 1986. And then the locals would all gather after Sunday services and they'd go to the single phone booth in Corona. And they'd all take turns making calls. And I'd always ask, well who are you calling? Oh we just dial any number, it's so exciting, so much fun just to talk over the phone. (1:29:32)

But Perkins had the genuine store where the phone booth was located. (1:29:41)

And Brazel frantically came into town and called up his boss J.B. Foster at the main ranch in western Texas to tell him about the crash. And that they should get over there as soon as possible. Which they did. So now we have the ranch owner, the Fosters, also involved. And how their families were threatened. Joanne Purdy, one of the daughters, talked about how they took her dad aside and threatened to take their ranch away. (1:30:14)

Because it seemed like that was the best way to get their cooperation because they were big ranch holders. They owned that ranch in New Mexico and three other ranches throughout western Texas. Well confiscate your property if you don't cooperate. Well certainly they didn't have that authority. But the military exercised every extreme measure they could in making sure they had the cooperation of the civilians involved. (1:30:48)

Saw the wreckage. He's describing the length of the I-beams that he saw when they were brought through the operations building. Right after this happened, he was transferred to Puerto Rico. Make sure he had nobody to talk to. Make sure he wouldn't talk. I'm going to skip the one to your left and I'm going to go to Frederick Benthal. He was a professional military photographer. (1:31:27)

Was briefed in Washington. He arrived in Roswell and his assignment was to go out and photograph something. They drove him out in a truck. The windows were all taped over. There were tents set up. They opened up a flap and they said, handed him a 35mm camera and said, photograph what's on the ground. They pulled it aside and two of the bodies were lying there under a tarp. (1:31:56)

They took away the camera from him. They drove him back to Roswell. He returned back to Washington and he found that he was then reassigned. That's one of his pictures. Iceland. One of the northern lookout points. Nobody to talk to there. Corporal William Quigley had just finished guard duty and then he was told to report to bomb pit number one. As I described that this was the first atomic bomb squadron in the world. (1:32:39)

They had two bomb pits. In other words, the bomb would be kept in the pit, the B-29 would taxi over it and then it would be hoisted into the bomb bay. They would curtain it off like that. So nobody would actually see the loading exercise because they were constantly training, daytime, nighttime. They were even deflating the tires, lowering the plane down to the bomb because they were having trouble. (1:33:08)

And then with the ballast, the weight, it was just a constant adjustment every time they had such exercises. So Quigley is ordered to stand guard duty around the curtains, the drapings. And he hears men working over the bomb pit. Well, there were no bombs in the pit at that time. In fact, after Hiroshima and Nagasaki, we didn't have any bombs in America in our arsenal. (1:33:43)

They were down in the South Pacific still. (1:33:45)

Bikini Islands, they were doing some additional testing. There were none at Roswell. The next morning, well, this is where bomb pit one, bomb pit two were located. This is the pit. It's asphalted over now, but that's where it was originally located. Next morning, B-29 moved something from the far south end of the tarmac. Something that was kept in a tent overnight. Metal fence erected around it. (1:34:22)

Four o'clock that afternoon, members of the 393rd Bomb Squadron were taken off the skeet range, the firing range. Ordered that they had a special flight to go directly from Roswell to Carswell Army Airfield, where General Roger Ramey had had the balloon press conference just the day before. Their aircraft, their assigned B-29, excuse me, it's called the Necessary Evil. And they were surprised that the plane that they were to fly on this special assignment was a straight flush. (1:35:11)

They never knew why they were unable to fly their own plane until we investigated and we learned that their plane, the Necessary Evil, still had all the radio and weather equipment in the bomb bay because it was a spotter plane for the Enola Gay, the B-29 that dropped the bomb over Hiroshima. So then they were assigned the straight flush. They taxied over bomb pit number one, which was under heavy guard. (1:35:45)

And a wooden crate was raised and then hoisted into the bomb bay. The guards accompanied the crate. They flew it to Fort Worth and a bombardier by the name of Lieutenant Felix Martucci recognizes a mortician he had gone to school with waiting on the tarmac with a number of officers. Now why would a mortician be waiting for this crate that was hidden in bomb pit number one, kept in a tent the night before, in the south end of the tarmac from the base, and Martucci get back on the plane and say, boys, we just made history. (1:36:31)

Because they had just flown the bodies out. It was a second body flight. First one went out on the 8th. Second one, this one, went out at 4 o'clock from Roslyn. We even have the manifest, the flight manifest. Robert Slusher was on that flight. Lloyd Thompson was on that flight. There we are standing with Slusher. There he is on the base basketball team. (1:37:04)

There he is over the very bomb pit site. Arthur Asatrup was on that flight. I mentioned Felix Martucci, Robert Ewing, Thaddeus D. Love. We tracked down every one of them. And they confirmed the flight. That's how thorough we have always tried to be. Every person that could possibly have been involved with this incident, we have tracked down. That's why we've interviewed over 600. Because 10 wasn't enough, 100 isn't enough, 500 isn't enough. (1:37:43)

Because as long as someone has information, we need to retrieve it. We need to get it because there's nothing more frustrating than finding a witness, calling the number, and having the wife tell us he died a year ago. (1:38:03)

We had two that he died just a few months ago. And the worst was, we're just returning from the funeral, can you call us in a few days? The finality of death. Information that they may have possessed, their own personal experiences involved with the incident, gone forever. Nothing more frustrating, and we have lived that all these years. Again, all the more reason I can't emphasize enough, get it while you can. (1:38:39)

Talk to these people while you can still find them. Because they'll learn then they're gone after the fact, irretrievable, forever. I'm jumping again. He was the squadron leader of the Straight Flush. And when we found him, he was a retired colonel, Edgar Skelly. He lived in Riverside, California. It was a retirement complex. They lived in a house, but a lot of military retirees, especially officers, lived through this area. (1:39:24)

And when I first called him, he joked about the Martians. Oh, you're looking for the Martians. And I said, well, if you want to call them Martians, then I guess you're admitting there were bodies. Oh, no, no, no, I wasn't saying that. It was a balloon, you know that. Well, I'd still like to see you, Colonel. And I would, next time in California, I'm going to stop by. (1:39:50)

I'll call you in advance, set it up. So what I did, comes to the door in a bathrobe and slippers. Oh, I forgot you were coming. Let me go put on a pair of pants and I'll be right with you. Meanwhile, his wife takes me aside and says, you have to get him to talk. Every time this comes up, I ask him. And he walks out, he walks away from me. (1:40:14)

Please, you have to get him to talk. I know he was involved and saw everything. So for the rest of the afternoon, it didn't matter whose name I dropped. I mean, just imagine, men in your own squadron, in the military. How do you forget a Thaddeus D. Love? How do you forget an Arthur Ossetup? How do you forget a Felix Martucci? On and on. (1:40:49)

And, nope, nope, doesn't ring a bell. Doesn't ring a bell. I can remember my classmates in first grade. And he can't remember a handful of men who were part of his squadron on this necessary evil. And so he kept asking me, why do you need to know about this? Why do you need to know the truth about... Oh, so there is a truth, Colonel. Oh, no, no, no, it's still a balloon, still a balloon, but why do you need to know about it? (1:41:22)

And he kept, oh, I don't remember. I don't remember because I bumped my head, I bumped my head on my memory ever since. You know, it's so foggy. And then when I finally was leaving, I asked him, now can you give me a shortcut back to Los Angeles? And he knew exactly how many miles and what street. (1:41:41)

And I said, thank God you hit your head so hard because now your memory is coming back, correct? And he didn't like that. But I caught him clearly lying to me. Again, another example of where we have made every effort to track down every last one of the witnesses involved to the highest ranking officers, to even the children who were involved. What was a big help was the fact that we had the base yearbook. (1:42:17)

Here you see the 603rd Air Engineering Squadron. We tried to track down every last one of these men. And there were actually over 100 in that squadron alone. The 603rd was directly involved with the recovery operation. They saw everything, the craft, wreckage, the bodies. And we would have never suspected the Air Engineering Squadron. Well, the reason they were selected was nobody else would suspect them because they were clean. (1:42:53)

We obviously suspected the MPs, the 1295th. And none of them were even involved. Tracked every one of them down and they were not involved because they were too obvious. That's how well planned out this entire recovery. This is an artist's conception of the craft coming down Main Street Roswell. It's the only way to the front gate to the Roswell Army Airfield. Egg-shaped, size of a Volkswagen Beetle. A lowboy flatbed truck under heavy military escort covered in a tarp right down Main Street. We even tracked down the two paperboys from the two newspapers either side of the street who each described the convoy independent of one another at four o'clock the afternoon of July 8th. Obviously embellished by the artist, but nonetheless, it's a good representation of what took place. (1:44:00)

Earl Fulford, he was a witness, part of the recovery operation. The wreckage they brought in, they drove down this very road to Building P3, the building, it's called Building 84 today. Again, it's where all the wreckage and the bodies transited through. And the lowboy, after coming through the front gate, then proceeded down this stretch of road to the hangar. Fulford was posted outside the hangar. (1:44:39)

The driver of the lowboy was Sergeant George Hulk. And when we found Hulk and tried to get him to talk, I never saw someone become so frightened to say a word. And it didn't matter what we explained to him, it didn't matter that Fulford himself interceded on our behalf, tried to get him to talk, he never did. His family tried, but Hulk was the one who drove the lowboy. (1:45:15)

He's the one who drove the remains of the capsule, the pod, back to the base. There's my partner, Tom Carey, with Earl out at the debris field. Fulford described that he's picking up the pieces, and he would grasp them and fold them up in his hands as he would stuff them into his sack hanging over his shoulder. And then he'd feel them unfold and start to poke and jab him in his back and his shoulder. (1:45:47)

Again, the memory material was unfolding and letting him know that it was memory material. (1:45:53)

Sergeant William Ennis, he was with the 393rd. He was a flight engineer in charge of the B-29s, the silver plates. He would tell us that he could take them apart down to the last rivet, put them back together again. Before he died, he put his hand on my arm and said, Don, before I go, you have to find out how that damn thing flew. (1:46:19)

It didn't have a moving part on it. Now just think of that, it didn't have a moving part on it. So what do you reverse engineer? What do you replicate if it has no moving parts? That's exactly how others described it as well. No moving parts, no engine, no propulsion. I'm going to skip Hankerson, he was the chaplain on the base and what he told us. (1:46:49)

Colonel, here he's major, but he was part of the staff officers. Patrick Saunders, pictured here with the officers. There's Marcel. Colonel Briley told us that the base commander, Colonel Blanchard, when he announced he was going on leave, it was where he actually set up a base of operation out at the rancher's ranch house. That's where he was for the next two days. Wasn't on leave. (1:47:24)

But when we found Saunders, he too joked and made the comment about the little green men. And then in 1995, he fell off of a roof. He was doing some work on a ladder. And he did some damage enough that he was in a hospital and he was hemorrhaging. But what we didn't know was that before that happened, he bought up paperback copies of our second book. (1:47:55)

At the top, he handed these out to his family and his best friends. This is the inner leaflet inside the truth about the crash at Roswell. And you see on the co-author. In his handwriting at the top, it read, Here's the truth. I haven't told anyone anything. I kept my word. And then signed Pat. Deathbed confession. That this was the truth. Homer Rowlett. That's Harold... Hmm? (1:48:38)

Carleen Green's father. Very good. Very good. Homer Rowlett, picture to your left. Carleen Green. As well as Larry Rowlett. Rowlett's father. Carleen. Independently, separately from her brother, Larry. Her father was going in for heart surgery. Was not expected to survive. He's on the gurney outside the operating room. And he waved his daughter over. Carleen. And in a very raspy, very weak voice. He told her all about Roswell. And the craft. (1:49:25)

And the bodies. And that one was still alive. Okay, what would possess a father. Just before going in for major heart surgery. Expected not to live. And would tell her something that wasn't true. Would tell her something that he had been holding on to. Keeping secret all that time. And he felt, now before I die, I'm going to tell my family what really happened. (1:49:56)

And it matched identically what all the other witnesses have described. That's a triple ace from World War II. He was called Black Mac Magruder. Colonel Marion Magruder was part of the war college. (1:50:19)

Class of 47, 48. Class of 47, 48 was assigned to Wright Patterson. In Dayton, Ohio. Where all the wreckage and remains had gone. April. 1948. Temporary duty. Wright Air Force Base, Dayton, Ohio. And what were they shown? 1995. He confessed to his five sons. They were shown the wreckage from Roswell. And then they were taken to another room. And they were shown the survivor. (1:51:06)

He felt sorry for it. Because he felt that they were treating it unfairly. And that they had it in captivity. And that the information he had was that it died shortly thereafter. But he confessed to the survivor. He confessed to Roswell. And he wasn't there at the base in 47. He's seeing it from the other end. Wright Patterson. Where everything had been transported from Roswell. I'm going to skip Loveridge. Loveridge used to report to President Harry Truman on UFOs. And before he died, he confessed to Roswell. That he and the President, President Truman, would talk about Roswell. That's General Lawrence Conway. He was part of the U-2... squadron at Wright-Patt. U-2 spy planes. (1:52:09)

He was a lieutenant colonel at Roswell in 1947. And as soon as he became a general and was assigned to the Pentagon, first thing he looked into was Roswell. He wanted to see the Roswell files. He never did find them. But before he died, he confessed to his wife... that Roswell was an E.T. ship... with a crew... and a survivor. Base commander at Roswell, Colonel William Blanchard... for making such a terrible blunder... claiming that a weather balloon... was nothing more than... a flying saucer. (1:52:58)

Making such an outlandish mistake. He was so highly reprimanded... that he went on to become a four-star general by the age of 50. In other words, he was promoted for it. Because the cover-up worked. The balloon cover-up story worked. I mentioned that he told Barry Goldwater... all about Roswell in the early 60s. He mentioned to the former mayor, Thomas Brainerd... at Roswell when he was asked... at a celebration commemorating all the former base commanders at Roswell. General, tell us about 1947. What really happened? (1:53:45)

And Brainerd said that all Blanchard said was... that was the damnedest stuff... referencing the wreckage. Chester Lytle, pictured to your left... the oldest living hemophiliac in America... until he died about 15 years ago... lived to the age of 92. He was at Wright-Patt... when all the wreckage and bodies were there. He too told us what he had seen... what he had experienced. And then... I'm pictured with Lytle... and then... Nathan Twining Jr. How many know who General Nathan Twining was? (1:54:35)

And the letter that he wrote... where he stated... the phenomenon is real. Flying saucers are real. And that was in September of 1947... just two months after Roswell. His son... a concert pianist... plays with the London Philharmonic. And what his father told him about Roswell... all before he died. So again... the high-ranking... family members, officers... civilians who were involved... You know what Lytle is most famous for? (1:55:18)

Excuse me. (1:55:20)

Invented the detonator of the atomic bomb... the radio detonator at Motorola in Chicago. His... You know what a GS rating is for civilians? That's the military equivalent as far as an officer's status. His was a GS-16. In other words, as a civilian he had the rank of a high general. And yet... he told us all about Roswell. First Lieutenant Walter Hott was the public information officer... back in 1947. We could never get him to talk... until he finally agreed... to write a sealed statement for posthumous release. (1:56:11)

Everything that he had secretly, privately conveyed to us... we compiled and we wrote out. And then he signed it. It was released to us after he passed away... where he admitted seeing the wreckage... handling the wreckage... the craft, the bodies. There he is pictured with Blanchard. There's Walter. Again, headquarters 509th. That's Miriam Bush. She was secretary to the base hospital administrator... Colonel Harold Stock. The personnel at the hospital who we had tracked down... all described to us that they were told not to report for duty. (1:57:00)

Strange outside doctors and nurses... who they had never worked with before... arrived at the hospital. And Stock would grab her and say, I want to show you something. And he took her into the operating room. And her first reaction was, my God... they're children. Because she saw them on their sheets. And then she saw one move. And then she saw the eyes and she realized... oh my God, it's true. (1:57:30)

It is true. All the rumors, it's true. And that evening at dinner... when she broke down... and she raced to her room... and her father went and then tried to console her. Her father was a local doctor. And he was so upset that they would burden her with that knowledge... that they showed her what they did. It affected her for the rest of her life. (1:57:55)

Forty years later... she checks into a motel... after she was described by her sister-in-law, Pat... pictured to her left, your right... that she was becoming more and more paranoid. She felt she was being watched... listened to wherever she went. She checks into a hotel... a small town outside of Los Angeles. Next morning they find her... with a plastic bag wrapped around her neck... her arms and her wrists all scratched and bruised. (1:58:31)

And the police department rules it a suicide. The family to this day doesn't believe it was a suicide. Most of you have heard the story of the mortician, Glenn Dennis. Most of you don't know that we identified the nurse... even though he provided us with the wrong name. And the reason he gave us the wrong name was... he was having an affair with her... back in 1947. But everything he described was correct. (1:59:06)

Looked like a young Audrey Hepburn... black hair, black eyes. She had been transferred to England... immediately after the incident. And then she died shortly thereafter. He was told in a plane crash... but she had just actually died of natural causes... childhood illness. (1:59:25)

But nonetheless, she was gone. Her name was Adeline Fatton. She was stationed at the base in Roswell in 1947. So there was a nurse. There were phone calls... about the availability of child-sized caskets... at the base. We even tracked down... the gentleman who drove the truck... up to Amarillo, Texas... and his son... who went to pick up the child-sized caskets... that were needed at the base. (1:59:59)

I can assure you there were no children... working on the base at that time. But then, how were the bodies described? They weren't called spacemen. They weren't called alien. They weren't called ETs. They were called little men. The little people. But as one of the personnel at Roswell... when he was asked... when we did the segment with CBS 48 Hours... with reporter Phil Jones... well, how do you know they weren't from here? (2:00:32)

(transcript 3of3) (Don Schmitt lecture at 2019.)

To which he responded... they sure weren't from Texas. That's the sketch that Glenn Dennis provided... based on what the nurse had described to him. And then we found another nurse... who worked at St. Mary's Hospital. Her name was Mary Lowe. And she had confessed to her best friend... that her and a number of other nurses... were rushed from St. Mary's... to attend to a top security situation... at the base hospital. (2:01:16)

And she saw something that still gave her nightmares. She saw the bodies. So we tracked her down. And the first reaction she gave us was... did Glenn Dennis... Glenn Dennis the mortician... at the Ballard Funeral Home... did Glenn Dennis tell you about me? And it was like... no, not at all. We heard about you through another source. Well, I have nothing to say. (2:01:47)

I wasn't involved. Don't ask me anything. But guess who she called up right after we left? Glenn Dennis. And accused him of breaking his promise... that he would never reveal her involvement. But again, I emphasize... Glenn Dennis did not inform us on Mary Lowe. But nonetheless, she made the accusation. And clearly demonstrated that she knew much more. It was enough that she made Glenn Dennis promise... never to reveal her involvement. (2:02:25)

Another nurse. The base hospital... you see that it was just one level. That was just one wing that was still there... when we started our investigation. It actually was a series of wings... and then connected by corridors. Eleazar Benavidez. He was with the 390th Air Squadron. He had just finished his duty... and they were assigned to the big hangar. They were told to take a number of gurneys... that were covered in sheets... immediately over to the base hospital. (2:03:08)

And... as they were loading them into the back of an ambulance truck... one of the men stepped on a sheet... it pulled free. Eleazar was standing right there... and he was eye to eye... with one of the bodies. And then the eyes opened. According to his late wife... Eleazar is still alive... 94 years old. According to his wife... they did not sleep in the same bedroom... for over 40 years... because Eleazar would constantly bolt up... in the middle of the night... scream out... because he couldn't get the face out of his memory. (2:03:57)

It still so affected him... that he could never sleep... entirely through the night. (2:04:05)

And so they split up. They remained married certainly... but separate rooms. First time we talked to Eleazar... he would barely say a word to us. It took us two years to get him to talk. And when he finally opened up... he bawled. He cried... so loud... that he couldn't even talk. And then he recounted what had happened... what he had seen. It so affected... so impacted him... for a lifetime. (2:04:39)

There he is with another. That was his sketch. Child of the Earth. Or at least that was the best way... they could describe it back then. I'm jumping... I'm going to see what's... We're going to end on this... and then go to some questions and answers if you like. I'm often accused of... not having high-ranking officers. I have... General Kenner Hertford... two-star General... who said Roswell happened. (2:05:36)

I have General... one-star Brigadier General... Thomas DeBose... swore an affidavit saying the balloon... was a hoax. They were the ones who switched the balloon... for the real material in General Ramey's office. I have General... Richard Mitchell at the Pentagon... who said Roswell happened. And we have General Arthur Exxon... former base commander... at Wright-Patterson Airfield in Dayton, Ohio... who in 1947... was at the Foreign Technology Division... as a lieutenant colonel... when the wreckage from Roswell came in for testing. (2:06:17)

And he described how... at first... the labs... the men working in the labs... thought the material had to be Russian... because they had never seen anything like it before. But then... after all the tensile... the strength testing... the pressure testing... everything they could do... to determine... the fracture point of this wreckage... he said it was of unanimous consensus... that the materials were from space. (2:06:50)

They were not from here. And again... another general officer... he would tell us... I could tell the vice president what to do. And that was correct. So again... from the highest officers... to young children. I did a paper a number of years ago... entitled... The Human Response to an Extraordinary Event... where I demonstrated... from the highest officers... to five-year-old children... from the most highly trained... to the most innocent... they reacted identically. (2:07:34)

They behaved exactly the same... at the time of the incident. Total ignorance. Total shock. Surprise. They had no idea what they were dealing with. And I've had doctors tell me... in reading that report... that it convinced them. Because again... the extraordinary response... was... again... extent. It was throughout. It was everyone involved. The amazing thing about all this... Last time... President Bill Clinton was on the Jimmy Kimmel Show. This is all they talked about. (2:08:18)

The president went on and on. I had eight years in the Oval Office... and I couldn't get the truth... about Roswell. Well, what I presented this evening... was the truth based on the eyewitnesses. The people who were there. People who held it in their hands. The people who have had nightmares... for now 72 years... over something... beyond our comprehension. (2:08:47)

And the human arrogance... in thinking that we could just plug it in... and make it work. When we can't bridge that technology. It may be something so... extraordinary... that we'll never figure it out. That's why I still maintain to this day... it's a cover-up of ignorance. They don't know from where... from why... or from who. So they have nothing to announce... at this point. (2:09:14)

Maybe we're going to... now as we're getting a slow trickle... of disclosure. They're testing the waters. The U.S. Navy. Now the Army is also involved. I mean we're truly hoping... that this will all finally come out... and that Roswell will be... then revealed as it is... the biggest story of the millennium. The biggest story never told. The biggest event in the last thousand years. (2:09:47)

Because we came to the realization... that we were not alone. That we were being visited. And... is there anyone here... that if such an announcement... would be made tomorrow... would panic? Would rush out into the street? Is there anyone here... that actually believes... they wouldn't be able to handle it? And that's certainly the case... back in the States. We've grown up with the space program. (2:10:19)

We've grown up with Star Trek... Star Wars. I mean in the States... you can't go anywhere... without the inflatable aliens... at every event. So we've all grown up with it. So anytime you hear someone say... well maybe we're not ready. Well they weren't ready in 1947. It was unprecedented. Aliens were depicted in the movies... and in television at that time... looking like human beings. (2:10:48)

Buck Rogers, Flash Gordon... alien spacecraft were rocket ships. And yet Roswell happens. And there was no panic. There was no mass suicide. All the people involved... raised their families... worked their jobs. They continued going to church. They lived out their lives... and they were there. They saw it first hand. If they could handle it back in 47... we can certainly handle it in 2019. 2020. And that's why I'd like to believe... you're here this evening... because you want to hear. (2:11:29)

You want to learn. You want to be part of this movement. Part of this effort... to finally bring this all out. And realize that... we all need to start getting along... because we just all occupy... one planet of millions... that may be occupied. Inhabited. Every time we do a gala poll in the United States... the majority of Americans believe in UFOs. In fact, they also demonstrate that... the higher the education... the higher the intelligence... the greater the belief. (2:12:08)

So, you're also in good company. Again, I can't thank my hosts... the people who have invited me... between here and Sydney... my first visit to Australia. I certainly hope to come back. I can promise we will have... even more material, more information... more testimony... and hopefully at some point... physical evidence. Because we're going back... and conducting an instrument dig... beginning of December next month... and then next spring. (2:12:48)

Because we will not leave one stone unturned. (2:12:53)

And we are going to prove this. We are going to demonstrate... once and for all. As Dan Rather at CBS News stated... Quote... Truly something extraordinary... crashed outside of Roswell... in July of 1947. And as we've all seen this evening... it was not any type of weather balloon. So I thank my hosts. I look forward to coming back. I thank all of you for being here tonight. (2:13:27)

And once again... welcome to the UFO story. One of the greatest stories of all time. Thank you. So who has the other microphone? So we're going to... First question... I usually say ladies first, so... Good evening. Good evening. To you... According to your knowledge... would you know... so-called alien autopsies... that we've seen... on videos... Yes. It didn't happen. There's... There certainly would have been autopsies. (2:14:44)

In fact, we have two doctors who were involved with autopsies at Wright... Patterson. Again, where the bodies, the remains went. As far as the autopsy... Video. And I say video because there has never been a frame of actual footage released. They talk about leader strip that was tested circa 1947. That's just blank leader strip. That is not actual frames of genuine footage. When the first stills from the video... were presented to us from England... with the... suggestion that we would present them to our witnesses... and see if it was anything that they had seen... they all disqualified it. (2:15:36)

Not a one of them said it was even close. So that was the first time that we just... please do not claim that this is from Roswell. That's why I still... whenever anybody talks about the Roswell alien autopsy... even the promoters immediately drop that. It hasn't been called that by anyone involved. That's by the media. Because again, they are trying to always... create the impression that this hoax... this alien autopsy video... just demonstrates that Roswell can't be believed. (2:16:13)

It's a myth. As Peter Jennings at ABC News would call it. I mean, I've been to England a number of times. I know about the magician who was involved. I know about the circumstances surrounding all of it. And I will only... pass judgment on the fact that... none of my Roswell witnesses... claim anything that resembles that body. So I will leave it at that. (2:16:44)

Okay? So I'll let the people still promoting... the autopsy video... come up with their proof. It's not for me. Yes. I interviewed the late Philip Corso... Colonel Philip Corso on two occasions. I found him... a highly professional, respectable, very congenial... gentleman. Nonetheless... he was repeating what we already had presented in our first book. It's one thing... and it's the same here in Australia. Our governments do not manufacture... anything. A single plane, ship, boat... tank, nothing. (2:17:49)

It's all contracted out to the private sector. And... as a result... we have first-hand witnesses at Battelle Institute... Rand Corporation... General Electric... Hughes Aircraft... Boeing... all describing receiving Roswell wreckage... in an attempt to... test it... reverse engineer it... find out again... what makes it fly, so to speak. (2:18:17)

So Corso wasn't saying anything new in that regard. One of our principal witnesses in the past... a star witness... is the late Frank Kaufman. We proved that Kaufman... who was at the base in 1947... was a fraud. He had forged documents... he had forged sketches... he tried to humanize... the bodies that they looked... almost like children... that the ship... was more of a wing shape... like a flying bat wing. (2:18:49)

So in other words... he tried to make it... appear more and more... like something we were testing. When I asked Corso... because... that first chapter... in the day after Roswell... the summation of Roswell... a summary of what took place... is 100% Frank Kaufman. Now Corso... if he is that... highly involved... why would he have to rely... on a Frank Kaufman... who was not genuine? (2:19:20)

And then when I asked... Bill Burns... who actually wrote the book... Doctor... slash attorney... William Burns... who wrote... the day after Roswell... where did you get... your source material from? He confessed that... they had gone to Roswell... on two occasions... and both times... they stayed... with Frank Kaufman. So... that's why we don't mention Corso... in any of our books. And not that he wasn't... who he said he was... but that he aligned himself... with somebody... who was proven to be a hoax... a fraud... and I'm just... it's just sad to see that... Corso probably just got... caught up in it. (2:20:06)

And... that might explain why he also... the Corso family sued... Burns... William Burns... that the book came out... and I was part of it. So... but... Can I just say one really quick thing about that? Please George. Corso's actual transcript... of his book that he was writing about... his memoirs of what happened... is a completely different book... Yes... than Burns' book. And unpublished... and never seen. (2:20:35)

It's available on... you can get it online... it's a PDF... you can read it... and it's amazing. From his son Phil Junior. But it's the full thing... You're right. And it's essentially what he said. So... you can discredit... you know... what Burns... what Burns said. Right, right. But the actual transcript... that that was based on... So... it's completely different and you can look it up. (2:20:57)

Great suggestion George. So in other words... yeah... it would be under Corso? It's online. I've downloaded it. I actually re-typed... if anybody wants it... you can email me. I re-typed the whole thing... because... it's actually typed in Corso's own... very... not very well written. Yes. So I just re-typed it... got all the typos out of it... so you can read it. It's called Dawn of a New Age. Yeah, that's right. (2:21:24)

And it's actually quite good. It's very different, isn't it? It's beautiful. and that's what we've heard as well. And that's why he said... that he got caught up... in the whole situation with Burns... and that's why... that was one of the reasons they sued Burns... after the book came out. (2:21:38)

He was trying to get the story out. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. So is the technology distribution... Accurate. Totally accurate. As I said... because we already had first-hand witnesses... at all those major corporations. So he was absolutely... absolutely accurate and correct about that. Yes. How about the transistor in the integrated circuit? Is that thought to have come from the UFOs... or was that developed in other... That I would question... because most of that is natural progression. (2:22:09)

I mean, it's possible... but... at least none of our witnesses... mentioned specifically... like a microchip... or anything as far as dealing... as far as with computers. The only thing that we come close to... is the fiber optics... and the attempt at creating memory material. Right? Patterson contracted Battelle Institute... within months after Roswell. We've seen the progress report... and then the original assignment... which was the development of... self-healing metal. (2:22:49)

Well, what does that sound like? It sounds like memory material, doesn't it? And to see it right in the report... from right path to Battelle... self-healing metal. Who else? Roman, right? Yeah, Roman. Thanks for a very comprehensive talk. Thank you. I've got two questions. One is... if the material was as impervious... and as resilient as you say... why did it smash into... Break up, yeah. (2:23:28)

And my second question is... when... I think his name was Admiral Tom Wilson... who was then Joint Chiefs of Staff... wanted to be read into... a secret project. He was told by the contractor... which was a private company... that he doesn't have a need to know. Is it possible that private contractors... are being used as a kind of... as a kind of camouflage... so they're impervious to freedom of information... and so forth... and that the military perhaps doesn't know them? (2:24:05)

Both good questions. The first one... just... think back to 1947... and the type of metals... alloys... compounds we had back then... 1947. Is it safe to say that... if we were at this level in 47... that today in 2019... we might be up here? We're constantly improving... as far as on the weight... the strength... the compounds... the alloys that are used... we're combining as far as different elements... so... our materials are getting stronger... lighter... then... so we see a progression. (2:24:52)

Anything that is manufactured... has to be malleable... at a certain point. If you can put it together, you can also take it apart. And... every... alloy... every... material... has a fracture point... at a certain level. Where ours in 47 was down here... today it's up here. If we're dealing...we're talking... I mean... solely about something advanced... theirs might be up here. But nonetheless, it still has a fracture point. (2:25:28)

And whatever happened... at that time... reached that limit. It surpassed that fracture point... causing it to break up. That's why I say... nearly indestructible. Point being... nonetheless... it still reached... that stress point. Okay? As far as... your second question. Repeat... because you mentioned... because I was going to mention something else about... Bush. Right. Right. Right. A contractor that was working on a secret project... and the contractor said... you don't have a need to know Admiral... and he was the Joint Chiefs of Staff... and he was horrified. (2:26:22)

Chairman... is it possible that... in fact the military knew back then... but don't know anymore... and that... Bingo. Bingo. When we're asked today... where's the evidence? (2:26:37)

Where's the wreckage? Where's the physical proof? The military doesn't have it. The government doesn't have it. It's all in the private corporations right now. They're the... they have the biggest lobbyists. They get all the big military contracts. They're the ones who were assigned... to reverse engineer the material to begin with. And we all... or we should remember when... Dwight Eisenhower... was leaving the presidency... and he warned all of us... about... the increasing power... of the industrial military complex. (2:27:18)

In other words, the concern... that the corporations were taking over... the world. And one of the things that we're convinced empowered them... was the material from Roswell. So... that's why we're now... we're focusing more and more... on the corporations. And we're getting some of them to talk more and more. And we're confident... that because... and you are correct, Roman... that they're not beholding... to the Freedom of Information Act... that type of thing. (2:27:47)

But they're also... they also are not under... government restrictions... security oaths... as the government and military would be. So, we're looking more and more for the Ben Riches... and others that... Richard Branson's and Robert Bigelow's... and the Joe Firmages... who have been involved in such projects... and now to get them to talk. So, wish us well. Yes. What does this historical event... tell us about the bigger picture... regarding the Eastern Terrestrial Presence? (2:28:31)

My late scientific director... Dr. J. Allen Hynek... who... eventually came around... from a skeptic to where... last time I had dinner with him... he pounded his fist on the table... and he went, Don... it's smacking more and more... of nuts and bolts. And as I say... I want to be able to go across the street... and kick the tires. I want to feel it... see it... know that it is the genuine article. (2:29:09)

I don't want to deal with the... philosophical... the speculation... the theory. I want to hold it in my hands. And Hynek... would use the example... What's the nearest star system... to our own Earth? Alpha Centauri. 4.3 light years away. Nearest star system... 4.3 light years. And Hynek... would use the example... of not the width... but the thickness... the thickness of a single playing card... from a deck of cards. (2:29:43)

Equaling... the distance from the Earth... to the Moon. Which took us three days to get to... with the Apollo program. One playing card... Earth to the Moon. How many playing cards... to equal the distance... the Earth... to Alpha Centauri? 19 miles... of playing cards. Incomprehensible... unbelievable... impossible... by our standards... by our standards. And yet... with my colleagues... we often talk about... parallel universes... we talk about... interdimensional travel... we talk about... even time travel. (2:30:31)

And so that's why... I can't... and I don't limit it... strictly to... E.T. visitation. We still don't even know... that for a fact. When I say... off the Earth... I mean we're talking again... a technology that is... beyond our own. (2:30:49)

But even time travel... would still be advanced. It would be us coming... back to us now. So we explore all those... but again... all we can do is... fantasize... theorize... and until we prove... beyond a shadow of a doubt. I don't... really care... what... the final... nature of the phenomenon is. I'm still trying... as Heineck would say... we're trying to prove... the realities of a phenomenon. (2:31:27)

And it's really that simple. I have colleagues such as... Dr. Donald Burleson... who are investigating... specifically... the connection with Marilyn Monroe... and John F. Kennedy... and... Roswell. And the fact that... the afternoon that Marilyn Monroe... was found dead... she had placed a call... to a reporter in Mexico City... who came forward... after... and said that... she told him... that she had a story... that would rock the world. (2:32:13)

And she was fearful for her life... that if it ever got out. Now... does anybody here believe that an affair... with the President of the United States... would rock the world? No. No. A lot of people would go... shouldn't have done it... or you know... that's a disgrace... or... but... those were the words he used. So that's why many... have now speculated... Paul Davis... who was the executive producer... of the Roswell movie. (2:32:44)

He did a whole DVD on Marilyn... and the connection... with Roswell and UFOs. Again... in connection with the Kennedys... John F. Kennedy. And then there are people... in the States... writers who speculate... that the reason... or one of the reasons... that Kennedy was assassinated... was because he was going to also... release... information... on UFOs. I will say this... this much I do know. (2:33:12)

A good friend of mine... the late doctor... how many ever heard of the... Cash Landrum UFO incident? Yeah. Which wasn't a UFO. Had nothing... Dr. Peter Rank... who... tested... the woman... and then the older woman... and her grandson. Betty Cash... Vicky and Colby Landrum... said... it was a very dirty radiation. It was very primitive. This... triangular shaped craft... that was spewing flame... down to the pavement... and they were... all exposed... and by the time they got home... their hair was already falling out... their nails were coming out... that type of thing. (2:33:57)

Dirty radiation... from the object. But anyway... Rank had been... a flight surgeon... with the U.S. Navy... in Washington. In 1961. And his assignment was... to... brief... debrief... all the pilots... the Navy pilots... who had had... UFO encounters. Who had been scrambled... on unknowns. And Rank... knew... personally... that John F. Kennedy... had appointed... Vice President Lyndon Johnson... to a special UFO... oversight group. We haven't been able... to document... prove that. (2:34:35)

But I believed... and I trusted... and I worked long enough... with Dr. Rank... I have no reason to doubt... that... then... such a thing... happened. And if Kennedy... is appointing his VP... to such a project... it's because again... something was going on. It was a lot more... than just Project Blue Book... at that time. (2:34:54)

So... and again... the rest is history. I... just... as a quick segue... with Kennedy... for those of us in the States... who were alive at that time... just as... for those of you... who were alive... at 9-11... over in the States... we will forever remember... exactly... where we were... and what we were doing... and what we thought... when that news broke. The President has been shot. (2:35:25)

The Twin Towers have been... you know... struck... that type of thing. And the point being... we will remember... for a lifetime... but we weren't there. I wasn't in New York. I wasn't in Dealey Plaza in Dallas. But I will forever remember. And I suggest that the witnesses at Roswell... who again... held it in their hands... should ever... forget. Ever... have their memories fade... about what actually happened. (2:35:55)

They're just as vivid... just as precise... as though it happened yesterday. And that's why I cite these examples... whenever the skeptics say... well, you can't trust anyone's memory after 50. That's an Air Force comment. You can't trust anyone's memory after 50. And the person I was talking to... was 72. And then I said... well, I sure don't trust you. Double standards. And again... they sadly... half the people in the world... as I've been talking to George... and James... and Ben... over the last couple of days... if the United States government... were to announce tomorrow... that it is all true... half the people still wouldn't believe it. (2:36:37)

For one simple reason... they can't... they won't... they refuse... anything but extraterrestrial. I'm sorry, do you think... have you finished answering the question? I think so. Just a couple more... we've got to wrap up. Well, I want to end... because I still have people... I want to... talk... I have some... things are still signed... so... Thanks, Don. I hope you enjoyed Melbourne... Oh, absolutely. (2:37:26)

Lots of questions... further digging into this topic... Thank you. Good seeing you. Thank you. Just wanted to keep it... just two very quick questions... I hope you can answer. To your knowledge... what became of the... survivor of the crash? And is that the entity that was... later labeled... EBE-1? And have you ever met... Bob Bigelow and... is that... if you haven't... is that likely at some point? (2:37:52)

Because I think he would be a great... gateway to what the... fire industry... is aware of. The last account we have... of the survivor... is... Colonel... Marion McGruder... in April of 1948. Beyond that is... 100% rumor... nothing as far as that... we've ever heard... or seen... that would demonstrate. Thank you. Anything happened beyond that... McGruder told his sons... before he died... that it was their information... that the survivor had died... shortly thereafter. (2:38:29)

But then it doesn't account... for other possible recoveries... other crashes. If I accept Roswell... then I have to accept... all other possibilities. So there may have been... other survivors... from other incidents... which then may have... generated... you know... the talk of EVA-1... EVA-2... that type of thing... extraterrestrial biological entity. (2:38:48)

As far as Bigelow... of the president... of Bigelow Aerospace... in Las Vegas... I always joke that... I knew Bob Bigelow... when he was merely... a multi-millionaire. Bigelow was very supportive... of us... originally... on Roswell. And then... that's the problem... with the... entrepreneurs... that would step forward... and provide... special funding. Then everybody else... lines up as well. And he was just... overwhelmed to the point... that then nobody's... getting anything. (2:39:26)

And... again... human nature... but... the situation... presently... as far as... with the Academy... to the stars... and with Bigelow... but you notice... that Bigelow... is strangely silent... in all this. Well, he has... the man... Mars... mission... with NASA. He's got... two big contracts... with NASA... and probably even more. So, don't expect to... really... hear or see anything... from Bigelow... as long as... he wants to stay... on the government dole... in that regard. (2:39:58)

So... Thanks, Don. Thank you. Just two... two queries, I guess. The first one is... you mentioned... there were a couple of witnesses... that had... observed... the... surviving alien... and seen the eyes blink... and such. And I can't remember... if they were... second-hand witnesses... or first-hand. No, first-hand. Did any of them... this... did any of them... speak about... whether or not... there was any form... of communication... between... themselves... and the surviving alien... in any way? (2:40:38)

Not obviously... not verbal... but... Yes, telepathic. Telepathic. And that's... that's the first one. And the second one was... obviously... from an evidential perspective... if you found... a bit of that material... then all of those... 600 witnesses... those that have spoken... about the memory... the memory material... that gives great credibility... in fact... The ultimate credibility. Yeah, yeah. It just... opens the whole thing up. (2:41:02)

Right. You can't deny it anymore... because you've got physical evidence. Precisely. So good luck with... trying to find that. Thank you. Thank you. Truly. Thank you. Well, I can tell... I'm tired. Your... your first question... was about... the surviving alien... survivor... and... Telepathy. Telepathy. And... I usually... because... I don't want to lose... people. Because the moment... you start talking about... like ESP... and telepathy... and psychic phenomena... you can lose a lot of... people. They start... they can become skeptical. (2:41:38)

But the... the fire... the crew chief... Dan Dwyer... felt that... there was some... attempt... as far as... mind communication... telepathic communication... that he felt sorry... for... the survivor that he saw. And... the impression he had was... don't... feel... or don't... don't have any feelings towards me... because there's nothing more that can be done. And that made him feel even sadder. Next year at our museum in Roswell... we're creating a full-scale diorama of the crash site... the ship... the bodies... the actual terrain. (2:42:30)

You will be there. We're going to take you back to the 1947 incident. And then... we're going to have a holographic figure of the survivor. And with the technology... and that's why we're still working... we want it to be interactive... that a... six-year-old child can walk up to it... and smile... and it'll smile back... wave... and it would even wave back... that type of thing. (2:42:58)

But... in working with Mike Hill... in Hollywood... he does all the prospectus... prosthetics... as far as... all the movies. (2:43:10)

Just amazing what he does. They are as human... I mean... they look as real as the person itself. And he does that. And... to this day... we do not have an accurate portrayal of the ship... or the bodies... at the museum. Lest we would potentially... coach... lead... contaminate... any witnesses. That's why anybody... comes to us... describes one of the things in the museum... we know they're not genuine. (2:43:40)

They... it's not that they fell for it... it's just that... we're not going to lead people... into describing something... until we're ready. Well, now we are. The final ones are passing on... and... because none of the witnesses... describe the bodies as being anything horrible... horrendous... monstrous... scary... and they all generally describe them as being very innocent... childlike. We wanted to capture that look. (2:44:08)

We wanted to... for all the composites... everything we've done... as far as what the witness is... and it's taken us five years... just working... and... and sculpture... after sculpture... after sculpture... after sculpture... and we finally have it. It's a type of... it's... it's... it's... it's... it's... again... fully approved by the witnesses... this is what we saw. And the thought being... that it could come walking into the room right now... and we'd want to get up... and actually confront it... and maybe shake its hand. (2:44:36)

It'd be nothing... in the least... threatening... frightening... and we finally have captured that. And I'm very proud of the fact... after five years... we have that. And that's what we're going to have... the holographic figure of... at the museum. So... exciting things... many big things... that are still yet to come. I should announce too... we just signed the contracts... with the channel... the history channel. (2:45:01)

We have a six-part series... on the Roswell families... that we start shooting... oh boy... right when I get home... from Australia... but... I'll be there. So... one more. Yes, Colin. Oh... very good. We're not going to get any help... from the government here anyway... for... yeah, for... I'm saying... we're going to be landing... a craft that... that has landed... locally. And... how long... you're talking 70 years... likely we're talking... just over 50 years... what could potentially be found... Yes. Of course. (2:46:10)

In the case of Roswell... we're still... looking for... physical artifacts... and in the five... archaeological digs... using both... subterranean radar... and electromagnetic... spectrometry... spectrology... we've used... certainly a lot of... metal detection. Night folks. Thank you. And... one of the things... that the witnesses... described... repeatedly... was a furrow... a gouge... where something had... impacted... and skipped... about 10 foot wide... inches... deep... for hundreds of feet... long filled over... by the... prevailing winds... the rain erosion... that type of thing... and so... when we did the dig in 2002... sponsored by the Sci-Fi Channel... and we had... the back hole... shovel... the tractor... dig perpendicularly... as far as from... the gouge area... that we had flagged... there it was... right below the surface... the symmetrical V... just where the witnesses said it was... the symmetrical V... was no burrow... it wasn't... I mean there's... and there's... absolutely no documentation... evidence of anything else... crashing out there... and there it was... so... we also... with infrared... at that... level... that spectrum... level... the area is much brighter... unlike the surrounding area... the phosphorus level... is also... much lower... suggesting that... we believe... in attempting to decontaminate the site back in 47... they poured barrels of bleach... over the site... which would explain why the cattle wouldn't feed on it... for the next five years... so... even here... there are still... all types of tests... now you are correct... one of the problems we certainly have in the states is... you cannot trust any of the national laboratories... because they're all government-contracted... we've learned the hard way... don't ever leave anything in their presence unwatched... because you'll never see it again... but soil analysis... against the control... the surrounding area... you determine like the phosphorus... and the... as far as potassium levels... that type of thing... and if you can demonstrate at least an alteration... you demonstrate that something changed the terrain... either on the surface or beneath the surface to a certain depth... and if you can do that... then you have a scientific... as far as... proof that something altered... because then you have to ask... what caused it... and that's even over that time span... what... you're talking 70 years... likely we're 50-something years... yeah, it's still possible to find... indications like that... because likely... we had... West High, he's talking about, yeah... it was reported... yeah, look... it was only seen that... you know, like... it was like micro-cameras or metal detectors... that were actually sighted... we never sighted any other... equipment... that was... probably burnt... but once again... before... access was permitted back into the area... the area was burnt and destroyed. (2:49:51)

And that's also... one of the techniques they'll use at times... they'll just do a controlled burn... essentially just to... detoxify... the site... or... alter it to a point that... even all the surrounding area is also changed... so there is no control... so... they play that game... they really do... and... and... yes, Irene... foreign bacteria... oh... and you make a good point, Irene... as far as... a lot of the men... for example, who were... as I described... on their hands and knees... picking up the wreckage... they felt like... I mean, they were... they were afraid... they felt they were handling something... that was contaminated... that wasn't from here... they knew it wasn't from here... and they were... in fact... Lieutenant Chester Barton... described to us that... each time they reported back to the base... they had a first report to the base hospital... to be tested... to be checked out... there was a... a guard... he was the tallest man on the base... in fact, there's a picture of him in the yearbook... the tallest... and then next to the shortest... well, anyway... he returned home... after he'd been out at... one of the sites... during the recovery operation... and... when he returned home... his wife observed... that he kept taking shower... after shower... after shower... and then he came out... to sit down for dinner... and he was wearing... cannabis gloves... and then she went into the bathroom... and she picked up... and she was like... oh my God... they had to burn his fatigues... so then she figured out... well... the story of the bodies must be true... and that's where he was... he was... you know... involved as far as the recovery... of the bodies... so... yeah... one can only imagine... and I always joke... the Army Field Manual at that time... there wasn't a... you know... chapter on crashed UFO... and then what the response... and retrieval... you know... conditions were to be... they were... playing this all by ear... they were just going through the motions... and the biggest... obstacle they had... was containing it... and covering it up... to give them breathing room... to have time to get a handle on it... and... and they had the Soviet spies breathing down their necks in New Mexico at that time... I'm going to end on this... because we... I'm getting tired myself... and I have an early flight tomorrow. (2:52:49)

In 1988... Pravda... the state-run newspaper in Moscow... released a report... that... Joseph Stalin... the president... the premier of Russia... Soviet Union... in 1947... didn't believe the balloon story... he was convinced there was something else... because... after all... they had just detonated the atomic bomb there just two years earlier... had to be something just as big... so... in the report... his... scientists reported back to him... in September... two months after Roswell... with the report that... it did not... it was not of American design... and did not appear to be an immediate threat... but they suggested a top priority investigation... by their academy... so then it listed all the academy of science... scientists who were then to investigate Roswell... and report back to him... by the end of that year... so it named all those names... wouldn't we love to see that report... well that's why I was in Moscow last year at this time... because I'm working with their military... and I'm working with one of their cosmonauts... and we're gonna see what we can do... just like I want the Vatican file from July of 1947... because I'm convinced that... and I talked to Father Robert Spitzer... who is head of the Magic Guild in Los Angeles... he's the lead Jesuit scientist in the Catholic Church... he answers directly to the Pope... and I met with him for a half hour in Los Angeles a few years ago... so I have a promise from him... because I'm convinced that the moment Truman got the word... about New Mexico about Roswell... one of the first people he would have called... would have been Pope Pius XIII... to ask what does the church know about this... I want, I need to know... so I want that file as well... so we are far from done on Roswell ladies and gentlemen... so if anybody has any other suggestions... but I especially want you to be supportive and involved... and for the continuing investigation of West Hall... because that is your Roswell... that is where as far as I personally feel... you could still break this wide open... because there are still hundreds of witnesses out there... who haven't been interviewed, haven't been found... so I applaud all of you for being here... for staying all this time... and I look forward to seeing you all the next time... and anytime you come to the States... please let us know... and we will give you red carpet at the museum in Roswell... so I thank you. (2:55:55)

Thank you. (2:56:01)

コメント1​

破壊不能: 「切ることも、燃やすこともできなかった」うえ、「弾丸でさえ貫通しなかった」とされています (0:29:20-0:29:30)。基地の技術者たちは、直径約4フィートの大きな破片を16ポンドの大型ハンマーで叩いても、ハンマーが跳ね返り、「傷一つつけられなかった」と証言しています (0:29:30-0:29:48)。

...

  • 破壊された理由: これらの素材は非常に頑丈であったが、それでも破壊されたのは、どのような素材にも「破壊点」が存在し、墜落時の衝撃がその限界を超えたためであると説明されています (2:25:28-2:25:45)。

という 証言＋推測 と、

1947年7月上旬（事件後数日以内）:墜落現場からさらに25マイル離れた場所で、もう1つの墜落地点が発見される。そこではカプセル状の物体、2体の遺体、そして生存者が1体回収される。

は互いに矛盾している。

コメント2​

放射線被ばくの証言: 現場で残骸の回収にあたった兵士たちは、自分たちが汚染されたものを扱っていると感じていました。彼らは基地に戻るたびに基地病院で検査を受けました。ある兵士の妻は、夫がシャワーを繰り返し浴び、食事中もキャンバス手袋を着用していたことを証言しています。また、夫の軍服を燃やす必要があったことから、遺体の話が真実であると確信したと述べています (2:49:51-2:52:49)。

と

チェスター・バートン中尉 (Lieutenant Chester Barton): 回収作業に携わった隊員。回収部隊が基地病院で定期的に検査を受け、作業服を焼却していたと証言。彼の妻も、夫がシャワーを浴び続け、疲労を焼却するのを見て、遺体の話が真実であると確信した。

の話から、次のような仮説が考えられる。

  • Roswell 事件で墜落したのは UFO ではなく、核関連の極秘装置。

  • 当時、Roswell には米軍の唯一の核戦略部隊があった。それゆえ、ソ連のスパイ網が基地の動向を注視していた。

  • そのソ連のスパイ網の目を逸らすために「UFO を回収した」という偽情報を出し、数時間後に撤回することでスパイ網を混乱させた。そして実際に Joseph Stalin も騙しおおせた(*1)。

  • ET の遺体や生き残り、謎の金属薄膜に関する証言は、意図的な情報撹乱だった。

  • Jesse Marsel やその息子の証言(*2)も、愛国心にもとづいた意図的な情報撹乱（or 偽の記憶の想起）。

この仮説だと、

  • 1947-07-06 :

    • 牧場主が回収部品を持ち込む。
    • DoD の将軍がペンタゴンにサンプルをもってこいと指示。
    • 夕方にはワシントン（Pentagon の所在地）にそれが到着。

  • 1947-07-08 : 記者会見で空飛ぶ円盤を回収したと発表。

  • 1947-07-08 : その 5時間後、記者会見で気球だったと訂正。

ref: Don Schmitt : Roswell事件：牧場主が街に持ち込んだサンプルは当日夕方にはペンタゴンに到着。→ その二日後、UFO を回収したと記者会見発表 → その 5時間後、気球だったと訂正 （＋追加） (2022-10-04)

という本来ならありえない時系列（ 2日間の詳細検討の後に発表し、発表の 5時間に訂正）が納得しうる。

そうだとすると、John Alexander の

John Alexander : 米政府は 墜落 UFO や ET の遺体を所有していないし、Roswell で墜落したのは我々の極秘試作機だった筈だ (2024-11-21)

という発言が大枠では正しいことになる。

(*1)​

ソ連は Roswell UFO 墜落事件を本物だと判断していた（書式変換） (2024-10-22)

(*2)​

❏ Jesse Marcel の息子（医師）が Roswell の破片に触った状況を証言 （途中 2） (2023-11-14)

(2025-06-16)